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thought of non-existence is freeing

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  • hermit crab
    (quote from someone in Texas, I presume.) Now, our minds gain insight into something only by contrasting it with its negation. Thus we understand being only
    Message 1 of 4 , Jun 19, 2013
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      (quote from someone in Texas, I presume.)
      Now, our minds gain insight into something only by contrasting it with its
      negation. Thus we understand being only through the concept of nothing, the
      rational through the non-rational, etc. This is even more true of what we
      know through feeling. Such knowledge becomes more sharply etched and
      poignant by contrast with that of its absence or its opposite. Thus our
      feeling for health becomes more intense when we have experienced sickness,
      our sense for freedom sharper and clearer when we have seen something of
      slavery at first hand. It is in this way, according to Heidegger, that the
      thought of my non-existence brings into sharp relief the essential meaning
      of my existence.

      ===I was reading along here, reached the quoted paragraph above and was
      thinking that this particular paragraph sums up the way the simple idea of
      not existing seems to release a load of mental baggage and elicit a LIVE
      and FREE mental state. It must be why conversation goes in that direction.
      Humans yearn to be alive and free even if in thought only :
      https://webspace.utexas.edu/emc597/existentialism.html

      I see the value in reading dead philosophers but see much more value in
      putting into words the LIVE experience happening as it happens. I also see
      the value of not adopting any system at all. Once a system is adopted,
      limits and boundaries form, and stagnation and death of a free and living
      entity happens.

      Science of all kinds helps form generalizations about our existence but so
      far it doesn't begin to capture rich individual qualitative experience.

      hc


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Mary
      Thought is required to describe qualiaThe experience in-itself doesn t require words, but words require thought for description, which then makes an experience
      Message 2 of 4 , Jun 19, 2013
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        Thought is required to describe qualiaThe experience in-itself doesn't require words, but words require thought for description, which then makes an experience for-itself.

        There is type of poetry, sheer utterance or stream of consciousness, which may avoid thought in its creation. In order to hear or read it, however, thought is evoked. The creative process may be free of thought, but the reception is not. Even extremely non-structured visual poetry which intentionally means to prohibit cognition may fail in preventing thought in its reader. If it invokes feeling only, it nevertheless fails to prevent the work's thoughtful reception and critique which is after all what an artist probably desires.

        Instrumental music, however, is probably an exception. It is an exceptional piece of music which stops my thought for any length of time.

        Anything visual, with possibly the exception of a Tarkovsky or Malick film with little or no dialogue, stimulates my thoughts. Dreamless sleep is immune from description, if there is such a state, wherein nothingness would be appreciated if only I were aware to appreciate it. Dreamless sleep, death, and unconsciousness are examples of nothingness which defy description although words are assigned to them. We can't experience them.

        Mary

        --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, hermit crab <hermitcrab65@...> wrote:
        >
        > (quote from someone in Texas, I presume.)
        > Now, our minds gain insight into something only by contrasting it with its
        > negation. Thus we understand being only through the concept of nothing, the
        > rational through the non-rational, etc. This is even more true of what we
        > know through feeling. Such knowledge becomes more sharply etched and
        > poignant by contrast with that of its absence or its opposite. Thus our
        > feeling for health becomes more intense when we have experienced sickness,
        > our sense for freedom sharper and clearer when we have seen something of
        > slavery at first hand. It is in this way, according to Heidegger, that the
        > thought of my non-existence brings into sharp relief the essential meaning
        > of my existence.
        >
        > ===I was reading along here, reached the quoted paragraph above and was
        > thinking that this particular paragraph sums up the way the simple idea of
        > not existing seems to release a load of mental baggage and elicit a LIVE
        > and FREE mental state. It must be why conversation goes in that direction.
        > Humans yearn to be alive and free even if in thought only :
        > https://webspace.utexas.edu/emc597/existentialism.html
        >
        > I see the value in reading dead philosophers but see much more value in
        > putting into words the LIVE experience happening as it happens. I also see
        > the value of not adopting any system at all. Once a system is adopted,
        > limits and boundaries form, and stagnation and death of a free and living
        > entity happens.
        >
        > Science of all kinds helps form generalizations about our existence but so
        > far it doesn't begin to capture rich individual qualitative experience.
        >
        > hc
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • existlist
        ... It is an exceptional piece of music which stops my thought for any length of time. ===Mary, can you give an example of a piece of music that stops your
        Message 3 of 4 , Jun 19, 2013
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          --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "Mary" <josephson45r@...> wrote:
          It is an exceptional piece of music which stops my thought for any length of time.

          ===Mary, can you give an example of a piece of music that stops your thought? I'd love to experience that. I've had intensely scary moments stop my thought before where I felt like everything was in slow motion and no thoughts flowed, just visual imagery was left.

          h.
        • Mary
          Just about anything by Chopin, some Puccini arias like Nessun Dorma and Quando m en vo, some Gustavo Santaolla, and Ry Cooder, etc. etc. I have to resist
          Message 4 of 4 , Jun 19, 2013
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            Just about anything by Chopin, some Puccini arias like Nessun Dorma and Quando m'en vo, some Gustavo Santaolla, and Ry Cooder, etc. etc. I have to resist researching to translate lyrics if opera, or learning anything about the composer and technique if I want to keep the experience pure.

            Mary

            --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "existlist" <hermitcrab65@...> wrote:
            >
            > --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "Mary" <josephson45r@> wrote:
            > It is an exceptional piece of music which stops my thought for any length of time.
            >
            > ===Mary, can you give an example of a piece of music that stops your thought? I'd love to experience that. I've had intensely scary moments stop my thought before where I felt like everything was in slow motion and no thoughts flowed, just visual imagery was left.
            >
            > h.
            >
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