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Loonies on the path

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  • bhvwd
    It is showdown time, high noon, the horizon of apocalypse. Will we try or will we slink off to degrade and die? It has been the time for discussion but that
    Message 1 of 6 , Feb 6, 2009
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      It is showdown time, high noon, the horizon of apocalypse. Will we try
      or will we slink off to degrade and die? It has been the time for
      discussion but that comes to an end. Now these political executives
      that we have elected need count the nays and yeas. I feel their stress
      because it is my ass they are cooking or saving.
      A mistake for these pinnacle politicians means they will be reduced
      with their legends sullied and memory erased. Those boys have egos as
      good as their suits and it adds to the tension.
      There are way too many unknowns in this stimulus equation to make any
      better than a hopeful guess at a positive outcome. It is not so bad for
      the Dems they were sent there to change things and they will. Sure
      there is still conference committee but those will be gavel-ed closed
      in short order. The old ,republican senators are being called to help
      or fall on their swords. The gentle lawn is no longer accessible, get
      on the path or take your shot. But it is a lovely day. Bill
    • mary.josie59
      Bill, just this morning read these words of Camus. They seem appropriate. Mary Conscious of not being able to separate myself from my time, I have decided to
      Message 2 of 6 , Feb 6, 2009
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        Bill, just this morning read these words of Camus. They seem
        appropriate. Mary

        "Conscious of not being able to separate myself from my time, I have
        decided to become part of it."

        "For those who feel solidarity with the world's destiny, the clash of
        civilizations has something anguishing about it. I have made that
        anguish my own and at the same time wished to play my role...Once must
        choose between action and contemplation."
      • chris lofting
        ... ;-) this reflects a property of mediation - hitting paradox and so not able to totally cut what one considers a whole from a more complex, if but
        Message 3 of 6 , Feb 6, 2009
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          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: existlist@yahoogroups.com
          > [mailto:existlist@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mary.josie59
          > Sent: Saturday, 7 February 2009 3:11 PM
          > To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [existlist] Re: Loonies on the path
          >
          > Bill, just this morning read these words of Camus. They seem
          > appropriate. Mary
          >
          > "Conscious of not being able to separate myself from my time,
          > I have decided to become part of it."
          >

          ;-) this reflects a property of mediation - hitting paradox and so not able
          to totally 'cut' what one considers a 'whole' from a more complex, if but
          vague, whole; as such we cover metonymy vs metaphor. The focus on the static
          will reduce to a point and in doing so hit upon the sensation of the
          'infinite' - the inability to find a 'cut' other than one that is subjective
          and in being subjective is not considered as 'true' (where 'truth' is
          associated with symmetry and 'oneness'!). To experience this inability to
          totally 'cut' from a complex pattern, see the sensory paradox examples in
          http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/paradox.html where the infinite
          oscillations possible reflect this cutting issue.

          > "For those who feel solidarity with the world's destiny, the
          > clash of civilizations has something anguishing about it. I
          > have made that anguish my own and at the same time wished to
          > play my role...Once must choose between action and contemplation."
          >
          >

          "Free will" presents in the form of choices and they not as ideal, as
          universals, but as local context sensitivities. Using universals LOCALLY can
          aid in some local political dynamic but over the long run a more
          context-sensitive approach is favoured. Thus analytical negation ('born
          again') applies locally, dialectical negation ('keep the good bits') applies
          globally.

          The determinism inherent in genetically-determined species has developed
          over a considerable timespan and covers the 'natural' response to living in
          a thermodynamic universe - conservation of energy 'rules' and so a bias to
          symmetry overall. Included in the determinism is 'purpose', all due to the
          natural consequence of deriving meaning etc within a closed system in that
          all that is possible is covered in the development of the neurology and its
          sensory systems and so covers 'beginnings' and 'endings' - the recursion
          involved (mapped to self-referencing and so self-organising systems) encodes
          all categories within each and so encodes a 'purpose' element. It is this
          element that such social typologies as the MBTI or HBDI or 'big-5' etc etc
          pick up and the analysis of these methodologies moves us into in-depth
          mappings of 'purpose' in each of us as members of neuron-dependent species.

