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Re: [existlist] war & PROPHECY !

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  • yeoman
    Rakwena, ... study of religion? ... justice and the ... is certainly the case for Greek mythology and is for Biblical fantasy. That is why they are referred
    Message 1 of 14 , Apr 1, 2003
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      Rakwena,

      > Are you saying there is an element of truth in fantasy?
      > And what aspect of religion are you dabbling in with your
      study of religion?
      > I seem to concentrate on the pragmatic side -pertaining to
      justice and the
      > social order, humanism part of it.

      ---> There is always an element of truth in fantasy. That
      is certainly the case for Greek mythology and is for
      Biblical fantasy. That is why they are referred to as
      metaphors. I tend to read the bible from the psychological
      side. If you want a god experience, then one of the ways is
      to withdraw oxygen supply to the brain. And you can do this
      by climbing up a mountain. Where did Moses go to
      communicate with God -- up a mountain.

      eduard
    • Rakwena Mogoai
      Eduard, ... to withdraw oxygen supply to the brain. And you can do this by climbing up a mountain. Where did Moses go to communicate with God -- up a
      Message 2 of 14 , Apr 1, 2003
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        Eduard,

        Wrote:
        >> If you want a god experience, then one of the ways is
        to withdraw oxygen supply to the brain. And you can do this
        by climbing up a mountain. Where did Moses go to
        communicate with God -- up a mountain.>>

        The mountain that Moses climbed is not that high to induce transient or
        Hypoxic encephalopathy - if that was the case the following would have
        resulted :
        Brain cells are extremely sensitive to oxygen deprivation. Some brain cells
        actually start dying just under five minutes after their oxygen supply is
        cut. As a result, brain hypoxia can kill or cause severe brain damage
        rapidly.

        Moses came back with a vivid and lucid mind and was able to relate his
        encounter to Israel and posterity. So people do encounter and speak with
        God- unfortunately you and I have never been "LUCKY" in that regard. But I
        would 't say the experience is imagined. I once read a book in say 1972 or
        so Title 40 Scientist Affirm/Confirm Their Belief In God - that made me
        doubt my scepticism.
        ###########################################

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      • yeoman
        Rakwena, ... But then once there is a god experience, it is seen as so personal and so linked to the self, that no matter of arguement from outside will change
        Message 3 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
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          Rakwena,

          > The mountain that Moses climbed is not that high to induce transient or
          > Hypoxic encephalopathy - if that was the case the following would have
          > resulted :
          > Brain cells are extremely sensitive to oxygen deprivation. Some brain cells
          > actually start dying just under five minutes after their oxygen supply is
          > cut. As a result, brain hypoxia can kill or cause severe brain damage
          > rapidly.
          >
          > Moses came back with a vivid and lucid mind and was able to relate his
          > encounter to Israel and posterity. So people do encounter and speak with
          > God- unfortunately you and I have never been "LUCKY" in that regard. But I
          > would 't say the experience is imagined. I once read a book in say 1972 or
          > so Title 40 Scientist Affirm/Confirm Their Belief In God - that made me
          > doubt my scepticism.

          ---> It is not a case of removal of oxygen to the extent as to threaten the life of the person. The same applies to the lack of food which Moses would also have. All that is needed is sufficient lack to trigger a transient so that there is a god experience.

          But then once there is a god experience, it is seen as so personal and so linked to the self, that no matter of arguement from outside will change the view of the person who has that experience. It is easy for humans to compartimentalize their thinking so that even a scientist who has training in looking for evidence and proofs, may also fully believe in a god after some experience. We all know of people who go to church on Sunday and learn about loving each other, yet when outside the church they revert to being racists.

          All I was trying to show was the link between temporal lobe transients and god experiences. I do not have the expectation of changing anyone's beliefs.

          eduard


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Lorna Landry
          Eduard, Will lack of oxygen to the brain always bring on a God experience?? I don t know? I can see if bringing on confusion and ultimately, unconsciousness,
          Message 4 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
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            Eduard,

            Will lack of oxygen to the brain always bring on a God experience?? I don't know? I can see if bringing on confusion and ultimately, unconsciousness, but a God experience? Have you tried it??

