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distemper

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  • mer_e_jo
    Louise, by nature and carefully inculcated fear, I m a slow-to-anger type. I can honestly say that now, after mostly keeping my temper in check after so many
    Message 1 of 14 , Jan 19, 2006
      Louise, by nature and carefully inculcated fear, I'm a slow-to-anger
      type. I can honestly say that now, after mostly keeping my temper in
      check after so many years, I'm easily provoked by the slightest
      intimation of anyone telling me how to think or act, especially my
      spawn. Though I must admit it takes longer for the youngest to harass
      me. Of course, I can't forget those rare occasions when I threw
      groceries at my ex-husband or emptied bookshelves onto the floor with
      amazing efficiency. And then, there was my constant sarcasm.

      I wish you the luck of the Irish, not their temper :-) Mer
    • peno hardesty
      perhaps the reason thaat so many of us are easy to anger today is due in part to the political climate we live in today-----dissension of any kind is termed
      Message 2 of 14 , Jan 19, 2006
        perhaps the reason thaat so many of us are easy to
        anger today is due in part to the political climate we
        live in today-----dissension of any kind is termed
        "unpatriotic" bordering on "treason"---individual
        thought is suspect and anything contrary to "right
        wing evangelical" thought is "evil"--- my ex husband
        suggested that i was crazy every day and knew how to
        trigger me----he was a master manipulator and some of
        the children are his clones---we sometimes forget that
        home is not always safe and tolerant--and so when our
        "safe house" becomes part of the outside world it is
        hard to disconnect from the frustrations and
        injustices of society-------just a thought---maybe i
        am just seeking validation for my own behavior and
        anger----p

        --- mer_e_jo <mer_e_jo@...> wrote:

        > Louise, by nature and carefully inculcated fear, I'm
        > a slow-to-anger
        > type. I can honestly say that now, after mostly
        > keeping my temper in
        > check after so many years, I'm easily provoked by
        > the slightest
        > intimation of anyone telling me how to think or act,
        > especially my
        > spawn. Though I must admit it takes longer for the
        > youngest to harass
        > me. Of course, I can't forget those rare occasions
        > when I threw
        > groceries at my ex-husband or emptied bookshelves
        > onto the floor with
        > amazing efficiency. And then, there was my constant
        > sarcasm.
        >
        > I wish you the luck of the Irish, not their temper
        > :-) Mer
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >


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      • greg goodwin
        I m uncertain where you re from but I still live in the land of the free and the home of the brave . We still have the right to free speech, if you choose not
        Message 3 of 14 , Jan 20, 2006
          I'm uncertain where you're from but I still live in
          "the land of the free and the home of the brave". We
          still have the right to free speech, if you choose not
          to utilize this facet of our lives that too, is your
          choice.
          Regretfully, I voted for our current administration
          but finally, after the question being brought in in
          general live conversation, I delved into finding facts
          about spending. What facts there are are limited and
          without much explanation, all I really found was the
          current admin has spent millions more (amounts ajusted
          for time perionds) that any previous administration,
          even during previous wars. Is till think given the
          option, I made the right choice!!!

          I will agree with you about the safety of home in
          todays society, we have become a target wherever we
          may be. Far too many people think nothing will happen
          to them and if it happens close, ignore it and they
          won't be bothered. Sooner or later, if "thugness"
          continues everyone will be or "have been" affected in
          someway. People need to look out for each other!!!

          Sorry to hear about your ex, but some people have
          nothing if not fear and intimidation on their side,
          hmmm, wonder if he was the ever appealing (in feminine
          eyes) "bad boy" in younger days?

