Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Sv: [existlist] Success Spell

Expand Messages
  • Bill Harris
    Yes , this is about mindless stupid stuff. Walking back and forth with candles in a transe of hope, or perhaps rolling in angst like a dog in road kill. After
    Message 1 of 8 , Mar 1, 2002
    • 0 Attachment
      Yes , this is about mindless stupid stuff. Walking back and forth with
      candles in a transe of hope, or perhaps rolling in angst like a dog in road
      kill. After you have fed yourself, all your commitment is just so much grist
      for the subatomic mill. I did not read Ayn Rand because the acedemic
      intelligencia all but forbade it. Now they chant politically correct slogans
      and cower in defense of tenure. I think I will read that author if in no
      mood but rebellion. I`m free and Ill do what I want. Maby after we are done
      with rand we will discuss winnie the poo. Maby we will read Mein Kampt and
      get investigated by the government . Perhaps we will discuss the Cassini
      findings regarding the solar wind and the Jovian magnetosphere. "All those
      people that you mentioned, yes I know them, they are all quite lame,I had to
      rearrange their faces and give them all another name. But right now I don`t
      feel so good dont send me no letters, no. Not unless you mail them to me
      from desolation row."
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "jrlyons" <jrlyons@...>
      To: <existlist@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 10:44 PM
      Subject: Re: Sv: [existlist] Success Spell


      > --- In existlist@y..., "Yulian K. Gaard" <ccc61261@v...> wrote:
      > >
      > >
      > > Dear Bill, Dear All ...
      > >
      > > Bill wrote;
      > > "Yulian, Can I use a Posidon medallion, he is my latest god de
      > jure? Bill"
      >
      > Yulian this is a list about Existentialist Philosophy. It is
      > not a philosophy addressed to language puzzles or self
      > indulgent id driven platitudes. Existentialism is philosophy
      > at work in the trenches of life, calling us to immediate
      > awareness, commitment and passionate revery in the fact of the
      > freedom this philosophy has exposed for us. For some here
      > these ideas are new, well, so is life, I would hope that most
      > here would prefer to engage and breathe free. But, what is
      > interesting here is what seems obvious. We should be
      > engaging Husserl Phenomenology, Heidegger's Authenticity,
      > Sartre's Ontology, Camus' The Fall, Kierkegaard's "Becoming
      > A Christian" ~ Nietzche's death of god and the attack on
      > Nihilism. Hannah Arendt, etc. But we're not, we're calling
      > that neurotic little faker with the Remington Rand typewriter,
      > Ayn Rand, a worthwhile read and listening to you talk about
      > your candles with not a thought about Spinoza. You must be
      > laughing your ass off and I don't blame you. Unless you take
      > yourself seriously, unless we take you seriously.
      > >
      > > I'll be cryptic in my answering here, mostly because a direct
      > answer
      > would go against the purpose of most my postings. My answer is; "Can
      > You?"
      > >
      > > Do you believe that walking back and forth is what actually
      > *creates* the changes ? Do you believe that it's the shape, size and
      > form of the item ?
      > >
      > > Look into yourself, Bill, You'll see that you carry the answer to
      > your question there.
      > >
      > > Blessings
      > > Yulian
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Respectfully submitted.
      > >
      > >
      > > " Magic is a way of life. "
      >
      >
      >
      > Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
      > (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)
      >
      > TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
      > existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      >
      >
    • Eduard Alf
      jrlyons, At least Yulian is engaging in some discussion instead of hiding in the shadows. If you want to have a discussion on Husserl et al then why not
      Message 2 of 8 , Mar 1, 2002
      • 0 Attachment
        jrlyons,

        At least Yulian is engaging in some discussion instead of hiding in the
        shadows. If you want to have a discussion on Husserl et al then why not
        propose something. As to old Ayn Rand ... well that is your small opinion
        ...

        eduard
        -----Original Message-----
        From: jrlyons [mailto:jrlyons@...]
        Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 11:44 PM
        To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: Sv: [existlist] Success Spell


        --- In existlist@y..., "Yulian K. Gaard" <ccc61261@v...> wrote:
        >
        >
        > Dear Bill, Dear All ...
        >
        > Bill wrote;
        > "Yulian, Can I use a Posidon medallion, he is my latest god de
        jure? Bill"

