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Re: [existlist] Re: Knowledge

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  • LeeEdgarTyler@aol.com
    In a message dated 1/31/2004 9:30:56 PM Central Standard Time, alcyon11@yahoo.com writes: Don t you think that people simply use the word believe when they
    Message 1 of 12 , Jan 31, 2004
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      In a message dated 1/31/2004 9:30:56 PM Central Standard Time,
      alcyon11@... writes:

      Don't you think that people simply use the word "believe" when they
      mean "think"? I'm sure it's careless, and I do it quite often. I
      think that the chair will hold me, and I believe the chair will hold
      me seem similar in meaning. When it comes to ideas and philosophy, if
      we say we believe something is true, it seems to draw a negative
      reaction. I get tired of using the same words, so I like to try what
      I think/believe are words of similar meaning. When we say, such and
      such, without the qualifier "I think" or "I believe" or "I feel
      that", people think we're arrogant and stating a fact; when all we're
      doing is stating an opinion. There's another one: "in my opinion". I
      think if we put it in the context of what's being said, it shouldn't
      be confusing. Am I assuming too much? I don't know.

      Mary Jo

      Reminds me of the old joke, "Everybody's got to believe in something and I
      believe I'll have another beer."
      IOW, you're not asuming too much at all. The word "believe" just has a
      fairly broad semantic range and there is nothing at all careless about using it
      as you do.
      Ed Tyler

      http://hometown.aol.com/leeedgartyler/myhomepage/index.html


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Mary Jo Malo
      Thanks Ed. Mary Jo ... they ... hold ... if ... what ... and ... we re ... I ... shouldn t ... something and I ... has a ... about using it
      Message 2 of 12 , Feb 1, 2004
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        Thanks Ed.

        Mary Jo

        --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, LeeEdgarTyler@a... wrote:
        > In a message dated 1/31/2004 9:30:56 PM Central Standard Time,
        > alcyon11@y... writes:
        >
        > Don't you think that people simply use the word "believe" when
        they
        > mean "think"? I'm sure it's careless, and I do it quite often. I
        > think that the chair will hold me, and I believe the chair will
        hold
        > me seem similar in meaning. When it comes to ideas and philosophy,
        if
        > we say we believe something is true, it seems to draw a negative
        > reaction. I get tired of using the same words, so I like to try
        what
        > I think/believe are words of similar meaning. When we say, such
        and
        > such, without the qualifier "I think" or "I believe" or "I feel
        > that", people think we're arrogant and stating a fact; when all
        we're
        > doing is stating an opinion. There's another one: "in my opinion".
        I
        > think if we put it in the context of what's being said, it
        shouldn't
        > be confusing. Am I assuming too much? I don't know.
        >
        > Mary Jo
        >
        > Reminds me of the old joke, "Everybody's got to believe in
        something and I
        > believe I'll have another beer."
        > IOW, you're not asuming too much at all. The word "believe" just
        has a
        > fairly broad semantic range and there is nothing at all careless
        about using it
        > as you do.
        > Ed Tyler
        >
        > http://hometown.aol.com/leeedgartyler/myhomepage/index.html
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Nicole Schultheis
        Hi Mary Jo. I have been plugging away at The White Goddess, but confess I sometimes feel as lost as one of our hapless clients.* My junior high school era
        Message 3 of 12 , Feb 1, 2004
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          Hi Mary Jo. I have been plugging away at The White Goddess, but confess I
          sometimes feel as lost as one of our hapless clients.* My junior high
          school era knowledge of Greek mythology ill prepared me for this, but I am
          making progress and it is worth it.

          Meanwhile, my educated friends are egging me on. So, lined up next is the
          one-volume version of The Golden Bough, and then From Ritual to Romance.
          There is much to be learned from the not-quite-right.

          On the fiction front, the Toni Morrison one you recommended is still waiting
          for me at bedside. I got diverted by The DaVinca Code (me and everyone I
          know) and simultaneously I stumbled across some poetry by Rumi, then fell
          headlong into sufiism (or is it sufism), and then --- at that precise
          moment --- a cousin turned up who had returned from Israel to bury his
          mother, and tells me he has rejected the New Testament, converted to
          judaism, and is a student of the Dead Sea Scrolls and of the kabbala, and
          tells me, by the way, that in a trip to France in the 60s with our
          grandmother our aged cousins confirmed to him that we're descended from the
          Merovingians. He and I spend several loopy evenings together. He leaves me
          with his copper scroll archeology proposal and now I know more than I ever
          knew I wanted to know about the use and meaning of certain Hebrew letters.
          I astonish him with the meager amount of info I spew back at him, and
          finally confess it is from reading the DaVinci Code, but he is still
          impressed so I give him my copy. We were close once, as children. Our
          recent reacquaintance was serendipidous**.