          G


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        • Bobconkawi@aol.com
          Is this existenial thought? I understand one notion expressed by Sarte and Camus was that we took responsiblity for our choices and accepted the consequences.
          Message 4 of 14 , Jan 20, 2006
            Is this existenial thought? I understand one notion expressed by Sarte and Camus was that we took responsiblity for our choices and accepted the consequences. Hence, you voted for the guy who went to war based on misinformation and caused thousands to die, hence you will accept your responsiblity. What do you plan to do to correct your choice? There is not"right" or "wrong" about it; there is only fact and consequence---that is if you are thinking like an existentialist. You do understand that politics and religion are based on the same premise, right? --Bob

            -----Original Message-----
            From: greg goodwin <ggoodwin56@...>
            To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 06:35:34 -0800 (PST)
            Subject: Re: [existlist] distemper


            I'm uncertain where you're from but I still live in
            "the land of the free and the home of the brave". We
            still have the right to free speech, if you choose not
            to utilize this facet of our lives that too, is your
            choice.
            Regretfully, I voted for our current administration
            but finally, after the question being brought in in
            general live conversation, I delved into finding facts
            about spending. What facts there are are limited and
            without much explanation, all I really found was the
            current admin has spent millions more (amounts ajusted
            for time perionds) that any previous administration,
            even during previous wars. Is till think given the
            option, I made the right choice!!!

            I will agree with you about the safety of home in
            todays society, we have become a target wherever we
            may be. Far too many people think nothing will happen
            to them and if it happens close, ignore it and they
            won't be bothered. Sooner or later, if "thugness"
            continues everyone will be or "have been" affected in
            someway. People need to look out for each other!!!

            Sorry to hear about your ex, but some people have
            nothing if not fear and intimidation on their side,
            hmmm, wonder if he was the ever appealing (in feminine
            eyes) "bad boy" in younger days?

            G


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            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • louise
            ... i know i do that, temporarily - seek validation, though often without conscious awareness at the time (these phrases to describe our experience of being
            Message 5 of 14 , Jan 20, 2006
              --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, peno hardesty
              <seekfinddiscover@y...> wrote:
              >
              > perhaps the reason thaat so many of us are easy to
              > anger today is due in part to the political climate we
              > live in today-----dissension of any kind is termed
              > "unpatriotic" bordering on "treason"---individual
              > thought is suspect and anything contrary to "right
              > wing evangelical" thought is "evil"--- my ex husband
              > suggested that i was crazy every day and knew how to
              > trigger me----he was a master manipulator and some of
              > the children are his clones---we sometimes forget that
              > home is not always safe and tolerant--and so when our
              > "safe house" becomes part of the outside world it is
              > hard to disconnect from the frustrations and
              > injustices of society-------just a thought---maybe i
              > am just seeking validation for my own behavior and
              > anger----p


              i know i do that, temporarily - seek validation, though often
              without conscious awareness at the time (these phrases to describe
              our experience of being here thinking alive, how impossible i find,
              to settle on terms of description i can trust, not to go astray).
              anyway, my motive has consistently been the same - whenever
              frightened, for my physical safety or my sanity or my general
              capacity to get by from day to day, fulfil legal and domestic
              obligations, etc. - to stall, discover, find my way, back, to memory
              and selfhood. freedom of speech about unusual experiences and
              beliefs - considered 'illness' by the majority - that has been one
              area of intellectual interest to me. the intensity of that
              interest, how hard i had to fight, for my ideas, once exchanging
              posts with fellow-existers, fellow-readers, via internet medium,
              that took me completely by surprise.

              louise
              ... tending to lunar
            • Exist List Moderator
              ... This statement reflects a general misunderstanding of history. U.S. and European politics were much meaner in the nineteenth and early twentieth
              Message 6 of 14 , Jan 20, 2006
                On Jan 19, 2006, at 18:13, peno hardesty wrote:

                > perhaps the reason thaat so many of us are easy to
                > anger today is due in part to the political climate we
                > live in today-----dissension of any kind is termed
                > "unpatriotic" bordering on "treason"

                This statement reflects a general misunderstanding of history. U.S. and
                European politics were much "meaner" in the nineteenth and early
                twentieth centuries. There were riots throughout both continents, as
                unions literally fought police and hired thugs. The Ford Motor Company
                gained notoriety when the Pinkerton Detectives killed several pro-union
                employees.