        Yulian this is a list about Existentialist Philosophy. It is
        not a philosophy addressed to language puzzles or self
        indulgent id driven platitudes. Existentialism is philosophy
        at work in the trenches of life, calling us to immediate
        awareness, commitment and passionate revery in the fact of the
        freedom this philosophy has exposed for us. For some here
        these ideas are new, well, so is life, I would hope that most
        here would prefer to engage and breathe free. But, what is
        interesting here is what seems obvious. We should be
        engaging Husserl Phenomenology, Heidegger's Authenticity,
        Sartre's Ontology, Camus' The Fall, Kierkegaard's "Becoming
        A Christian" ~ Nietzche's death of god and the attack on
        Nihilism. Hannah Arendt, etc. But we're not, we're calling
        that neurotic little faker with the Remington Rand typewriter,
        Ayn Rand, a worthwhile read and listening to you talk about
        your candles with not a thought about Spinoza. You must be
        laughing your ass off and I don't blame you. Unless you take
        yourself seriously, unless we take you seriously.
        >
        > I'll be cryptic in my answering here, mostly because a direct
        answer
        would go against the purpose of most my postings. My answer is; "Can
        You?"
        >
        > Do you believe that walking back and forth is what actually
        *creates* the changes ? Do you believe that it's the shape, size and
        form of the item ?
        >
        > Look into yourself, Bill, You'll see that you carry the answer to
        your question there.
        >
        > Blessings
        > Yulian
        >
        >
        >
        > Respectfully submitted.
        >
        >
        > " Magic is a way of life. "


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
        ADVERTISEMENT




        Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
        (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

        TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
        existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Eduard Alf
        Yulian, For the record, I appreciate your magic stuff. Not that I am about to go walking between candles [I don t have green and purple candles], but your
        Message 3 of 8 , Mar 1, 2002
        • 0 Attachment
          Yulian,

          For the record, I appreciate your magic stuff. Not that I am about to go
          walking between candles [I don't have green and purple candles], but your
          posts are always interesting and food for thought. Keep up the good work.

          eduard
          -----Original Message-----
          From: Yulian K. Gaard [mailto:ccc61261@...]
          Sent: Friday, March 01, 2002 6:49 AM
          To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Sv: [existlist] Success Spell




          Dear All, Dear James and Joel,

          James wrote;
          "[...] green and blue candle, and some rites, and then u have a influence
          on success. . any experiments and research to demonstrate that such
          manipulation will have a effect on reality? [...]"

          I didnt plan on giving you any scientific proofs, but I will give you just
          one thing to look into, though it covers very little; "Fake Pills" Beliefs
          and Faith is a key.

          Now, I wish for you to go the other way - proove me wrong, that there is
          no holistic connection in the multiverse. That your mind and beliefs have no
          effects on what happens in the world. And no, I wont take that you've walked
          back and forth between candles till your head turned blue for a proof - you
          got exactly what you expected and had your mind filled with while doing
          that, and that was not the focus of your entire mind upon sucess and the
          belief that you'd archieve it.

          Joel wrote;
          "Fall for it and you fall for the trappings, which, of course, are for
          sale. And guess who's selling."

          Please look at the open letter to RavenWolf. There you have your perfect
          example of someone exploiting religion. As for it being a cult; you can
          probably find alot of cults who practice some of the same techniques.

          Blessings
          Yulian

          Ps. Silver RavenWolf is a famous pagan Author, one of those who about half
          call an expert and wonderful, the rest call her watering down and
          exploiting.


          An Open Letter to Silver Ravenwolf
          It's never easy to walk my spiritual path out in the real world; in fact
          it can be downright hazardous at times. A girl can step in a lot of dung
          while out walking, making boots necessary footwear these days. What never
          ceases to amaze me are the cow patties left in the middle of the road by
          other Pagans.

          The latest road hazard comes from a well known Pagan writer with at least
          14 published books to her credit, an elder in her tradition and someone who
          should know better. Silver RavenWolf has announced plans to market what she
          is calling a "Teen Witch Kit"

          I have a lot of gripes with this, some of which come under personal
          standards and therefore won't be explored in depth here. Like the fact that
          every teenage girl in America is not wearing belly shirts like all of
          Silver's teen girl representatives appear to be. Even so, since I refuse to
          apply for membership to the fashion police we shall move on to the bigger
          issues here.

          Let's begin by stating my own standards on certain things. I do not expect
          everyone to agree with my standards, but I do want to be clear before going
          further. I do not endorse the teaching of minors without full parental
          knowledge and consent, which consent may be withdrawn by those parents at
          any time. My reasons are more fully explained in my Minors and Paganism
          Editorial but to reiterate succinctly, it comes down to respect. I have this
          little thing about respecting the rights of other parents, especially as I
          insist my parental rights be respected. Notice that two-way street thing
          going on, a little "scratch my back and I'll scratch yours" philosophy if
          you will. The freedom to raise my children Pagan is very precious to me, a
          right won by those who have gone before me. It becomes a matter of honor to
          defend that right for other parents of other faiths, including those who
          hold a dim view of me and mine.

