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Re: [existlist] Re: Old arguments but new situations.

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  • tom
    Mary I have heard a saying That the truth is the first thing to have to go with war. Historically, the masses are blasted with propaganda from all sides. I
    Message 1 of 9 , Apr 4, 2011
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      Mary
      I have heard a saying "That the truth is the first thing to have to go with war." Historically, the masses are blasted with propaganda from all sides. I read all of the Tarzan books as a kid. I found a box of them 5 or 6 years ago, and read a few again. They were written during or shortly after ww1, and any reference to the German forces coming into the story with Tarzan, has Germans as projections rather than real people. I have heard that Homer's Illiad is said to be the first writing where the enemy is shown in all his humanness. The Trojan, Hector I think it is, is depicted going in to give his young son a hug before he goes off to his last battle. He is dressed in war outfit with horns on his head etc. At first his son doesnt recognize him and gets scared, but then Hector pulls off his headgear so his son will know it is dad. Before Hector goes off to battle, he makes some statement to the effect that no man can escape his fate.

      I recall a History professor in college telling our class that the Civil War was the last war in which the vast majority of men fighting felt they were fighting for the good. In the last 113 years or so, the US has increasingly found wars to pursue wars all over the world.

      Peace
      Tom
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Mary
      To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 4:32 PM
      Subject: [existlist] Re: Old arguments but new situations.



      Bill,

      It's an enameled ornament. Because of his charm and passion for his subject matter, Foote was able to humanize an enemy. But don't get me wrong, slavery had to go.

      Mary

      --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "William" <v.valleywestdental@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      >
      > --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "Mary" <josephson45r@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Bill,
      > >
      > > Shelby Foote was a scholar and a gentleman and someone whose work I greatly admire.
      > >
      > > Mary
      > > Mary, what is a multifore stud , I know about the strange ways of seahorses. So the seahorse is really a sea mare. That backwards biology should fit well in this cockeyed world. Shelby just would not have any of this. Bill
      > > --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "William" <v.valleywestdental@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "tom" <tsmith17_midsouth1@> wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > Bill
      > > > >
      > > > > My dad used to quote Will Rogers on women wanting equality between the
      > > > > sexes. Will said"That is mighty generous of them".
      > > > >
      > > > > Tom
      > > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > > From: "William" <v.valleywestdental@>
      > > > > To: <existlist@yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 1:29 PM
      > > > > Subject: [existlist] Old arguments but new situations.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > > Say something about women in general and you get called a misogenist, so
      > > > > > what ,that is not argument it is name calling. When I critised Madd it was
      > > > > > from the new numbers that certainly point to overkill by a sexist and
      > > > > > power hungry organisation. Feminism ,always at logical disadvantage is now
      > > > > > being examined for usefulness and effectivness. The girls,like the pigs in
      > > > > > Animal Farm want to be a little more equil. That is being discussed in
      > > > > > some male sectors and reverse discrimination suits will follow. Having a
      > > > > > kid and then cleaning a guy out in a diveorce is also being looked at. Im
      > > > > > sure the goldiggers dont like it but some fairness,not mysogany , is in
      > > > > > the offing.
      > > > > > All these programs that make women a protected class are just too damn
      > > > > > expensive. You want equil pay,you turn out as much work not just occupy a
      > > > > > position as a woman. You pass paper you pass as much as the man across
      > > > > > from you, you dig ditches you move as much dirt as the dude in the hole
      > > > > > with you. If as a teacher you can`t control your class get out of the game
      > > > > > you don`t have enough sand. Stop all this counseling crap either preform
      > > > > > or take a hike. The whining,female extended family perches on the same
      > > > > > old suppositions about equality that the priests and women have always
      > > > > > relied upon. That being you are owed something by men. The young guys will
      > > > > > always beg and bow for sex but we older fellows could really give a damn
      > > > > > about your sex or its supposed appeal. Like Joe Friday said"Just the facts
      > > > > > Maam, just the facts" Bill
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > ------------------------------------
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Please support the Existential Primer... dedicated to explaining nothing!
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Home Page: http://www.tameri.com/csw/existYahoo! Groups Links
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >Tom, I would like to turn you on to something Iknow you know a great deal about.Adversion to Transfer Payments seem at the base of the libertarian construct. Organisations take an individuals wealth while claiming some supposed need on the part of some organisation. In the most egregious examples insurance companies demand you buy their product and lobby for laws that force compliance. It is hard for me to express my outrage without violating decency standards.
      > > > The spending so abhored by the tea party is really about social spending. I do not want to pay for another Cabrini Green, nor do I want to pay for counselors who spout leftist jargon and religous good will. Unemployment payments, food stamps, heating subsidies, special education teachers, rent subsidies are just social leveling and my individualism has seen enough. This is rage against the machine time and I plan to keep it up through the next election. It would be poor tactics to shut down the government but it would be good politics to drag the collectivists before congressional committees and find out where all that money really goes. How much protection we get from the police and how much we need to be protected from them comes to mind. Before we agree to teacher raises I would like to see our children begin to graduate with basic skills.
      > > > Tonight I will go back into the civil war and as Shelby Foote says you do not understand the structure of this country if you do not understand the Civil War. I know quite a bit about it and that leads me to surmise it could happen again. Bill
      > > > >
      > > >
      > >
      >





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • William
      Message 2 of 9 , Apr 4, 2011
      • 0 Attachment
        --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "tom" <tsmith17_midsouth1@...> wrote:
        >
        > Bill
        >
        > Libertarians are dubious about government from all angles. They see government agencies by nature becoming self serving, and self perpetuating.These patterns are believed to apply, whither we are discussing military, law enforcement, education, health, welfare etc. Thomas Jefferson certainly expressed similar thoughts, fearing government becoming a parasite feeding off productive labor. Of course, Jefferson also expressed liberal sentiments in advocating a graduated land tax, public schools free for all, and fear of increasing inequalities between the richest and the mainstream people. He was also very mistrustful of the growing powerr of banks and corporations. But the libertarian objection to the status quo goes much deeper than transfer payments. Libertarians believe that the use of force is only justified against those using force on others, stealing, or defrauding them. They believe individuals or in the case of children their parents are more motivated to make good choices for themselves than bureaucrats being required to interpret some regulation in a bill never read in entirety by any of the people who voted it into law. Libertarians envision a world where you dont need a driving licence etc. Among supporters Ron Paul had a wide range of types and lifestyles. There were some Druids, but also some evangicals. The libertarian agenda would give both much more liberty to actualize their preferences. Libertarians believe that the strict interpretation of the Consitution would greatly reduce the powers of government to do much stuff, which in turn creates the situation where legislators and appointees are coutesans for the various lobbyists. Libertarians share with main stream Republicans resitance to expanding entitlements;however at least in recent years, the Ditto Head types worship the military and the police.Libertarians see the military and police as having become monsters. Libertarians see interventionist wars like victimless crime, paradigms geared to continually grow and expand the respective complexes.
        >
        > I consider myself more of an independent than a Libertarian, but more of a Libertarian than anything else. I voted for Paul in 08 primary, but Obama for election. I am not sure libertarians have all the answers, but certainly libertarian thought is a ray of sunshine in the darkness of monstrous expansions of Big Brother.I can read a book by the late libertarian Harry Browne, and largely agree with his ideas;but I can read some of George Soros's books, and his left of center ideas can also make sense.
        >
        > Peace
        > Tom
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: William
        > To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
        > Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 2:21 PM
        > Subject: [existlist] Re: Old arguments but new situations.
        >
        >Thank you ,Tom, much to ponder. Bill
        >
        >
        >
        > --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "tom" <tsmith17_midsouth1@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Bill
        > >
        > > My dad used to quote Will Rogers on women wanting equality between the
        > > sexes. Will said"That is mighty generous of them".
        > >
        > > Tom
        > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > From: "William" <v.valleywestdental@>
        > > To: <existlist@yahoogroups.com>
        > > Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 1:29 PM
        > > Subject: [existlist] Old arguments but new situations.
        > >
        > >
        > > > Say something about women in general and you get called a misogenist, so
        > > > what ,that is not argument it is name calling. When I critised Madd it was
        > > > from the new numbers that certainly point to overkill by a sexist and
        > > > power hungry organisation. Feminism ,always at logical disadvantage is now
        > > > being examined for usefulness and effectivness. The girls,like the pigs in
        > > > Animal Farm want to be a little more equil. That is being discussed in
        > > > some male sectors and reverse discrimination suits will follow. Having a
        > > > kid and then cleaning a guy out in a diveorce is also being looked at. Im
        > > > sure the goldiggers dont like it but some fairness,not mysogany , is in
        > > > the offing.
        > > > All these programs that make women a protected class are just too damn
        > > > expensive. You want equil pay,you turn out as much work not just occupy a
        > > > position as a woman. You pass paper you pass as much as the man across
        > > > from you, you dig ditches you move as much dirt as the dude in the hole
        > > > with you. If as a teacher you can`t control your class get out of the game
        > > > you don`t have enough sand. Stop all this counseling crap either preform
        > > > or take a hike. The whining,female extended family perches on the same
        > > > old suppositions about equality that the priests and women have always
        > > > relied upon. That being you are owed something by men. The young guys will
        > > > always beg and bow for sex but we older fellows could really give a damn
        > > > about your sex or its supposed appeal. Like Joe Friday said"Just the facts
        > > > Maam, just the facts" Bill
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > ------------------------------------
        > > >
        > > > Please support the Existential Primer... dedicated to explaining nothing!
        > > >
        > > > Home Page: http://www.tameri.com/csw/existYahoo! Groups Links
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >Tom, I would like to turn you on to something Iknow you know a great deal about.Adversion to Transfer Payments seem at the base of the libertarian construct. Organisations take an individuals wealth while claiming some supposed need on the part of some organisation. In the most egregious examples insurance companies demand you buy their product and lobby for laws that force compliance. It is hard for me to express my outrage without violating decency standards.
        > The spending so abhored by the tea party is really about social spending. I do not want to pay for another Cabrini Green, nor do I want to pay for counselors who spout leftist jargon and religous good will. Unemployment payments, food stamps, heating subsidies, special education teachers, rent subsidies are just social leveling and my individualism has seen enough. This is rage against the machine time and I plan to keep it up through the next election. It would be poor tactics to shut down the government but it would be good politics to drag the collectivists before congressional committees and find out where all that money really goes. How much protection we get from the police and how much we need to be protected from them comes to mind. Before we agree to teacher raises I would like to see our children begin to graduate with basic skills.
        > Tonight I will go back into the civil war and as Shelby Foote says you do not understand the structure of this country if you do not understand the Civil War. I know quite a bit about it and that leads me to surmise it could happen again. Bill
        > >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
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