                You want nasty? Hearst Newspapers, under Wm. Randolph Hearst, called
                for the assassination of President McKinley. Teddy Roosevelt was
                attacked constantly in the New York Sun and other papers, implying he
                was unstable and sexually questionable (light in his boots). Anyone
                aware of Bierce, Mencken, Marquis, and other practitioners of yellow
                journalism knows how cruel the press was in the past.

                There were duels between senators, congressmen fought in the well of
                the house, and the public was entertained by rumors of illegitimate
                children (and some admissions of such children), inter-racial affairs,
                homosexuality, and even satanism.

                So, no, things aren't nearly as bad politically as people want to
                claim. How easily people forget the 1968 or 1964 campaigns. Nothing
                like a mushroom cloud as a political ad. And people have long forgotten
                that it was the Republicans who led the vote for the Voting Rights Act,
                not the Democrats of the 1960s. The parties changed stripes by 1972,
                but the Dixiecrats were not Republicans.

                > thought is suspect and anything contrary to "right
                > wing evangelical" thought is "evil"--- my ex husband
                > suggested that i was crazy every day and knew how to
                > trigger me----he was a master manipulator and some of
                > the children are his clones

                No idea what this has to do with politics... but it has a lot to do
                with philosophy / psychology.

                You are always free -- always. The notion that you are not free is to
                admit you have chosen others as more important than yourself. I
                understand a parent making this choice, but it is still a choice. You
                are free to reject any thought, any suggestion and any manipulation. If
                you are manipulated, that is a matter of self or psychology.

                Freedom means you are free to walk away, free to debate, and even free
                to die for what you think is just, moral, and ethical. As long as you
                are not mentally impaired, something even Sartre stipulated, then you
                are responsible for yourself and your choices in any relationship or
                interaction.

                - C. S. Wyatt
                I am what I am at this moment, not what I was and certainly not all
                that I shall be.
                http://www.tameri.com - Tameri Guide for Writers
                http://www.tameri.com/csw/exist - The Existential Primer
              • greg goodwin
                You pose some interesting thoughts! to correct my choice ? Hmm, why, nothing! My previous choice was made in good faith as will my next such decisions, even
                Message 7 of 14 , Jan 22, 2006
                  You pose some interesting thoughts!
                  "to correct my choice"?
                  Hmm, why, nothing!
                  My previous choice was made in good faith as will my
                  next such decisions, even amid further misinformation.
                  For whatever reason, people cannot simply be real.
                  It's all about some preconceived image and what people
                  think others will think added to a belief that soemone
                  will do for them. Guess that's why I really don't care
                  for 'professional politicians'.

                  (Borrowed but fitting)
                  Without me, I am nothing
                  Withour you, I am alone

                  G



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                • Gary Geiser
                  the land of the free and the home of the brave . This is just the sentiment of what were farmers with their own land in the 18th century. It would have been
                  Message 8 of 14 , Jan 22, 2006
                    "the land of the free and the home of the brave".

                    This is just the sentiment of what were farmers with their own land in the 18th century.

                    It would have been better had America had the guilds Europe had.

                    At least the guilds have given Europe social complexity today, i.e. a sense of community.

                    What is an American? Prison or get on your bike. That's about it.



                    greg goodwin <ggoodwin56@...> wrote:
                    I'm uncertain where you're from but I still live in
                    "the land of the free and the home of the brave". We
                    still have the right to free speech, if you choose not
                    to utilize this facet of our lives that too, is your
                    choice.
                    Regretfully, I voted for our current administration
                    but finally, after the question being brought in in
                    general live conversation, I delved into finding facts
                    about spending. What facts there are are limited and
                    without much explanation, all I really found was the
                    current admin has spent millions more (amounts ajusted
                    for time perionds) that any previous administration,
                    even during previous wars. Is till think given the
                    option, I made the right choice!!!

                    I will agree with you about the safety of home in
                    todays society, we have become a target wherever we
                    may be. Far too many people think nothing will happen
                    to them and if it happens close, ignore it and they
                    won't be bothered. Sooner or later, if "thugness"
                    continues everyone will be or "have been" affected in
                    someway. People need to look out for each other!!!