          Silver, your work has been taking a disturbing turn lately, edging more
          and more towards targeting minors. The "Teen Witch Kit" cannot possibly be
          categorized as anything but a blatant sellout, not only of the Pagan
          community but also of your own spirituality. Let's be honest here, your
          target market group does not consist of Pagan teenagers. Children raised
          Pagan aren't the least bit tempted by this latest offering. Their parents
          give them all the tools they think they can handle at the proper time. This
          is an important point you know. You are selling blind, never knowing if the
          kid who buys your kit is truly ready to utilize magick in a proper and
          responsible way. Any kid with babysitting money and a ride down to the local
          bookstore can get their hands on this. If you believe that magick works, and
          I'm going to assume that you do, how do you justify handing the magickal
          equivalent of a loaded gun to a 13 year old when you have no idea if they
          have had the experience and maturity to handle it properly? I have a 13 year
          old daughter and I showed her your press release and slick promo ad. She
          knows you are a Witch who has published 14 books, and read your bio. This is
          what she said in response to the question, "Do you think this is ok for the
          kids in your grade at your school?"

          "If you give this to the kids I go to school with, there will be a few
          mature ones who could learn to understand the responsibility involved, but
          most kids will abuse it. I can see kids using this to their own advantage,
          without any consideration or respect for other kids. I see a lot of
          irresponsibility and disrespect in my peers, in homework, friendships and
          their attitude to teachers and other grownups." Upon further pondering she
          added, "A lot of them wouldn't understand it because they don't have any
          background or information about magick or Paganism. About half the kids
          would be willing to try it anyway and if it did work they would abuse it to
          the point that basically everyone around them would be under some kind of
          spell, and a lot of it wouldn't be nice." I asked her what percentage she
          felt might be responsible with something like this; she felt an honest
          assessment was around 2%. She also pointed out that the kit shouldn't have
          the word "Witch" on the cover since it really was about magick and had
          nothing to do with religion.

          Her last point happens to be a very good one. Nothing in the kit bears any
          resemblance to anything spiritual. It is a toolbox designed to get a kid
          whatever he or she wants, and assumes that any child that this slick
          marketing plan reaches will be able to handle the responsibility and
          temptation to go further then they should. Had you titled it the "Teen
          Magician Kit" perhaps it would more accurately reflect the contents. The
          word Witch denotes a spiritual path that may or may not include the use of
          magick. However, as is often said by those who term themselves Witches, the
          use of magick does not make one a Witch.

          Another aspect of all this, and probably what has so many people I know up
          in arms, is your attitude towards all of this. I took a short cruise by your
          website Silver, (www.silverravenwolf.com) Under new releases, down at the
          bottom of one page, I found the following:

          "Call 1-800-THE MOON to place your order, or bug, bother and pester your
          neighborhood book store till they can't stand it anymore. Oh, and for the
          adults that don't like this statement? Maybe you don't care about their
          future, but I do."

          You take an awful lot upon yourself Silver RavenWolf. First you urge kids
          to make pests of themselves in pursuit of your products, and then you state
          outright that anyone who disagrees with the "Be a brat to get what you want"
          approach just doesn't care about kids. Is this the "New Generation of
          Witches" you plan on bringing along? Are you really encouraging kids to
          harass storeowners in pursuit of your products? If you are saying it's ok to
          harass storeowners, why isn't it ok to cast a spell to have the storeowner
          give that product to a kid for free? I have to ask these questions, Silver,
          because your words and actions make drawing distinctions very difficult for
          those of us with a clear moral code and the knowledge of how to interact
          with others. I would have very little sympathy for any adult who pitched a
          fit in a bookstore simply because your product wasn't instantly available
          for them to purchase. I see no reason to hold a teenager to a different
          standard. After all, I respect teens and believe they are capable of waiting
          for what they want, and earning it.

          You are not exempt from answering for your words and actions Silver. What
          you do with just that one line, backed up by your "Teen Witch Kit" is to
          literally hand wood to those who oppose Pagan spiritual paths and help them
          strike a match to light the fire. Are you so blinded by profits that you
          fail to see the reaction of Christian parents reading that one line?

          As if that were not enough, you go on to make a preemptive strike against
          anyone who might disagree with your actions here. The fact that you posted
          those words leads me to believe that at some level you were fully aware of
          what the reaction of the Pagan community would be to this particular
          product. Your decision to go ahead in spite of your own inner voice leads me
          to wonder if the Goddess herself has to tap you on the shoulder to get you
          to listen to the discord you've sown in the Pagan community with all this.

