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RE: [existlist] Re: Either/ Or... and Absurdity

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  • Chris Lofting
    ... Probably ;-) ... This is what is called a false dichotomy. Your not looking behind, your are working off expression. This is primitive thinking reflecting
    Message 1 of 36 , Jun 3, 2007
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      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: existlist@yahoogroups.com [mailto:existlist@yahoogroups.com] On
      > Behalf Of Trinidad Cruz
      > Sent: Monday, 4 June 2007 2:20 AM
      > To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
      > Subject: [existlist] Re: Either/ Or... and Absurdity
      >
      > Well Mr. Science, you are beginning to give me substantial doubt
      > concerning your arguments. I view your ideas falling within Hume's
      > perceptions of causality. Perhaps you would like to defend or deny
      > that. Perhaps I am confused, or drunk, or having an episode.

      Probably ;-)

      > To give
      > you the benefit of the doubt which view do you argue: Cartwright's or
      > Donaldson's?

      This is what is called a false dichotomy. Your not looking behind, your are
      working off expression. This is primitive thinking reflecting
      undifferentiated emotion ;-) At least try and apply the dichotomy to itself
      five or six times; you may learn something.

      > I don't think you know the difference,

      LOL! So biased! What about the sameness? ;-) Despite the falsity of the
      dichotomy, its self-referencing allows for forms of interpretation from a
      symmetric perspective or a asymmetric perspective or moving into the
      anti-symmetric... and when recursed a whole spectrum emerges where local
      context will select some 'best fit'.

      > but then I'm not
      > that smart, though Nancy Cartwright's "How The Laws Of Physics Lie
      > 1983" is one of the few books on my desk. If this is too much for you
      > at least try to argue how an account of mental causality in
      > physicalist terms is applicable to philosophy in any way except as a
      > "scientific" proposition, and then at least attempt to defend it as
      > actually scientific or drop it. You seem to be way out of your depth.
      > Science fictionalists don't usually last long here. Ask Knott about
      > clams, please. He can easily out-discourse you.
      >

      You keep focusing on expression and so unable to deal with what is behind
      it, the dimension of possible meanings given our neurology. The person out
      of their depth is you since your prose comes across as lacking depth -
      riddled with a property of positive feedback - amplification.

      The fun with either/or is in its precision, the issues are that it goes past
      the whole to bring out some aspect as if the whole, and so it is
      consciousness that is the cause of paradox.

      As for the laws of physics lying, you don't understand IDM in that it
      focuses on what is behind specialisations and that includes physics. Of
      particular notice is how the 'gaga-land' interpretations coming out of QM
      etc show us the metaphoric nature of physics - but the physicists, unaware
      of how 'in here' works, fail to take into consideration the methodology they
      use in interacting with reality - they too take things at the expression
      level even though trying to identify essences!

      As such, their experiments with EPR etc are formed to reflect the patterns
      of a dichotomy self-referenced where, due to the symmetry inbuilt to the
      method, allows for manifestation of a property of symmetry - all is
      connected.

      What they don't get is that the symmetry is derived from self-referencing
      and so 'in' us as emotion-dependent species. The universe is asymmetric -
      lookup the baryon octet etc - if it was symmetric we would not be here. You
      get development from the asymmetric and so from time as you do from unique
      beings, but behind that there is symmetry.

      The dynamic overall is of symmetry making (entrainment through rhythm etc,
      integration) and symmetry breaking (differentiation).

      It does not matter what specialist perspective the individual favours, it
      will fall-in within the bounds of differentiating/integrating and all
      meaning will be derived from such regardless of form, be it real or
      imagined, be the focus on the singular or particular/general (the former
      immediate, crisp, the latter statistical, vague). Apply the dichotomy
      recursively for the fine detail and small world configurations where such
      configurations apply to the species, collectives within the species, and
      individuals within the collectives (and so the purposeless within the
      purposeful, no history to history, 'freedom' to determinism - again, apply
      that dichotomy recursively to get the full spectrum)

      Chris.
    • Exist List Moderator
      ... The Diamond Lake area is giving way to two expanded freeways. This is progress, of course. As with so many cities, Minneapolis once had more than 500 miles
      Message 36 of 36 , Jun 5, 2007
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        On Jun 05, 2007, at 8:57, Trinidad Cruz wrote:

        > I used to live in Minneapolis back in the 50's. I don't remember the
        > street but a couple of blocks from a little pond called Diamond Lake,
        > and a Nicolet Ave.

        The Diamond Lake area is giving way to two expanded freeways. This is
        progress, of course. As with so many cities, Minneapolis once had
        more than 500 miles of streetcar lines, all privately operated. The
        local government took over the lines -- and killed them in 1954 to
        replace the system with buses.

        I wish I could have seen the old system. I take the light rail, most
        of the 20 miles, from our apartment to the Metrodome on my way to
        campus. The new house will cut my time to campus in half or better.

        I'm not much for cities, anymore. I think cities are interesting when
        you are young and care for all the activity. Now, I just want to sit
        by the Mississippi or one of the lakes and relax. The nice thing
        about Minneapolis is that even with so many people, there are lots of
        little areas that seem like the country.


        - C. S. Wyatt
        I am what I am at this moment, not what I was and certainly not all
        that I shall be.
        http://www.tameri.com - Tameri Guide for Writers
        http://www.tameri.com/csw/exist - The Existential Primer
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