                    Sorry to hear about your ex, but some people have
                    nothing if not fear and intimidation on their side,
                    hmmm, wonder if he was the ever appealing (in feminine
                    eyes) "bad boy" in younger days?

                    G


                    __________________________________________________
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                    Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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                    Home Page: http://www.tameri.com/csw/exist



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                  • mer_e_jo
                    ... POPPYCOCK. It s idealism. Just a song. Will really God Save the Queen? ... in the 18th century. BALDERDASH. Not factual. ... At least the guilds have given
                    Message 9 of 14 , Jan 22, 2006
                      --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, Gary Geiser <aahouse10@y...> wrote:

                      >"the land of the free and the home of the brave".

                      POPPYCOCK. It's idealism. Just a song. Will really God Save the Queen?

                      >This is just the sentiment of what were farmers with their own land
                      in the 18th century.

                      BALDERDASH. Not factual.

                      >It would have been better had America had the guilds Europe had.
                      At least the guilds have given Europe social complexity today, i.e.
                      a sense of community.

                      MALARKEY. If guilds were so great, where are they? America is too
                      socially complex. Sense of community is relative, even in many
                      communities.

                      >What is an American? Prison or get on your bike. That's about it.

                      SIMPLISTIC.

                      But you're entitled to your opinion. It has nothing to do with
                      tolerance.

                      Mary
                    • greg goodwin
                      It s all relative, basically a state of mind speak. To agree or disagree is meaningless if everyone felt/acted the same what a boring existence it would be,
                      Message 10 of 14 , Jan 23, 2006
                        It's all relative, basically a state of mind speak.
                        To agree or disagree is meaningless if everyone
                        felt/acted the same what a boring existence it would
                        be, more so even than it is now!!!~!


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                      • Susan Schnelbach
                        I disagree. Weren t the guilds pre-cursers of the modern union movement. Europe is so locked up in unions that there is no freedom or free will anymore. Also,
                        Message 11 of 14 , Jan 23, 2006
                          I disagree. Weren't the guilds pre-cursers of the modern union
                          movement. Europe is so locked up in unions that there is no freedom
                          or free will anymore. Also, wouldn't a guild system hinder a rise of
                          the middle class by locking people into pre-defined career paths?
                          Actually, some of the older unions in America did the same thing.

                          Or maybe I'm looking too far back into history.



                          On Jan 22, 2006, at 6:32 PM, Gary Geiser wrote:

                          > "the land of the free and the home of the brave".
                          >
                          > This is just the sentiment of what were farmers with their own
                          > land in the 18th century.
                          >
                          > It would have been better had America had the guilds Europe had.
                          >
                          > At least the guilds have given Europe social complexity today,
                          > i.e. a sense of community.
                          >
                          > What is an American? Prison or get on your bike. That's about it.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > greg goodwin <ggoodwin56@...> wrote:
                          > I'm uncertain where you're from but I still live in
                          > "the land of the free and the home of the brave". We
                          > still have the right to free speech, if you choose not
                          > to utilize this facet of our lives that too, is your
                          > choice.
                          > Regretfully, I voted for our current administration
                          > but finally, after the question being brought in in
                          > general live conversation, I delved into finding facts
                          > about spending. What facts there are are limited and
                          > without much explanation, all I really found was the
                          > current admin has spent millions more (amounts ajusted
                          > for time perionds) that any previous administration,
                          > even during previous wars. Is till think given the
                          > option, I made the right choice!!!
                          >
                          > I will agree with you about the safety of home in
                          > todays society, we have become a target wherever we
                          > may be. Far too many people think nothing will happen
                          > to them and if it happens close, ignore it and they
                          > won't be bothered. Sooner or later, if "thugness"
                          > continues everyone will be or "have been" affected in
                          > someway. People need to look out for each other!!!
                          >
                          > Sorry to hear about your ex, but some people have
                          > nothing if not fear and intimidation on their side,
                          > hmmm, wonder if he was the ever appealing (in feminine
                          > eyes) "bad boy" in younger days?
                          >
                          > G
                          >
                          >
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                          >
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                          >
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                          >
                          >
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                        • Gary Geiser
                          You shouldn t begin from abstractions. Just look at the farmer who owns his own land. Pre-metaphysical, realistic, crude, barbarically anti-social,
                          Message 12 of 14 , Jan 25, 2006
                            You shouldn't begin from abstractions. Just look at the farmer who owns his own land. Pre-metaphysical, realistic, crude, barbarically anti-social, individualistic, anti-intellectual.