          What insight that you alone appear to possess makes you think you have the
          right to make such sweeping assumptions about adults who read your words and
          choose to disagree with you? I don't like your statement Silver, but don't
          you dare assume or believe that means I don't care about kids. I do care. I
          care enough to say no to a kid, and that is the hardest thing for a caring
          adult to do. I care enough to be honest with them and tell them that working
          spells and magick is not how one solves problems. I care enough to point out
          that at 13 years old they might not quite be ready to find the one true love
          of their life. Just a small request from me, in the future feel free to
          exclude me from these sweeping generalizations about others that you believe
          are yours to make. Please be sure to list me by name and affiliation.

          This website is a business, in addition to hosting free access message
          boards. We sell tools and accompaniments, some of which are indeed items
          that can be used in magick and ritual. We do not sell tools to those under
          the age of 18. You see Silver, here at Triplemoon, we do believe in magick,
          although unlike some we are able to draw a distinction between our
          spirituality and the business we run. Despite our obvious interest in making
          a living, we have always prominently and publicly stated that nothing of
          what we sell is necessary to ritual, working magick or connecting with the
          divine.

          In fact, you'll find many items of interest in our online catalog. The
          range is, we think, wide and varied, and includes many items that really
          have little to do with Paganism, but have been requested repeatedly over the
          years by visitors to the point where we now stock them. One thing that won't
          be found here anymore are your products Silver. This was not an easy
          business decision to make. I won't argue with anyone that your products
          sell, and from a business standpoint it was a poor decision. But from a
          moral standpoint, it's a very comfortable one to live with. Not every
          product you market is morally objectionable, and there is a valid
          consideration from a business view of keeping those items that aren't. But
          this isn't solely about the Teen Witch Kit. It's also about what appears to
          us to be your goal of targeting teens, especially those of other faiths.
          It's about how Pagans would feel if a prominent Christian writer targeted
          our children to teach them things that we might find objectionable. It's
          about you telling teens it's ok to do whatever it takes to get whatever they
          want. It's about giving back the respect to others that we keep demanding
          for ourselves.

          You live by the law of returns, by your own choice. If you feel negativity
          swirling about you, it is only what you have stirred up. The wind blowing
          cold through your door is the lack of warmth and connection to community
          that was lost somewhere in your ambitions. As you shut your heart and mind
          to the cries rising around you from the Pagan community, when so many of
          your peers believe you are making a mistake, your flat out refusal to even
          consider their point of view does not speak well to one who would claim the
          sacred mantle of spiritual teacher. A teacher leads by example and the best
          ones listen much more then they speak.

          Are you listening Silver?





          Respectfully submitted.


          " Magic is a way of life. "



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


          Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
          (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

          TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
          existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Yulian K. Gaard
          Dear Bill, Dear All ... Bill Wrote; Yulian, You need a vacation with Project 7 in flathead county Mont. Bill I ll need to ask, what is that ?? A vacation
          Message 4 of 8 , Mar 1, 2002
          • 0 Attachment
            Dear Bill, Dear All ...

            Bill Wrote;
            "Yulian, You need a vacation with Project 7 in flathead county Mont. Bill"

            I'll need to ask, what is that ?? A vacation would be great, especially if it'd be a vacation that could help me find financial aid to study in the USA.

            Blessings
            Yulian


            Respectfully submitted.


            " Magic is a way of life. "
          • greg goodwin
            Greetings all, sorry for butting in at the moment, especially since I ve been quiet for sooooooo long. Angelic Y, without magic or at least the possibility for
            Message 5 of 8 , Mar 1, 2002
            • 0 Attachment
              Greetings all, sorry for butting in at the moment,
              especially since I've been quiet for sooooooo long.
              Angelic Y, without magic or at least the possibility
              for pressence of magic life would/is a woeful
              existence. Without the 'magical insight' posessed by
              so few, we possibly could still be living in caves and
              dragging our women around by the hair (ok so this
              might not be so bad). Magic is forsight that something
              is posssible and only a true magician can make it
              happen, AG, I salute you and your dreams.
              GG
              --- "Yulian K. Gaard" <ccc61261@...>
              wrote:
              >
              > Dear Bill, Dear All ...
              >
              > Bill Wrote;
              > "Yulian, You need a vacation with Project 7 in
              > flathead county Mont. Bill"
              >
              > I'll need to ask, what is that ?? A vacation would
              > be great, especially if it'd be a vacation that
              > could help me find financial aid to study in the
              > USA.
              >
              > Blessings
              > Yulian
              >
              >
              > Respectfully submitted.
              >
              >
              > " Magic is a way of life. "
              >
              >
              >


              __________________________________________________
              Do You Yahoo!?
              Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion!
              http://greetings.yahoo.com
            Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.