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forgive my floundering

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  • Mary Jo Malo
    this is adhoc, impromptu, spontaneous or whatever. i feel obligated to contribute something since i m here, but what? grasping for analogies and parallels,
    Message 1 of 4 , Jun 1, 2005
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      this is adhoc, impromptu, spontaneous or whatever. i feel obligated
      to contribute something since i'm here, but what? grasping for
      analogies and parallels, trying to assuage my cynicism and cyclical
      denouement deja vu. childhood disappointments are reinforced with
      ideological disappointments then personal disappointments but life
      wants to go on and drags you with it. often you promote it. ah, then
      existentialism explains it's all about the power you'll never have.
      dealing dasein, is it five-card stud, five-card draw, or the who-what-
      where-why-when of a good story? i know that there is no hope for
      individuals or governments except brute power, and short of that we
      can choose any diversion we feel we can intellectually, emotionally
      or physically afford. existentialism says it's okay to be both a
      victim and a victimizer. spin your own web or get stuck in someone
      else's. both? chessgame? boxing? i could go on."watergate does not
      bother me. does your conscience bother you?"

      courage is deciding
      who you'll play
      on any given day
      now that said
      i can go about my day
      with a smile on my face
      for the whole human race
      it's mostly soliloquy
      here in the colony

      mary
    • mischke@pronetisp.net
      existentialism says it s okay to be both a victim and a victimizer. I don t believe that a responsible exitentialist should ever make conscious choices that
      Message 2 of 4 , Jun 2, 2005
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        "existentialism says it's okay to be both a
        victim and a victimizer."

        I don't believe that a responsible exitentialist should ever make
        conscious choices that will bring harm to others.

        Mischke
      • Mary Jo Malo
        I don t believe you can be a human being and not bring harm to others. Without going into definitions of the words responsible , conscious , or harm ;
        Message 3 of 4 , Jun 2, 2005
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          I don't believe you can be a human being and not bring harm to others.
          Without going into definitions of the words 'responsible', 'conscious',
          or 'harm'; please remember that if you pay taxes, eat, drive a car,
          vote, and many consumer-citizen activities, there are harmful
          consequences. You can't completely separate yourself from a system
          which by its very existence 'victimizes' someone. You could also look
          at the statement, which was kind of spontaneous poetry, as just that.
          Mary

          --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, mischke@p... wrote:
          > "existentialism says it's okay to be both a
          > victim and a victimizer."
          >
          > I don't believe that a responsible exitentialist should ever make
          > conscious choices that will bring harm to others.
          >
          > Mischke
        • louise
          ... others. ... words responsible , conscious , ... car, ... look ... that. ... so maybe these apparently opposed viewpoints could be synthesised:
          Message 4 of 4 , Jun 2, 2005
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            --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, "Mary Jo Malo" <maryjomalo@y...>
            wrote:
            > I don't believe you can be a human being and not bring harm to
            others.
            > Without going into definitions of the
            words 'responsible', 'conscious',
            > or 'harm'; please remember that if you pay taxes, eat, drive a
            car,
            > vote, and many consumer-citizen activities, there are harmful
            > consequences. You can't completely separate yourself from a system
            > which by its very existence 'victimizes' someone. You could also
            look
            > at the statement, which was kind of spontaneous poetry, as just
            that.
            > Mary
            >
            > --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, mischke@p... wrote:
            > > "existentialism says it's okay to be both a
            > > victim and a victimizer."
            > >
            > > I don't believe that a responsible exitentialist should ever make
            > > conscious choices that will bring harm to others.
            > >
            > > Mischke

            so maybe these apparently opposed viewpoints could be synthesised:

            "existentialism allows that the human individual cannot avoid
            harming and being harmed, yet forbids the lazy assumption that one
            is not responsible for unintended harm."

            that i think would be the most rigorous ethical demand. very
            Kierkegaardian territory. no wonder most of the species cops out.
            the screaming really is enough to knock God unconscious. i believe
            that. death's something else though.

            Louise
            ... revelling in the voice of Howard Devoto right now ...
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