                            Now look at an American.

                            Susan Schnelbach <susan@...> wrote:
                            I disagree. Weren't the guilds pre-cursers of the modern union
                            movement. Europe is so locked up in unions that there is no freedom
                            or free will anymore. Also, wouldn't a guild system hinder a rise of
                            the middle class by locking people into pre-defined career paths?
                            Actually, some of the older unions in America did the same thing.

                            Or maybe I'm looking too far back into history.



                            On Jan 22, 2006, at 6:32 PM, Gary Geiser wrote:

                            > "the land of the free and the home of the brave".
                            >
                            > This is just the sentiment of what were farmers with their own
                            > land in the 18th century.
                            >
                            > It would have been better had America had the guilds Europe had.
                            >
                            > At least the guilds have given Europe social complexity today,
                            > i.e. a sense of community.
                            >
                            > What is an American? Prison or get on your bike. That's about it.
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > greg goodwin <ggoodwin56@...> wrote:
                            > I'm uncertain where you're from but I still live in
                            > "the land of the free and the home of the brave". We
                            > still have the right to free speech, if you choose not
                            > to utilize this facet of our lives that too, is your
                            > choice.
                            > Regretfully, I voted for our current administration
                            > but finally, after the question being brought in in
                            > general live conversation, I delved into finding facts
                            > about spending. What facts there are are limited and
                            > without much explanation, all I really found was the
                            > current admin has spent millions more (amounts ajusted
                            > for time perionds) that any previous administration,
                            > even during previous wars. Is till think given the
                            > option, I made the right choice!!!
                            >
                            > I will agree with you about the safety of home in
                            > todays society, we have become a target wherever we
                            > may be. Far too many people think nothing will happen
                            > to them and if it happens close, ignore it and they
                            > won't be bothered. Sooner or later, if "thugness"
                            > continues everyone will be or "have been" affected in
                            > someway. People need to look out for each other!!!
                            >
                            > Sorry to hear about your ex, but some people have
                            > nothing if not fear and intimidation on their side,
                            > hmmm, wonder if he was the ever appealing (in feminine
                            > eyes) "bad boy" in younger days?
                            >
                            > G
                            >
                            >
                            > __________________________________________________
                            > Do You Yahoo!?
                            > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
                            > http://mail.yahoo.com
                            >
                            >
                            > Please support the Existential Primer... dedicated to explaining
                            > nothing!
                            >
                            > Home Page: http://www.tameri.com/csw/exist
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > SPONSORED LINKS
                            > Philosophy book Merleau-ponty
                            >
                            > ---------------------------------
                            > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
                            >
                            >
                            > Visit your group "existlist" on the web.
                            >
                            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                            > existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            >
                            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                            > Service.
                            >
                            >
                            > ---------------------------------
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > ---------------------------------
                            > Yahoo! Photos
                            > Ring in the New Year with Photo Calendars. Add photos, events,
                            > holidays, whatever.
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > Please support the Existential Primer... dedicated to explaining
                            > nothing!
                            >
                            > Home Page: http://www.tameri.com/csw/exist
                            > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >



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                          • Exist List Moderator
                            ... You just subscribed my father s family for at least 150 years or so, until the Dust Bowl sent them packing to California. Now, only a handful of the
                            Message 13 of 14 , Jan 27, 2006
                              On Jan 25, 2006, at 21:59, Gary Geiser wrote:

                              > You shouldn't begin from abstractions. Just look at the farmer who
                              > owns his own land. Pre-metaphysical, realistic, crude, barbarically
                              > anti-social, individualistic, anti-intellectual.
                              >

                              You just subscribed my father's family for at least 150 years or so,
                              until the Dust Bowl sent them packing to California. Now, only a
                              handful of the members still farm... but all of them are crude,
                              anti-social, and individualistic.