            Lorna




            yeoman <yeoman@...> wrote:Rakwena,

            > Are you saying there is an element of truth in fantasy?
            > And what aspect of religion are you dabbling in with your
            study of religion?
            > I seem to concentrate on the pragmatic side -pertaining to
            justice and the
            > social order, humanism part of it.

            ---> There is always an element of truth in fantasy. That
            is certainly the case for Greek mythology and is for
            Biblical fantasy. That is why they are referred to as
            metaphors. I tend to read the bible from the psychological
            side. If you want a god experience, then one of the ways is
            to withdraw oxygen supply to the brain. And you can do this
            by climbing up a mountain. Where did Moses go to
            communicate with God -- up a mountain.

            eduard



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          • manicpg
            Will lack of oxygen to the brain always bring on a God experience?? I don t know? I can see if bringing on confusion and ultimately, unconsciousness, but a God
            Message 5 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
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              Will lack of oxygen to the brain always bring on a God experience?? I
              don't know? I can see if bringing on confusion and ultimately,
              unconsciousness, but a God experience? Have you tried it??
              >
              > Lornaoved]


              as omeone who has treid 99 out of 100 drugs, some of which cut off
              the oxygen, raise adrenaline ect... I see beauty...

              The human mind has the power to exist in such a state as that they
              are staring at a combination plastic snapple plastic wrap over the
              cap twisted with the straw wrapper, twisted perfectly around the
              middle point of both peices stacked, a full twist creative movement
              (intellignece), off to the distance in the light as a clear cut image
              of a bird, not describable, sort of in clay, but straw wrap texture,
              shine on the plastic the way it stands, picturesque

              maybe i am crazy. no god still tho.
            • yeoman
              Lorna, It isn t axiomatic. And it is not a complete lack of oxygen, only enough to initiate the transient. I have not tried it. I am working on trying to get
              Message 6 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
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                Lorna,

                It isn't axiomatic. And it is not a complete lack of
                oxygen, only enough to initiate the transient.

                I have not tried it. I am working on trying to get lucid
                dreams, to get to the same point.

                eduard

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "Lorna Landry" <lornalandry@...>
                To: <existlist@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 10:44 AM
                Subject: Re: [existlist] Lack of Oxygen


                >
                > Eduard,
                >
                > Will lack of oxygen to the brain always bring on a God
                experience?? I don't know? I can see if bringing on
                confusion and ultimately, unconsciousness, but a God
                experience? Have you tried it??
                >
                > Lorna
              • timm
                ... How do you cause lucid dreams? Simply by trying to remember to wake up in a dream, or is there more to it than that? And how is dreaming related to
                Message 7 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
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                  > I have not tried it. I am working on trying to get lucid
                  > dreams, to get to the same point.

                  How do you cause lucid dreams? Simply by trying to "remember" to wake up
                  in a dream, or is there more to it than that?

                  And how is dreaming related to temporal lobe transients?

                  -timm

                  > ----- Original Message -----
                  > From: "Lorna Landry" <lornalandry@...>
                  > To: <existlist@yahoogroups.com>
                  > Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 10:44 AM
                  > Subject: Re: [existlist] Lack of Oxygen
                  >
                  >
                  > >
                  > > Eduard,
                  > >
                  > > Will lack of oxygen to the brain always bring on a God
                  > experience?? I don't know? I can see if bringing on
                  > confusion and ultimately, unconsciousness, but a God
                  > experience? Have you tried it??
                  > >
                  > > Lorna
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
                  > (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)
                  >
                  > TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
                  > existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  >
                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                • leeedgartyler@aol.com
                  In a message dated 4/2/2003 5:38:22 AM Central Standard Time, ... I am curious as to why you guys pursue this as a historical event when it seems obvious that
                  Message 8 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
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                    In a message dated 4/2/2003 5:38:22 AM Central Standard Time,
                    yeoman@... writes:

