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Re: [extremeperl] Better Development Tools for Perl

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  • J Matisse Enzer
    In my contributions to this discussion I am trying to be especially focused on real-world, practical applications of the theories we are discussing, so that s
    Message 1 of 107 , Jun 9, 2005
      In my contributions to this discussion I am trying to be especially
      focused on real-world, practical applications of the theories we are
      discussing, so that's a big context for my posts here.

      On Jun 9, 2005, at 9:50 AM, Adam Turoff wrote:

      > On 6/9/05, J Matisse Enzer <matisse@...> wrote:
      >> On Jun 9, 2005, at 7:56 AM, Adam Turoff wrote:
      >>> I get the point that Rob was trying to make about any task requiring
      >>> looking at 7 +/- 2 lines of code, and keeping ~50 lines of context
      >>> available at any point. If you can code in that style, then IDEs,
      >>> big
      >>> classes, forests of methods and the like just get in your way.
      >>> Method
      >>> auto-completion isn't a productivity boost as much as it's a coping
      >>> strategy.
      >>
      >> So, is it correct to say that you don't think the tools for Perl
      >> require much improvement? That Perl will continue to be a viable
      >> choice
      >> in the marketplace for medium/large projects (not just in theory)
      >> without tools like those available for Java, C#, VB, etc.?
      >
      > My view is that the team, rather than the tools, determines what makes
      > a project viable, regardless of scale.

      I agree that the team is the most important thing in whether or not a
      project is viable.

      In the actual marketplace - in terms of projects that are actually
      paying people to develop software: What is your opinion about the
      prevalence of Perl in the coming years, as compared to Java, C#,
      Python, etc.? Do you think Perl will have the same, greater, or lesser
      "market-share", and why?
      (My view of course is that it will have less, much less, unless the
      tools get much better.)


      >
      >> Also, I'd love to see some example of the kinds of code you are
      >> talking
      >> about - medium/large systems where every tasks is handled in 5-12
      >> lines
      >> of code and where and IDE would only make it harder to maintain. Are
      >> there 2 or 3 open source examples you could point to?
      >
      > Crack open any good book on Lisp, Scheme, Haskell or ML. The way
      > functional programmers write code tends to be very bottom up.

      Can you point to a couple of open source medium/large Perl applications
      that exhibit the 7-12 lines-per-task approach where an IDE would make
      it harder to maintain? It's OK if that is really a theoretical ideal,
      but if there are a couple real-world examples I would really like to
      examine them.

      -Matisse

      -------------------------------------------------------
      Matisse Enzer <matisse@...>
      http://www.matisse.net/ - http://www.eigenstate.net/
      415-225-6703 (work/cellphone)
      415-401-8325 (home)
    • Siegfried Heintze
      Since there was a helpful discussion some time ago on USB keyboards and mice for pair programming that was not specific to perl, I wanted to solicit the group
      Message 107 of 107 , Feb 13, 2006
        Since there was a helpful discussion some time ago on USB keyboards and mice
        for pair programming that was not specific to perl, I wanted to solicit the
        group for information on network software (also not specific to perl).



        I just set up openVPN on my openwrt/WRT54G router for pair programming with
        a headset and skype.



        (1) Can any point me to the documentation on sharing desktops on windows? I
        need to create accounts on Win2003 XP Server. When I created an account
        belonging only to the user group, my partner could not log in. He was
        receiving some error message about not being permitted to log in
        interactively. However, when I added the administrator group (reluctantly)
        to his account, he could log in. Is there a tutorial somewhere on the web
        for creating user accounts in windows for use with remote desktop logins on
        VPNs?



        (2) How do I share my remote desktop setting with a programming pair
        partner?



        (3) What about sharing sessions when I'm booted with linux? I think there is
        a vnc program out there, but I don't know how to use it. I'll need to learn
        how to create accounts and share linux desktops with remote VPN users. Is
        there a tutorial on this?



        (4) Are video cams very helpful for pair programming?



        It seems that this kind of knowledge would be very common for pair
        programmers.



        Thanks,

        Siegfried



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