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RE: [existlist] Re: Viewing the other

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  • eduard at home
    eduard --- We only think that this is the realm of the noble savage because it is not our own and Jung is looking for [seeking] a new point of view which
    Message 1 of 4 , Jan 24, 2008
      eduard ---
      We only think that this is the realm of the noble savage because it
      is not our own and Jung is looking for [seeking] a new point of view which
      differs from the sable rattling and rotting gutters of Europe and I would
      ask why he only gets to speak to a non-white in New Mexico after travelling
      across a few thousand miles of the US.

      I know where to eat and sometimes I make things up and feel no
      remorse in a freedom that seems childlike seeing as I am only 6 years old.
      I once went into the office of a manager of a company in Richmond VA where
      one wall was completely covered with mementos of his being in country all
      sorts of pictures of him and his buddies and suitably mounted knives of all
      sorts and also some stuff from gooks that he had picked up along the way.
      The cult of the warrior remains strong.

      -----Original Message-----
      From: existlist@yahoogroups.com [mailto:existlist@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
      Of bhvwd
      Sent: January-24-08 10:57 AM
      To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [existlist] Re: Viewing the other

      --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "louise" <hecubatoher@...> wrote:
      > ~ On my next trip to the United States I went with a group of
      > American friends to visit the Indians of New Mexico, the city-
      > building Pueblos. "City", however, is too strong a word. What
      > build are in reality only villages; but their crowded houses piled
      > one atop the other suggest the word "city", as do their language
      > their whole manner. There for the first time I had the good
      > to speak with a non-European, that is, to a non-white. He was a
      > chief of the Taos Pueblos, an intelligent man between the ages of
      > forty snd fifty. His name was Ochwiay Biano (Mountain Lake). I
      > able to talk with him as I have rarely been able to talk with a
      > European. To be sure, he was caught up in his world just as much
      > a European is in his, but what a world it is! In talk with a
      > European, one is constantly running up on the sand bars of things
      > long known but never understood; with this Indian, the vessel
      > freely on deep, alien seas. At the same time, one never knows
      > is more enjoyable: catching sight of new shores, or discovering new
      > approaches to age-old knowledge that has been almost forgotten.
      > "See," Ochwiay Biano said, "how cruel the whites look. Thier lips
      > are thin, their noses sharp, their faces furrowed and distorted by
      > folds. Their eyes have a staring expression; they are always
      > something. What are they seeking? The whites always want
      > they are always uneasy and restless. We do not know what they
      > We do not understand them. We think that they are mad."
      > I asked him why he thought the whites were all mad.
      > "They say that they think with their heads," he replied.
      > "Why of course. What do you think with?" I asked him in surprise.
      > "We think here," he said, indicating his heart." ~
      > Extract from an unpublished manuscript by Carl Jung, reproduced in
      > his book, "Memories, Dreams, Reflections".
      > --------------------------
      > Hmm. Cannot help reaching the conclusion that salvation for the
      > white man consists in learning to think with both.
      > Louise
      > ... exploring the inner history of neuroscience
      Louise, I have been to Taos pueblo and am looking at artifacts made
      there. The most beautiful stream runs through it with crystal clear
      water. Those indians will talk to you. They retain the hardness of
      hunters and I have one of their rabbit clubs and a bow and arrows.
      On examination of my war spear I notice the break off point is
      chipped and loose. One of my employees or a patient probably tried
      to throw it. At least it was not at me.
      By now the Taos have figured out the whites as they sell many many
      things to us. I use their medicine bags on appropriate occassions.
      They have a casino and food is free there to tribe members. They can
      be as modern or primative as the situation necessitates. They kicked
      us out at noon because they were having a pow wow.
      They burned the first catholic church and its timbers still rot in
      the sun next to the semi christian grave yards. Many of the ornaments
      on the graves are anything but christian. Bones and antler and hide
      set amoung plastic flowers in the hot wind. Indian burial sites are
      spiritual in an ancient sense that shivvers my spine. Indian art
      is everywhere and much of it is oddly futuristic with alien
      creatures representing strange visits to the artists. They make
      things up and feel no remorse in a freedom that seems childlike. The
      old men display their army awards and the cult of the warrior remains
      strong. These people slip back and forth between the ancient and
      modern with ease. Louise, you would be fascinated with these rare
      and fantastic human beings. They have manners built on millenial
      practice and their knowledge of their natural surroundings is little
      blunted by european presance. They know where prey will be and pray
      for the spirit of their victims. They ask forgiveness of those they
      kill. Some still live in small groups ,apart and the more socialised
      protect their ancient fellows. Priscilla , who is Chactaw, falls
      into a kind of familial transe when at the pueblo and wants to retire
      in the area. It is an enchanted land with a natural grace that seems
      lost elsewhere. Bill

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