                    > Rakwena,
                    >
                    > >The mountain that Moses climbed is not that high to induce transient or
                    > >Hypoxic encephalopathy - if that was the case the following would have
                    > >resulted :
                    > >Brain cells are extremely sensitive to oxygen deprivation. Some brain
                    > cells
                    > >actually start dying just under five minutes after their oxygen supply is
                    > >cut. As a result, brain hypoxia can kill or cause severe brain damage
                    > >rapidly.
                    > >
                    > >Moses came back with a vivid and lucid mind and was able to relate his
                    > >encounter to Israel and posterity. So people do encounter and speak with
                    > >God- unfortunately you and I have never been "LUCKY" in that regard. But I
                    > >would 't say the experience is imagined. I once read a book in say 1972 or
                    > >so Title 40 Scientist Affirm/Confirm Their Belief In God - that made me
                    > >doubt my scepticism.
                    >
                    > ---> It is not a case of removal of oxygen to the extent as to threaten
                    > the life of the person. The same applies to the lack of food which Moses
                    > would also have. All that is needed is sufficient lack to trigger a
                    > transient so that there is a god experience.
                    >
                    > But then once there is a god experience, it is seen as so personal and so
                    > linked to the self, that no matter of arguement from outside will change
                    > the view of the person who has that experience. It is easy for humans to
                    > compartimentalize their thinking so that even a scientist who has training
                    > in looking for evidence and proofs, may also fully believe in a god after
                    > some experience. We all know of people who go to church on Sunday and
                    > learn about loving each other, yet when outside the church they revert to
                    > being racists.
                    >
                    > All I was trying to show was the link between temporal lobe transients and
                    > god experiences. I do not have the expectation of changing anyone's
                    > beliefs.
                    >
                    > eduard

                    I am curious as to why you guys pursue this as a historical event when it
                    seems obvious that it's a legend of the ancient Hebrews that functions to
                    legitimate their code of laws as divinely inspired.

                    Ed Tyler

                    http://hometown.aol.com/leeedgartyler/myhomepage/index.html



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Tom Hickcox
                    ... In the early 70s I was able to take control of my dreams at times. It was the result of reading Castenada s Journey to Ixtlan & A Separate Reality.
                    Message 9 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
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                      At 14:09 4/2/03, timm wrote:
                      > > I have not tried it. I am working on trying to get lucid
                      > > dreams, to get to the same point.
                      >
                      >How do you cause lucid dreams? Simply by trying to "remember" to wake up
                      >in a dream, or is there more to it than that?
                      >
                      >And how is dreaming related to temporal lobe transients?
                      >
                      >-timm

                      In the early '70s I was able to take control of my dreams at times. It was
                      the result of reading Castenada's "Journey to Ixtlan" & "A Separate
                      Reality." I don't remember specifically what I did & I no longer can
                      control them as well, but it was a result of something in one or both of
                      those books. I know I read Journey first & Separate Reality second. I was
                      not taking any hallucinogens.

                      The control was a big help as I was having semi-nightmares & was able to
                      control them. IIRC, I made a conscious decision in the dream to alter
                      it. The trick is to not think too strongly & wake up.

                      Tommy
                    • yeoman
                      Ed, ... historical event when it ... that functions to ... is that the truth is psycological. eduard
                      Message 10 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
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                        Ed,

                        > I am curious as to why you guys pursue this as a
                        historical event when it
                        > seems obvious that it's a legend of the ancient Hebrews
                        that functions to
                        > legitimate their code of laws as divinely inspired.

                        ---> Because all legends have an origin in truth. My view
                        is that the truth is psycological.

                        eduard
                      • leeedgartyler@aol.com
                        In a message dated 4/2/2003 3:19:41 PM Central Standard Time, ... What does that have to do with oxygen in the brain of a man who never went up a mountain in
                        Message 11 of 14 , Apr 2, 2003
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                          In a message dated 4/2/2003 3:19:41 PM Central Standard Time,
                          yeoman@... writes:

                          >
                          > Ed,
                          >
                          > >I am curious as to why you guys pursue this as a
                          > historical event when it
                          > >seems obvious that it's a legend of the ancient Hebrews
                          > that functions to
                          > >legitimate their code of laws as divinely inspired.
                          >
                          > ---> Because all legends have an origin in truth. My view
                          > is that the truth is psycological.
                          >
                          > eduard
                          >

                          What does that have to do with oxygen in the brain of a man who never went up
                          a mountain in the first place? The tale of Moses bringing the laws down from
                          the mountain is fiction: It never happened. It's an invention of the ancient
                          Hebrew tradition to legitimize their code of laws. