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Re: [existlist] Woody Allen lost in space

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  • George Walton
    Eduard, Well, Mary Jo is still my muse in here, of course, but you are almost in the top 10. Number 12, in fact, as of this morning. Biggie eduard at home
    Message 1 of 4 , Dec 1, 2003
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      Eduard,

      Well, Mary Jo is still my muse in here, of course, but you are almost in the top 10. Number 12, in fact, as of this morning.



      Biggie

      eduard at home <yeoman@...> wrote:
      Thanks biggie ... I enjoyed that ...

      eduard

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "iambiguously" <iambiguously@...>
      To: <existlist@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 5:41 PM
      Subject: [existlist] Woody Allen lost in space


      > From Richard Schickel's, "Woody Allen: A Life in Film":
      >
      > Schickel:
      >
      > "In 'Shadows and Fog' there's an exchange you and Mia
      have about
      > certainty----you're looking up at the stars and she's
      saying, 'That
      > star could be dead,' and it comes as a shock to the
      character. The
      > light is coming down but the star [might] be dead, Is
      certainty
      > something that you miss and want and can't have?"
      >
      > Allen:
      >
      > "Sure. You know, you can never resolve the epistemological
      > conundrum. I once did a joke a long time ago about having
      to take
      > God's existence on faith, and then I realized that I had
      to take my
      > own existence on faith. And that really is the
      truth---that you
      > can't be certain about anything.
      >
      > "I mean, you're in such a precarious position. We're all
      given this
      > spectacular denial system, and also a mind that puts all
      this chaos
      > in order. But the truth of the matter is, if you stop and
      think
      > about it, or lie on your pillow at three o'clock in the
      morning when
      > you can't sleep and think about it....the certainty of
      everything is
      > very dicey. I mean, you know a lot less than you think you
      know"
      >
      > Earlier in introducing the interview, Schickel notes the
      many
      > demographic factors that align him and Allen. But the real
      > connection is something much more profound:
      >
      > "This says nothing about the things we quite independently
      learned
      > to distrust---organized religion, conventional [or
      revolutionary
      > politics], corporate America, faddish self-improvement
      [technigues].
      > We are, I think, most basically existentialists, haunted
      by death,
      > the silence of the universe, the absence of God, dependent
      on work
      > to distract us from the surrounding nothingness, yet
      glumly
      > convinced that it too is just a way to pass the time
      between the
      > cradle to the grave."
      >
      > There are really two very different ways to approach
      existentialism.
      > The first is one most embrace: a philosophy by which to
      actually
      > embrace the uncertainties of life in a positive and
      constructive and
      > life-affirming manner. We are, the party line goes,
      unshackled from
      > the metaphysical claptrap of God and Reason; we can now
      choose a
      > more authentic path as more authentic individuals making
      more
      > authentic choices in a more authentic world. And, up to a
      point,
      > this is certainly true...and a vast improvement over the
      post
      > Kantian logo-centric bullshit that is, for all intents and
      purposes,
      > modern philosophy.
      >
      > But I always suspected Allen saw through all this as just
      another
      > layer of rationalization---as, in fact, merely an aspect
      of human
      > psychology more than anything else. Human existence is,
      push coming
      > to shove [before the maw of oblivion], essentially
      meaningless and
      > absurd; and we cannot make an exception to this rule
      regarding our
      > own sense of "self". Out in the real world, it seems,
      human identity
      > for the vast majority of folks is either inherited from
      those who
      > indoctrinated them as children [or enticed them as adults
      in the
      > marketplace] or it is a con game in which "I" become the
      conjurer of
      > choice. Or as Saul Bellows once succinctly put it, "While
      the
      > unexamined life may on be worth living, the examined one
      can be
      > sheer hell".
      >
      > So most don't. Not really.
      >
      > There is only one antedote and that is a life filled with
      > distractions. Without passionaite diversions to misdirect
      the mind
      > into a day to day smorgasbord of "doing", a thinking man
      or woman
      > will be unable to endure the horror that is behind human
      existence.
      >
      > Not to mention the horror that is embedded in the part
      where it all
      > ends. Forever and ever.
      >
      > Or as Allen once joked at [I believe] the end of Annie
      Hall, "a guy
      > walks into a restaurant and orders a meal; afterwards,
      when asked
      > his opinion of it he says, 'well the food tasted
      terrible...and the
      > portion was so small!'.
      >
      > How true, eh?
      >
      > biggie
      >
      >
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      >


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    • drQ
      Yes, how true. ... From: iambiguously To: existlist@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 1:41 AM Subject: [existlist] Woody Allen lost in space From
      Message 2 of 4 , Dec 1, 2003
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        Yes, how true.
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: iambiguously
        To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 1:41 AM
        Subject: [existlist] Woody Allen lost in space


        From Richard Schickel's, "Woody Allen: A Life in Film":

        Schickel:

        "In 'Shadows and Fog' there's an exchange you and Mia have about
        certainty----you're looking up at the stars and she's saying, 'That
        star could be dead,' and it comes as a shock to the character. The
        light is coming down but the star [might] be dead, Is certainty
        something that you miss and want and can't have?"

        Allen:

        "Sure. You know, you can never resolve the epistemological
        conundrum. I once did a joke a long time ago about having to take
        God's existence on faith, and then I realized that I had to take my
        own existence on faith. And that really is the truth---that you
        can't be certain about anything.

        "I mean, you're in such a precarious position. We're all given this
        spectacular denial system, and also a mind that puts all this chaos
        in order. But the truth of the matter is, if you stop and think
        about it, or lie on your pillow at three o'clock in the morning when
        you can't sleep and think about it....the certainty of everything is
        very dicey. I mean, you know a lot less than you think you know"

        Earlier in introducing the interview, Schickel notes the many
        demographic factors that align him and Allen. But the real
        connection is something much more profound:

        "This says nothing about the things we quite independently learned
        to distrust---organized religion, conventional [or revolutionary
        politics], corporate America, faddish self-improvement [technigues].
        We are, I think, most basically existentialists, haunted by death,
        the silence of the universe, the absence of God, dependent on work
        to distract us from the surrounding nothingness, yet glumly
        convinced that it too is just a way to pass the time between the
        cradle to the grave."

        There are really two very different ways to approach existentialism.
        The first is one most embrace: a philosophy by which to actually
        embrace the uncertainties of life in a positive and constructive and
        life-affirming manner. We are, the party line goes, unshackled from
        the metaphysical claptrap of God and Reason; we can now choose a
        more authentic path as more authentic individuals making more
        authentic choices in a more authentic world. And, up to a point,
        this is certainly true...and a vast improvement over the post
        Kantian logo-centric bullshit that is, for all intents and purposes,
        modern philosophy.

        But I always suspected Allen saw through all this as just another
        layer of rationalization---as, in fact, merely an aspect of human
        psychology more than anything else. Human existence is, push coming
        to shove [before the maw of oblivion], essentially meaningless and
        absurd; and we cannot make an exception to this rule regarding our
        own sense of "self". Out in the real world, it seems, human identity
        for the vast majority of folks is either inherited from those who
        indoctrinated them as children [or enticed them as adults in the
        marketplace] or it is a con game in which "I" become the conjurer of
        choice. Or as Saul Bellows once succinctly put it, "While the
        unexamined life may on be worth living, the examined one can be
        sheer hell".

        So most don't. Not really.

        There is only one antedote and that is a life filled with
        distractions. Without passionaite diversions to misdirect the mind
        into a day to day smorgasbord of "doing", a thinking man or woman
        will be unable to endure the horror that is behind human existence.

        Not to mention the horror that is embedded in the part where it all
        ends. Forever and ever.

        Or as Allen once joked at [I believe] the end of Annie Hall, "a guy
        walks into a restaurant and orders a meal; afterwards, when asked
        his opinion of it he says, 'well the food tasted terrible...and the
        portion was so small!'.

        How true, eh?

        biggie



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