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Re: [existlist] Re: Characteristics of Existence

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  • eduard at home
    Biggie, Perhaps it is wishful thinking after reading The Cosmology in Sky and Telescope magazine [suggest you pick up a copy]. As you point out, there are
    Message 1 of 192 , Sep 2, 2003
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      Biggie,

      Perhaps it is wishful thinking after reading "The Cosmology"
      in Sky and Telescope magazine [suggest you pick up a copy].
      As you point out, there are two conflicting views. On the
      one hand science is exposing the known universe out to 13
      billion light years, which should raise the question of
      whether a God who may have produced this universe, is really
      interested in human life forms in some marginal backwater.
      On the other hand, you are right in that people want some
      personal all-father who can respond to their individual
      needs and wants. I just don't think that the Church can
      survive unchanged within this conflict.

      The Existentialist idea of existence is that we do our own
      thing and in this there is the benefit of absolute freedom.
      Yet perhaps "freedom" is frightening, because it implies
      that we are alone. The average person rebels against such
      freedom and associated loneliness. Which is the reason why
      I proposed the franchise of McGods. But then no one really
      wants to acknowledge that they are praying to a fantasy.

      I think I will develop a new philosophy to replace Nooism
      ...

      eduard

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "George Walton" <iambiguously@...>
      To: <existlist@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 7:49 AM
      Subject: Re: [existlist] Re: Characteristics of Existence


      > Eduard,
      >
      > Folks have been predicting the eventual decline of
      "conventional religion" since The Enlightment. Is it gone
      yet? No. Why? Because however more sophisticated science
      becomes in "explaining things naturally", it can't explain
      or obviate the things that matter most to people. I mean,
      why does conventional religion persist even in the belly of
      the Pop Culture beast where the alleged new
      Gods---consumption and celebrity---have in some respects
      eclipsed the old?
      >
      > Because, however much you purchase in the way of gadgits
      and indulge in distractions... and however much you follow
      religiously the marriage of Jennifer and Brad, none of that
      can puncture the true meaning of religion: the benefits
      pacgage. With God you get:
      >
      > Immortality and Paradise
      > Divine Justice
      > Devine Explanations
      > A Script--the Bible
      > Moral Truth
      > Something teleological in which to shovel all the pain
      and suffering in
      >
      > Science can't compete there, can it? In fact, science
      could come out with an exact blueprint, a TOE rationally
      explaining...well...everything, and billions of folks would
      still be religious. The human condition, after all, is
      bursting at the seams with terrible existential truths,
      right? So there will always be a need to subsume it in
      something more substantial and enduring and soothing. God,
      you might say, is the mother of all psychological defense
      mechanisms. Listen to Buffy Saint Marie's haunting rendition
      of Leonard Cohen's song "God is Alive, Magic is Afoot".
      >
      > Hell, even I would believe if I could figure out a way to.
      >
      > Biggie
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > eduard at home <yeoman@...> wrote:
      > Biggie,
      >
      > I must admit that I like religion because of the
      confidence
      > one can have in one's opinion. But I don't see how
      > conventional religion can last much longer into the 21st
      > century.
      >
      > eduard
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "George Walton" <iambiguously@...>
      > To: <existlist@yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Monday, September 01, 2003 12:40 PM
      > Subject: Re: [existlist] Re: Characteristics of Existence
      >
      >
      > > Eduard,
      > >
      > > Golly, given that lots and lots of religious folks
      > absolutely insist that Adam and Eve is the starting point
      of
      > human existence it sort of bears looking into, right? In
      > fact, if you run a poll, most of them, once they have run
      > out of...uh...rational explanations will...uh...hem and
      haw
      > and stammer a bit and then blurt out: "I just know it,
      > that's why!!"
      > >
      > > Really, try it.
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Biggie
      >
      >
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    • louise
      ... to signify or represent the relationship between in my head and out in the world, postmodernism can only be understood contextually in terms of
      Message 192 of 192 , Mar 13, 2005
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        --- In existlist@yahoogroups.com, George Walton <iambiguously@y...>
        wrote:
        > Eduard,
        >
        > Well, as a postmodernist might insists, "like any other word used
        to signify or represent the relationship between in my head and out
        in the world, 'postmodernism' can only be understood contextually in
        terms of particular cultures and political economies."
        >
        > In other words, postmodernism eschews all metaphysical
        contraptions---sacred or secular. They view "reality" in brackets,
        as the manner in which different people interpret different
        circumstantial contexts. Take the word "freedom" for example.
        Mordernists thinkers [usually construed as Kant to the present]
        would attempt to wrap the definition of the word around a binary
        logo-centric ontological contraption: either/or. It was believed,
        therefore, that we could define and grasp Freedom ahistorically.
        That there was an objective, universal manner in which to encompass
        it. That freedom had nothing to do with interpretation, but could
        literally be deduced a priori by The Rational Mind.
        >
        > Postmodernists and poststructuralists debunked that. For them,
        words like "freedom" and "justice" and "good" and "bad" and "right"
        and "wrong" were merely relative "situational interpretations" that
        flowed from the political, economic, social, cultural, and
        historical and interpersonal contexts around which their meaning
        evolved. For example, think of the American Revolutionary War. Think
        of how the monarchy in England grasped the meaning of those words
        above quite differently from most of the Colonists. Or think about
        the how the Colonists viewed the words quite apart from how the
        indigenous Indian tribes did. Or think about how Communists view the
        defintions apart from how capitalists do. Et Cetera.
        >
        > Similarly, right now, I am writing what I think I mean and you are
        reading what you think I'm saying. That's human communication in a
        nutshell. The Modernists, however, will insists that there is an
        objective manner in which these words can be construed. The
        postmodernists, however, never stop laughing when they hear that.
        >
        > In other words: Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha!
        >
        > Biggie
        >
        > eduard at home <yeoman@v...> wrote:
        > Biggie,
        >
        > What is a "postmodernist"??
        >
        > eduard
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: "George Walton" <iambiguously@y...>
        > To: <existlist@yahoogroups.com>
        > Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 8:30 AM
        > Subject: Re: [existlist] Re: Characteristics of Existence
        >
        >
        > > Matt,
        > >
        > > Nothing personal, but I suspect your mind is lost because
        > it doesn't really want to be found. I see that a lot in
        > venues like this.
        > >
        > > Or maybe I'm wrong. Just out of curiosity, how would you
        > differeniate Kant from Hume from Nietzsche from Wittgenstein
        > from Heidegger from Foucault respecting human moral
        > interactions?
        > >
        > > And philosophy is, of course, everywhere. A politician can
        > be completely ignorant and uneducated like the current
        > President of the United States and he is still imbued with
        > the philosophical currents that impregnate human
        > interactions historically. Again, it's like intellectual
        > ether floating all around us. It impacts always. It's just
        > that, as some existentialists and postmodernists like to
        > point out, it is not a metaphysical presence so much as a
        > contextual one.
        > >
        > > Biggie
        >
        >
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