          The FAILURE of such rigid 'hard coding' is manifest in the development of
          consciousness and so the emergence of our SINGULAR being, our unique self as
          an agent of mediation. This development covers pressures on the mechanistic
          nature of recursion where, given DEPTH in that development, a teleological
          element emerges in the form of 'purpose' and on into the ability of a
          self-referencing system, an autopeiotic system, to describe itself and so
          elicit the use of analogy/metaphor for mediation/communication.

          What emerges from this activity are such dichotomies as being/doing,
          static/dynamic, object/relationships etc etc where the recursion of these
          will elicit a dimension of classes of meaning usable to represent 'all that
          is possible' given the bounds of the dichotomies. What is immediately
          noticeable is an emerging issue of PRECISION, of resolution power, and with
          that a focus on the dynamics of positive/negative feedback.

          Repeated reductionism limits what is encapsulated by the positive feedback
          in that within what has been encapsulated is negative feedback holding
          things together - until one reduces to a point whereupon the definition of
          'negative feedback' is lost since it cannot reduce to the dimensionless,
          there must be some form of dimensionality present for 'negative feedback' to
          apply.

          Moving into the realm of the dimensionless covers the emergence of
          infinities where such reflect an inability to reduce the dimensional to the
          dimensionless in that the 'perfection' associated with a closed-system,
          symmetry-grounded, topological perspective is not represent able other than
          through irrational means (i.e. the infinite mantissa of irrational numbers
          bring out the inability to reduce to 'points' - we are faced with the use of
          rounding of values and so the contribution of the SUBJECTIVE at this level
          of precision).

          There is a tie here of infinity with 'oneness' and so coverage of a closed
          system. OTOH the act of mediation involved introduces an asymmetric element
          in the form of consciousness as language and so open system dynamics. Here
          we note that mediation is grounded in uncertainty such that all languages,
          when considered from a meta-language perspective, are naturally
          'incomplete'. What THIS leads to is the realisation that to maintain an
          asymmetric position one has to keep talking and storing all of that 'off
          line' to then be taught to others; if one decides to stop, if one has had
          enough of the perpetual production of prose, one has surrendered to the
          symmetric, to energy conservation and social commitment. This CAN be
          beneficial in that the period of mediation and so of serial-dominated
          dynamics, should have refined one's intuition and so given one a good set of
          skills to live by with little need for mediation; all is parallel, all is
          stimulus-response, the life of an instincts/habits driven life form tied to
          'routine' (a necessary physiological development where loss of huge amounts
          of neurons as we age are covered by the routines we have learnt)

          BUT there is still the need for more analysis, more mediation, and so
          development of languages, re-development of languages; as some surrender to
          symmetry so their works prior to such contribute to the overall perspective
          offered by the language. Their lives after such reflect the degree of
          internalisation of the language in the form of refined instincts/habits and
          so patterns to live by 'intuitively'.

          So - keep writing dudes - existentialism depends on it!

          Chris
          http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/AbstractDomain.html
        • eupraxis@aol.com
          This reflects your monomania and your obnoxious narcissism. You are more like a stalker than a member here. Wil ... ************** Nothing says I love you like
          Message 4 of 6 , Feb 7, 2009
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            This reflects your monomania and your obnoxious narcissism. You are more like
            a stalker than a member here.

            Wil

            In a message dated 2/6/09 11:25:57 PM, lofting@... writes:


            > ;-) this reflects a property of mediation - hitting paradox and so not able
            > to totally 'cut' what one considers a 'whole' from a more complex, if but
            > vague, whole; as such we cover metonymy vs metaphor. The focus on the static
            > will reduce to a point and in doing so hit upon the sensation of the
            > 'infinite' - the inability to find a 'cut' other than one that is subjective
            > and in being subjective is not considered as 'true' (where 'truth' is
            > associated with symmetry and 'oneness'!). To experience this inability to
            > totally 'cut' from a complex pattern, see the sensory paradox examples in
            > http://members.http://membehttp://membehttp://membershttp where the infinite
            > oscillations possible reflect this cutting issue.
            >
            > > "For those who feel solidarity with the world's destiny, the
            > > clash of civilizations has something anguishing about it. I
            > > have made that anguish my own and at the same time wished to
            > > play my role...Once must choose between action and contemplation.
            > >
            > >
            >
            > "Free will" presents in the form of choices and they not as ideal, as
            > universals, but as local context sensitivities. Using universals LOCALLY can
            > aid in some local political dynamic but over the long run a more
            > context-sensitive approach is favoured. Thus analytical negation ('born
            > again') applies locally, dialectical negation ('keep the good bits') applies
            > globally.
            >
            > The determinism inherent in genetically- The determinism inherent in gen
            > over a considerable timespan and covers the 'natural' response to living in
            > a thermodynamic universe - conservation of energy 'rules' and so a bias to
            > symmetry overall. Included in the determinism is 'purpose', all due to the
            > natural consequence of deriving meaning etc within a closed system in that
            > all that is possible is covered in the development of the neurology and its
            > sensory systems and so covers 'beginnings' and 'endings' - the recursion
            > involved (mapped to self-referencing and so self-organising systems) encodes
            > all categories within each and so encodes a 'purpose' element. It is this
            > element that such social typologies as the MBTI or HBDI or 'big-5' etc etc
            > pick up and the analysis of these methodologies moves us into in-depth
            > mappings of 'purpose' in each of us as members of neuron-dependent species.
            >
            > The FAILURE of such rigid 'hard coding' is manifest in the development of
            > consciousness and so the emergence of our SINGULAR being, our unique self as
            > an agent of mediation. This development covers pressures on the mechanistic
            > nature of recursion where, given DEPTH in that development, a teleological
            > element emerges in the form of 'purpose' and on into the ability of a
            > self-referencing system, an autopeiotic system, to describe itself and so
            > elicit the use of analogy/metaphor for mediation/communica elic
            >
            > What emerges from this activity are such dichotomies as being/doing,
            > static/dynamic, object/relationship static/dynamic, object/relationship<w
            > will elicit a dimension of classes of meaning usable to represent 'all that
            > is possible' given the bounds of the dichotomies. What is immediately
            > noticeable is an emerging issue of PRECISION, of resolution power, and with
            > that a focus on the dynamics of positive/negative feedback.
            >
            > Repeated reductionism limits what is encapsulated by the positive feedback
            > in that within what has been encapsulated is negative feedback holding
            > things together - until one reduces to a point whereupon the definition of
            > 'negative feedback' is lost since it cannot reduce to the dimensionless,
            > there must be some form of dimensionality present for 'negative feedback' to
            > apply.
            >
            > Moving into the realm of the dimensionless covers the emergence of
            > infinities where such reflect an inability to reduce the dimensional to the
            > dimensionless in that the 'perfection' associated with a closed-system,
            > symmetry-grounded, topological perspective is not represent able other than
            > through irrational means (i.e. the infinite mantissa of irrational numbers
            > bring out the inability to reduce to 'points' - we are faced with the use of
            > rounding of values and so the contribution of the SUBJECTIVE at this level
            > of precision).
            >
            > There is a tie here of infinity with 'oneness' and so coverage of a closed
            > system. OTOH the act of mediation involved introduces an asymmetric element
            > in the form of consciousness as language and so open system dynamics. Here
            > we note that mediation is grounded in uncertainty such that all languages,
            > when considered from a meta-language perspective, are naturally
            > 'incomplete' 'incomplete'<wbr>. What THIS leads to is the realisation t
            > asymmetric position one has to keep talking and storing all of that 'off
            > line' to then be taught to others; if one decides to stop, if one has had
            > enough of the perpetual production of prose, one has surrendered to the
            > symmetric, to energy conservation and social commitment. This CAN be
            > beneficial in that the period of mediation and so of serial-dominated
            > dynamics, should have refined one's intuition and so given one a good set of
            > skills to live by with little need for mediation; all is parallel, all is
            > stimulus-response, the life of an instincts/habits driven life form tied to
            > 'routine' (a necessary physiological development where loss of huge amounts
            > of neurons as we age are covered by the routines we have learnt)
            >
            > BUT there is still the need for more analysis, more mediation, and so
            > development of languages, re-development of languages; as some surrender to
            > symmetry so their works prior to such contribute to the overall perspective
            > offered by the language. Their lives after such reflect the degree of
            > internalisation of the language in the form of refined instincts/habits and
            > so patterns to live by 'intuitively'
            >
            > So - keep writing dudes - existentialism depends on it!
            >
            > Chris
            >




