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Lucifer lost

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  • bhvwd
    Nice practical existential writing,dudes, The concept of an evil genius is most interesting. Tom, In Mien Kampf does Hitler consider himself an evil genius?
    Message 1 of 2 , Jun 5, 2009
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      Nice practical existential writing,dudes,
      The concept of an evil genius is most interesting.
      Tom, In Mien Kampf does Hitler consider himself an evil genius? When their numbers were getting up, the people responsible for the carnage seem smart enough to propose that question . I am not talking about the crazy killers,i.e.Calligula or Vlad, I am thinking of the ones making up the excuses or listening to the excuses.
      Obama says we should look inside and see how much of the killing mentality is within us.
      I have met Col. Tibbets. He did 100,000 Japanese. From newsreels I have seen his face before the mission. The two faces are totally incongruous. Certainly he had all justification for his action but some part of that face did not comprehend the news.
      You talk about the 1000 yard gaze ,guys like Tibbets and Oppenheimer seem to be looking into a future beyond a horror.
      The skeletons in the closet start roaring when they reach some personal limit.
      Watching Obama at Buchenwald he seemed in shock. The jet lag would be bad and that place on top of it should put one in shock. Wiesenthal was hugely existential in his comments, he really sounded like Buber in his description of his fathers death at Buchenwald. Eve-dentally the old Nazi hunter is a good friend of the president. I think that a good thing, our perspective is being considered and that alone is better than it was.
      Now, Tom, I think they are controlling the masses with a cult of personality. It is slick and it appears natural. Remember Hitlers cocktail party at the eagles nest. Hitler brings it off best, the rest look like Nazi.
      Obama could end up like a western Mao. We will wave his book and have no idea what it means. Our minds erased at the final page with a microdot will function as one and we will feel safe.
      So does the devil know he is the devil. How many get out of jail cards do you carry? Would you like to buy this lovely black amulet? Bill
    • devogney
      ... Bill, You wrote I have met Col. Tibbets. He did 100,000 Japanese. From newsreels I have seen his face before the mission. The two faces are totally
      Message 2 of 2 , Jun 5, 2009
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        --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "bhvwd" <v.valleywestdental@...> wrote:


        Bill, You wrote

        I have met Col. Tibbets. He did 100,000 Japanese. From newsreels I have seen his face before the mission. The two faces are totally incongruous. Certainly he had all justification for his action but some part of that face did not comprehend the news


        Like everybody else I grew up thinking that the "sneaky little Japs"got what they deserved after Pearl Harboring us. About 5 years or so ago, I read a piece by Libertarian Harry Browne where he was questioning whither Bush had misled us into the Iraq War, and he said if he did, it wouldn't be the first time. Browne mentioned the Tonkin incident in regard to Nam, the Pearl Harbor conspiracy theories in regard to ww2, Wilson withholding a warning sent to him about the Lucitania, and the "Remember the Maine trick that led us into the Spanish American War. There is some debate whither or not the US had already broken the Japanese code, and knew for sure when Pearl Harbor was going to be hit. Stimson, the Secretary of War under FDR has a statement in his diary after the attack to the affect that we were lucky it wasn't a lot worse. Whither they had broken the code or not, it is clear the administration was pretty sure an attack was coming. For over 6 years, the US had been goading Japan to take a swing at them.General Smedley Butler said in his book "War is a Racket" in 1935 "The Japanese, a proud people, of course will be pleased beyond expression to see the united States fleet so close to Nippon's shores. Even as pleased as would be the residents of California were they to dimly discern through the morning mist, the Japanese fleet playing at war games off Los Angeles." About a year before the Pearl Harbor attack, FDR had moved the fleet from San Diego to Pearl Harbor. The admiral in charge protested this was not a safe place to be, and FDR transferred him.In the summer of 41, the US put an embargo on oil sales to Japan[Japan had been getting 80% of their oil from US], and US also froze all Japanese assetts in the US. If anybody starts reading various links on the Pearl Harbor conspiracy, I think there is little doubt that FDR had repeatedly provoked Japan to attack. There is a school of thought that after all those incidents, Japan knew that FDR would keep pushing them until the worm turned, and Japan knew in any case they were the underdog, but hoped that the element of suprise might give them some chance. The whole thing was like some big thug in prison or on a street corner provoking a much smaller, weaker guy to take a punch.

        Leo Szilard was actually the man who had first realized the possibility of a nuclear chain reaction. Einstein was a friend of his, and used his prestige to send the Einstein/Szilard letter to FDR proposing the possibility of the A bomb. The only reason either of them would ever had sent the letter was the fact that there were reports Hitler was working on an A bomb. During the Manhattan Project, Szilard and General Graves, the military man in charge hated each other, and Graves tried to get Szilard arrested. By the time the a bomb was developed, Hitler was dead, and Germany had surrendered; and Szilard was strongly against the bomb being dropped on Japan, since he and Einstein had only sent the letter because of fear Hitler might get bomb first, and it was known Japan did not have any a bomb projects going. Szilard had an appointment set up with Eleanor Roosevelt, in which he hoped to talk to her to try to persuade FDR not to drop bomb on Japan. Unfortunately,FDR died before the day set for meeting, and a later meeting with a Truman administration guy was not fruitful.

        Szilard and many other of the Manhattan Project scientists immediately joined groups trying to get rid of the A bomb. Einstein said that the biggest mistake of his life was the letter he sent to FDR recommending the bomb. Of course, he and Szilard both did so because of the fear of Hitler acquiring the bomb. The sad and ironic thing is that once the genius of guys like Szilard has been used to make such lethal things, they are in the hands of men of much lower intellect and humanity, and the genie was out of the bottle.

        As for Obama, I voted for him. I was originally for Ron Paul, and voted for him in the Republican Primary[though I knew he was an extreme long shot]. I knew that to me Obama would be the next best bet in matters close to my heart, peace and personal freedom. Obama is trying to get troops out of Iraq, and is presenting a much more peaceful sensitive face to the world. Sure Obama is charismic, and I understand your point about the cult of personality. But charisma is as helpful to a politician as being big is to an NFL lineman. FDR used charisma to bring on the new deal. Reagan used charisma to counter much of the new deal; and Obama is using his to do what he is doing.I see Obama as movent toward the spirit of peace and human unity, that was prevalent before the election of Reagan and death of Lennon. I could imagine the song "Imagine" playing as footage of Obama's speeches overseas are played. In terms of charisma, you could compare Obama and Hitler. However, in other ways they are fairly opposite, because Obama was the most pro peace candidate next to Ron Paul. I recall Ron Paul saying during the Republican debate that 911 was blowback for 50 years of US policy in the mideast, and later Paul mentioned the US was building an embassy in Bagdad bigger than the Vatican. Paul mentioned the huge numbers of bases the US had in the mideast, and asked how we'd like it if China was building those bases in Panama or such. Another quote I liked from Paul was that if he were president he'd not only withdraw US troops from Iraq and Afghanistan, but also from Japan, Korea, and Germany.

        Peace,
        Tom


        >
        > Nice practical existential writing,dudes,
        > The concept of an evil genius is most interesting.
        > Tom, In Mien Kampf does Hitler consider himself an evil genius? When their numbers were getting up, the people responsible for the carnage seem smart enough to propose that question . I am not talking about the crazy killers,i.e.Calligula or Vlad, I am thinking of the ones making up the excuses or listening to the excuses.
        > Obama says we should look inside and see how much of the killing mentality is within us.
        > I have met Col. Tibbets. He did 100,000 Japanese. From newsreels I have seen his face before the mission. The two faces are totally incongruous. Certainly he had all justification for his action but some part of that face did not comprehend the news.
        > You talk about the 1000 yard gaze ,guys like Tibbets and Oppenheimer seem to be looking into a future beyond a horror.
        > The skeletons in the closet start roaring when they reach some personal limit.
        > Watching Obama at Buchenwald he seemed in shock. The jet lag would be bad and that place on top of it should put one in shock. Wiesenthal was hugely existential in his comments, he really sounded like Buber in his description of his fathers death at Buchenwald. Eve-dentally the old Nazi hunter is a good friend of the president. I think that a good thing, our perspective is being considered and that alone is better than it was.
        > Now, Tom, I think they are controlling the masses with a cult of personality. It is slick and it appears natural. Remember Hitlers cocktail party at the eagles nest. Hitler brings it off best, the rest look like Nazi.
        > Obama could end up like a western Mao. We will wave his book and have no idea what it means. Our minds erased at the final page with a microdot will function as one and we will feel safe.
        > So does the devil know he is the devil. How many get out of jail cards do you carry? Would you like to buy this lovely black amulet? Bill
        >
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