Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.
 

Re: Fw: [Fateha] Re: That Quote

Expand Messages
  • james tan
    From: Christopher Bobo To: faris osman CC: Sayf Fariis , Tan James
    Message 1 of 1 , Apr 30, 2002
      From: "Christopher Bobo" <cbobo@...>
      To: "faris osman" <frovpt@...>
      CC: "Sayf Fariis" <terence_nunis@...>, "Tan James"
      <tyjfk@...>
      Subject: Re: [WisdomForum] Re: Fw: [Fateha] Re: That Quote
      Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2002 14:34:30 -0700

      Dear Faris:

      You said:
      >>To ask the Arabs to compromise is like asking the French of the Second
      World War to compromise. Instead of asking the Arabs to compromise because
      it is the "way of peace and politics". should not the Israelis be the one to
      do any compromising - like giving back the land they have taken. <<

      I really don't think that comparing the Israelis to the Nazis is a fair
      comparison. Besides that, if that is the way the majority of Palestinians
      feel then they should openly repudiate the Oslo Accords and openly resume
      the war with Israel. If it is the intention of the Palestinians not to
      repudiately openly the Oslo Accords and simultaneously under cover of Oslo
      to pursue a strategy of war, then Sharon is right. The Palestinians are
      insincere when they say that want peace, Arafat cannot be trusted, and
      Israel is simply at war with the Palestinians.

      You asked:
      >>Excuse me ? Do you actually understand what you are writing ? Or did you
      write this in order to justify your position about Jewish claims to
      Palestine ? <<

      No, I'm not kidding, that's the natue of an open democracy. If enough
      people into an area lawfully with different opinions and views from the
      people that his historically occupied the area, and they lawfully vote to
      change the rules and laws, then in a democracy, the majority wins, so long
      as the rights of the minority are protected. That's how peaceful change
      occurs and violent conflict is avoided.

      You said:|
      >>Murder is murder and self-defense is a legal justification - this is
      true. But this apply to the Palestinians than to the Israelis. Afterall, the
      Palestinians are the ones whose homeland is occupied and their fight under
      any definition (except Israeli and American) is self-defense. <<

      No, deliberately and intentionally killing children in their beds is not
      normally regarded as an act of self-defense by any sane, rational and moral
      person.

      Regards,
      Chris




      ----- Original Message -----
      From: faris osman
      Sent: Monday, April 29, 2002 3:25 AM
      To: Christopher Bobo
      Cc: Sayf Fariis; Tan James
      Subject: Re: [WisdomForum] Re: Fw: [Fateha] Re: That Quote


      Dear Chris

      To ask the Arabs to compromise is like asking the French of the Second World
      War to compromise. Instead of asking the Arabs to compromise because it is
      the "way of peace and politics". should not the Israelis be the one to do
      any compromising - like giving back the land they have taken.


      Chris, you also wrote :


      You also said:
      >>To use an analogy - if say Arabs spent millions of (petro) dollars to buy
      lands in Spain and then arranged to have Arabs get Spanish permanent
      residences or even citizenship, settle them in these lands and then on the
      basis of previous Arab ownership of Spain, declared an Arab-Spanish state.
      Do you think this is fair ?<<

      I think Arabs could do this if they did it lawfully, in which case it would
      be fair.


      Excuse me ? Do you actually understand what you are writing ? Or did you
      write this in order to justify your position about Jewish claims to
      Palestine ?

      You also said:
      >>Are you aware Chris that it is easy for Israel to kill a Palestinian ? It
      just said 'It is for my self-defense, for my self-preservation". Those who
      indiscriminately justified the creation of Israel have a role to play in
      every act of Israeli atrocities.<<

      I wouldn't know about this. Of couse, murder is murder and self-defense is
      legal justification.

      Murder is murder and self-defense is a legal justification - this is true.
      But this apply to the Palestinians than to the Israelis. Afterall, the
      Palestinians are the ones whose homeland is occupied and their fight under
      any definition (except Israeli and American) is self-defense.

      Regards

      Faris



      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Christopher Bobo
      To: faris osman
      Cc: Sayf Fariis ; Tan James
      Sent: Monday, April 29, 2002 12:03 PM
      Subject: Re: [WisdomForum] Re: Fw: [Fateha] Re: That Quote



      Dear Faris:
      You asked:
      >>This is my question - why do the Arabs have to compromise ? Do Jewish
      biblical claims and Jewish purchases of lands made it incumbent that the
      Arabs make this compromise ? Does of a community with one thousand years of
      roots have less right to a land that a community which claims it on the
      basis of history and religion ? <<

      Arabs should compromise because compromise is the way of peace and politics.
      As I have said elsewhere, I think people have a right to land that they
      actually own, possess, use and occupy. I do not think that your claim that
      a group of people, absent the actual existence of a nation, has a right to a
      general area of land makes much sense.

      You also said:
      >>To use an analogy - if say Arabs spent millions of (petro) dollars to buy
      lands in Spain and then arranged to have Arabs get Spanish permanent
      residences or even citizenship, settle them in these lands and then on the
      basis of previous Arab ownership of Spain, declared an Arab-Spanish state.
      Do you think this is fair ?<<

      I think Arabs could do this if they did it lawfully, in which case it would
      be fair.

      You also said:
      >>Are you aware Chris that it is easy for Israel to kill a Palestinian ? It
      just said 'It is for my self-defense, for my self-preservation". Those who
      indiscriminately justified the creation of Israel have a role to play in
      every act of Israeli atrocities.<<

      I wouldn't know about this. Of couse, murder is murder and self-defense is
      legal justification.

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: faris osman
      Sent: Friday, April 26, 2002 3:09 AM
      To: Christopher Bobo
      Cc: Sayf Uddeen Fariis @ Terence Kenneth John Nunis; Tan James
      Subject: Re: [WisdomForum] Re: Fw: [Fateha] Re: That Quote

      Dear Chris

      You have said that the Arabs have the right to reject the partition but
      obviously not because you believed that is their right as the indigenous
      population of Palestine (I think we can say that the Arabs are natives right
      ? Afterall they have lived there for over one thousand years....)

      You argued that

      Sometimes people have rights that conflict with other peoples rights.
      Sometimes people have to accept compromises. If you want to be
      uncompromising, that is your absolute right. My point is don't expect
      sympathy when you end up with nothing. And if you willingly, volunatrily
      and joyfully engage in a fight and then get beat up, don't complain about


      This is my question - why do the Arabs have to compromise ? Do Jewish
      biblical claims and Jewish purchases of lands made it incumbent that the
      Arabs make this compromise ? Does of a community with one thousand years of
      roots have less right to a land that a community which claims it on the
      basis of history and religion ?

      To use an analogy - if say Arabs spent millions of (petro) dollars to buy
      lands in Spain and then arranged to have Arabs get Spanish permanent
      residences or even citizenship, settle them in these lands and then on the
      basis of previous Arab ownership of Spain, declared an Arab-Spanish state.
      Do you think this is fair ?

      You see Chris, if the Israelis cannot justified the creation of Israel then
      they cannot justified their killings, maimings and arrests of Palestinians
      in the name of self-defense. Then it would just be acts against a population
      fighting against the occupation of their homeland. Then Israel will be truly
      accountable for its actions and think many times before taking a Palestinian
      life.

      Are you aware Chris that it is easy for Israel to kill a Palestinian ? It
      just said 'It is for my self-defense, for my self-preservation". Those who
      indiscriminately justified the creation of Israel have a role to play in
      every act of Israeli atrocities.

      Regards


      Faris









      _________________________________________________________________
      MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:
      http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
    Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.