            **************
            Nothing says I love you like flowers! Find a florist near you
            now. (http://yellowpages.aol.com/search?query=florist&ncid=emlcntusyelp00000001)



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • chris lofting
            ... LOL! you need to be more specific Wil. Throwing these sorts of labels is just wind . Where specifically are there issues with what I wrote and an
            Message 5 of 6 , Feb 7, 2009
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              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: existlist@yahoogroups.com
              > [mailto:existlist@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of eupraxis@...
              > Sent: Sunday, 8 February 2009 12:25 AM
              > To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: Re: [existlist] Re: Loonies on the path
              >
              > This reflects your monomania and your obnoxious narcissism.

              LOL! you need to be more specific Wil. Throwing these sorts of labels is
              just 'wind'. Where specifically are there issues with what I wrote and an
              existentialist perspective? if you cannot deal with the dynamics of
              enantiodromia then you have a problem in the context of the evolution of
              existentialism - suffering will, over time, develop into discernment, a
              positive from a negative. etc etc etc. Are you that paralysed that you
              cannot make the journey? LOL! get a gripe dude, you can contribute but it
              will obviously need some work!

              Chris
              http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/AbstractDomain.html
            • bhvwd
              The red herring fish monger is busy. Who he truly represents will never be known, unless the great conspiracy can be broken open and the truth spills out.
              Message 6 of 6 , Feb 7, 2009
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                The red herring fish monger is busy. Who he truly represents will
                never be known, unless the great conspiracy can be broken open and
                the truth spills out. When we try to examine the world situation we
                run up against many fools and corrupt facades. We will have
                indictments or we will fade as a civil society. The players in the
                great housing debacle are slowly emerging as punk business crooks
                but their political cover remains hidden. The corruption on a local
                level is huge. Criminals are covering their asses and trying to
                smear legitimate investigations and investigators. As Wil has
                surmised we deal with our own terrorist here and it has backing of
                unknown origin. I refuse to read his crap and will work to uncover
                his source of mania. In the mean time I hope to support our young
                president as he works to rebuild all that has been ruined by the
                right wing theocracy that has gripped us. I fear we will see
                economic terrorism dove tail with Bush/ Chaney counter terrorism and
                find a twisted core of ideologues pushing their greedy schemes and
                anti democratic agenda.
                Beating them back in the senate is a great beginning and when we get
                the money we can hire the lawyers and begin the real work. I could at
                this moment list many local slime balls who need time behind bars
                but all in proper sequence. The good moderates who are standing up
                in the senate should be supported . Olimpia Snow and Sen Susan
                Collins are brave Americans.
                We will reclaim this country for rational governance and then we
                can sort through the lies and conspiracies that have held us in
                terror. We know the big names and some of the small names but those
                in the muted press can and will fill in the blanks. Those still
                unmentioned will pull out all the stops to remain with the
                appearance of innocence but the grim truth will win out.
                The obstructionists will show us the cabal and their fear and
                corruption will undo them. We may never know the whys but the whos
                can be known by that furtive syntax and deceptive writing.
                Existentialism remains a fine standard as the battle rages about us.
                The never ending attack from strange quarters and loonies attests to
                its power. Clean thinking and iron resolve will win out. Don`t
                believe me just watch. Bill
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