          Meanwhile, on my mp3 player is Jung's Memories, Dream, Reflections. Tried
          to buy Synchronicity and Man and his Symbols but the used book sellers I
          tried to get them from on Amazon.com turned out not to have them and i keep
          forgetting to reorder.

          Going around in circles here. Serendipities, synchonicities, and in physics
          the revelation that our universe comes from parallel planes colliding and
          creating the dust which evolved into what we see through the Hubble's eye...
          and in that universe in which we perceive that we live is cognizance of
          parallel kinds of knowledge -- the logical and the spiritual, neither
          entirely correct, and neither entirely wrong*** -- and also... a persistent
          sense of the female/male duality of the creator, and of ourselves emperiled
          by our persistent refusal to acknowledge them as one and the same and at the
          same time as equal twinned forces, dangerous if uncoupled...

          and ...

          now...

          i'm not just going in circles but spinning like an electron... in quantum
          space.

          Where the heck does that leave one?

          Suddenly life is too short and there is WAAAAYYY too much reading to do. Or
          maybe I should get up off my ever-broadening butt and drive my kid to her
          playdate before she beams me.

          __________
          *There was this guy on vacation who was encouraged to jump into the Nile
          from his tourist boat without a life preserver. His survivors wished to
          pursue the matter, but we too found ourselves in a swiftly flowing river --
          immersed in a completely alien world without any recognizable form of legal
          recourse.

          **See http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/040202/misc/2serendipity.htm. The
          print version has that terrific painting reproduced in it, The Three Princes
          of Serendip. This led me to http://livingheritage.org/three_princes.htm.
          And of course to Umberto Eco's Serendipities.... and then Amazon.com tell
          you it thinks you should also read Baudolino (and i forget who recommended
          that, wasn't me, have not read it yet) ... and then suddenly what pops to
          mind is Daniel Boorstin's 1961 treatise, The Image: A Guide to Pseudo-events
          in America (which Bernadine Healy refers to in her current piece about
          funding sex research in US News & World Report, 2/4/04), and now suddenly I
          am a lawyer again, thinking about "the litigation crisis" as yet another one
          of those artifically created pseudoevents -- see this editorial, at
          http://www.lowcountrynow.com/stories/012304/LOCrose.shtml: "Tort reform
          issues should be argued dispassionately with due respect for the truth. But
          because the facts are not on the side of those advocating reform, they
          resort to myths and distortions to scare the American public into giving up
          their rights."

          Whoa, doggies. I am trying to write FICTION about truth and falsehood but
          the false REALITY I keep having to live in keeps interfering with my reading
          list.

          ***
          xxvii
          Alike for those who for TO-DAY prepare,
          And those that after some TO-MORROW stare,
          A Muezzin from the Tower of Darkness cries,
          "Fools! your Reward is neither Here nor There!"

          xxx
          Myself when young did eagerly frequent
          Doctor and Saint, and heard great argument
          About it and about: but evermore
          Came out by the same door as in I went.

          (a prize for s/he who knows the source of these two quatrains.)


          Nicole

          > on 31/1/04 0:53, Mary Jo Malo at alcyon11@... wrote:
          >
          > Hello Nicole,
          >
          > It's been awhile. I'm reading "Baudolino" which I believe you
          > recommended, but not much else I'm ashamed to say. I have read some
          > of the others you recommended in the past however. Have you read any
          > of my picks? Please stay in touch. Variety is the spice of life! I
          > think last we talked I mentioned "Cold Mountain" was being made. Now
          > it's out in theaters and highly recommended. It was the author's
          > first book I believe. What a talented and lucky writer.
          >
          > Mary Jo
        • bhvwd
          Stickbass, I have no idea of the extent of your knowledge base , but your intent sounds like a search that this group could support. There are creatures that
          Message 4 of 12 , Feb 16, 2004
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            Stickbass, I have no idea of the extent of your knowledge base , but
            your intent sounds like a search that this group could support. There
            are creatures that lurk in these here woods that reject the very
            concept of reality. You could wake one in your questionings. The only
            repellent I have found is knowing exactly what the hell you are
            talking about, word by tedious word. Bill
          • stickbass1@comcast.net
            Bill, Thank you for the heads up .I have encountered those kind of creatures before...but not yet on the internet... I bet some hair-raising stories could be
            Message 5 of 12 , Feb 16, 2004
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              Bill,
              Thank you for the "heads up".I have encountered those kind of creatures before...but not yet on the internet... I bet some hair-raising stories could be told.

              Bryan
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: bhvwd
              To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Monday, February 16, 2004 7:23 PM
              Subject: [existlist] Knowledge


              Stickbass, I have no idea of the extent of your knowledge base , but
              your intent sounds like a search that this group could support. There
              are creatures that lurk in these here woods that reject the very
              concept of reality. You could wake one in your questionings. The only
              repellent I have found is knowing exactly what the hell you are
              talking about, word by tedious word. Bill



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