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Re: [extremeperl] Stiffling Innovation

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  • Chris
    Hi Rob, Keep the group going! I value your thoughts and the group input. On making mistakes: I find private mistakes are always easier to confront than public
    Message 1 of 6 , Jul 16, 2006
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      Hi Rob,

      Keep the group going! I value your thoughts and the group input.

      On making mistakes: I find private mistakes are always easier to
      confront than public mistakes.

      This suggests to me that pair-programming will suppress some
      innovation as the activity is necessarily 'public' and risk-taking
      (for example, playing with design and algorithm alternatives) will be
      constrained.

      BTW, amusing (deliberate?) mistake in your posting title: 'Stiffling'
      != 'Stifling'

      - Chris
    • Adam Sroka
      ... I think this is only true when you are relatively new to pairing. Good pairing is not particularly self-conscious. It is true that you may spend less time
      Message 2 of 6 , Jul 17, 2006
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        Chris wrote:
        > Hi Rob,
        >
        > Keep the group going! I value your thoughts and the group input.
        >
        > On making mistakes: I find private mistakes are always easier to
        > confront than public mistakes.
        >
        > This suggests to me that pair-programming will suppress some
        > innovation as the activity is necessarily 'public' and risk-taking
        > (for example, playing with design and algorithm alternatives) will be
        > constrained.
        >
        I think this is only true when you are relatively new to pairing. Good
        pairing is not particularly self-conscious. It is true that you may
        spend less time "exploring alternatives" but the point is to find the
        simplest solution that solves the immediate problem. The simplest isn't
        always the most obvious, but the first attempt should be fairly obvious
        (And if your solution is not simple, that will be obvious too ;-) Later
        you can refactor to a simpler solution when it becomes more obvious. So,
        there shouldn't be much exploring going on. You just have to have
        courage that the solution that emerges will be a good one.

        I think that is why pairing is so much more productive - It isn't about
        stifling innovation, it's about cutting down on a lot of wasted energy.
        Check yourself and see how much time you spend reading email, browsing
        the web, chatting on IM, etc. when you code alone vs. when you pair.

        Where it gets interesting is in the give and take that happens between
        two programmers as they begin to develop a rapport. In some situations
        you will find that you are working with a junior programmer who tends to
        get lost or has habits that need to be corrected. In these cases you do
        have to stiffle [sic] him a little, but it's for his own good (And in
        some cases your own sanity.) Other times you will be working with an
        equal and you will want to give him a little more rope to hang himself
        with. If he goes off on a tangent sometimes it is worthwhile to follow
        him and see where he is going. You may learn something. With a more
        senior person, you may find it best to just let him do whatever he does
        and ask a lot of questions along the way, "Why do you do it that way?"
        Etc. Lots of good stuff about this in the Williams and Kessler book
        (Most of the advice there is pretty good, although what works will vary
        with personalities.)
      • Adrian Howard
        On 17 Jul 2006, at 05:27, Chris wrote: [snip] ... I ve found the opposite to be true. You have more than one person coming up with ideas :-) Adrian
        Message 3 of 6 , Jul 17, 2006
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          On 17 Jul 2006, at 05:27, Chris wrote:
          [snip]
          > On making mistakes: I find private mistakes are always easier to
          > confront than public mistakes.
          >
          > This suggests to me that pair-programming will suppress some
          > innovation as the activity is necessarily 'public' and risk-taking
          > (for example, playing with design and algorithm alternatives) will be
          > constrained.

          I've found the opposite to be true. You have more than one person
          coming up with ideas :-)

          Adrian
        • Matisse Enzer
          Anyone else running Perl under CruiseControl? I wrote an experimental script to produce the XML output that CruiseControl knows how to handle - my toy script
          Message 4 of 6 , Jan 21, 2007
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            Anyone else running Perl under CruiseControl?

            I wrote an experimental script to produce the XML output that
            CruiseControl knows how to handle - my toy script uses
            Test::Harness::Straps and XML::Generator to run perl test files and
            get the sort of XML created by the <junit> ant task.

            There's a copy of the script at:

            http://twoalpha.blogspot.com/2007/01/junit-style-xml-from-perl-test-
            files.html

            -------------------------------------------------------
            Matisse Enzer <matisse@...>
            http://www.matisse.net/ - http://www.eigenstate.net/
          • Damian Bradford
            Nope, but it was something I was interested in, I ll try to find time to take a look at your script. Otherwise, please post your findings, I would be very
            Message 5 of 6 , Jan 22, 2007
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              Nope, but it was something I was interested in, I'll try to find time to
              take a look at your script. Otherwise, please post your findings, I would be
              very interested to hear your experience.
              Regards,
              Damian


              >From: Matisse Enzer <matisse@...>
              >Reply-To: extremeperl@yahoogroups.com
              >To: extremeperl@yahoogroups.com
              >Subject: [extremeperl] Running Perl Tests under CruiseControl
              >Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 22:27:34 -0800
              >
              >Anyone else running Perl under CruiseControl?
              >
              >I wrote an experimental script to produce the XML output that
              >CruiseControl knows how to handle - my toy script uses
              >Test::Harness::Straps and XML::Generator to run perl test files and
              >get the sort of XML created by the <junit> ant task.
              >
              >There's a copy of the script at:
              >
              >http://twoalpha.blogspot.com/2007/01/junit-style-xml-from-perl-test-
              >files.html
              >
              >-------------------------------------------------------
              >Matisse Enzer <matisse@...>
              >http://www.matisse.net/ - http://www.eigenstate.net/
              >
              >
              >
              >

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