                              The flip-side is that the family is a social community. Reunions number
                              in the hundreds, up through my generation, and they learned to not rely
                              on any other support. You have to admire that, in some way. Yes, the
                              children were "limited" to remaining in the state, but they always knew
                              a helping hand was within minutes.

                              Oh, well. Now I plan to leave California and toss the family unity
                              thing out the window. Definitely more like my mother's family. I think
                              my mother's family is weakly organized because they were forced to
                              migrate under the worst of circumstances. Any roots in Europe were
                              lost, and no roots were formed here.

                              Sure, it's great to be "individual" all the time, but when you do need
                              help it seems somehow better when it comes from family than some
                              greater social organization that has to take from others to give away
                              goods and services.

                              - C. S. Wyatt
                              I am what I am at this moment, not what I was and certainly not all
                              that I shall be.
                              http://www.tameri.com - Tameri Guide for Writers
                              http://www.tameri.com/csw/exist - The Existential Primer
                            • Robert Keyes
                              The whole argument of what Some small European country does is funny. Get real. Do you know anything about Macro Economics. Do you know what China and India
                              Message 14 of 14 , Feb 8, 2006
                                The whole argument of what Some small European country does is funny.
                                Get real. Do you know anything about Macro Economics. Do you know what China
                                and India are. Do you think you are in an isolated system ? If not ( I hope
                                you think this) then you are affect by my obvious unstated points. (if I
                                have to explain why Indians and Chinese are smart and very numerous I will)
                                Bob. (Humor always)
                                -----Original Message-----
                                From: existlist@yahoogroups.com [mailto:existlist@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                                Of Susan Schnelbach
                                Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 11:42 PM
                                To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [existlist] the brave

                                I disagree. Weren't the guilds pre-cursers of the modern union
                                movement. Europe is so locked up in unions that there is no freedom
                                or free will anymore. Also, wouldn't a guild system hinder a rise of
                                the middle class by locking people into pre-defined career paths?
                                Actually, some of the older unions in America did the same thing.

                                Or maybe I'm looking too far back into history.



                                On Jan 22, 2006, at 6:32 PM, Gary Geiser wrote:

                                > "the land of the free and the home of the brave".
                                >
                                > This is just the sentiment of what were farmers with their own
                                > land in the 18th century.
                                >
                                > It would have been better had America had the guilds Europe had.
                                >
                                > At least the guilds have given Europe social complexity today,
                                > i.e. a sense of community.
                                >
                                > What is an American? Prison or get on your bike. That's about it.
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > greg goodwin <ggoodwin56@...> wrote:
                                > I'm uncertain where you're from but I still live in
                                > "the land of the free and the home of the brave". We
                                > still have the right to free speech, if you choose not
                                > to utilize this facet of our lives that too, is your
                                > choice.
                                > Regretfully, I voted for our current administration
                                > but finally, after the question being brought in in
                                > general live conversation, I delved into finding facts
                                > about spending. What facts there are are limited and
                                > without much explanation, all I really found was the
                                > current admin has spent millions more (amounts ajusted
                                > for time perionds) that any previous administration,
                                > even during previous wars. Is till think given the
                                > option, I made the right choice!!!
                                >
                                > I will agree with you about the safety of home in
                                > todays society, we have become a target wherever we
                                > may be. Far too many people think nothing will happen
                                > to them and if it happens close, ignore it and they
                                > won't be bothered. Sooner or later, if "thugness"
                                > continues everyone will be or "have been" affected in
                                > someway. People need to look out for each other!!!
                                >
                                > Sorry to hear about your ex, but some people have
                                > nothing if not fear and intimidation on their side,
                                > hmmm, wonder if he was the ever appealing (in feminine
                                > eyes) "bad boy" in younger days?
                                >
                                > G
                                >
                                >
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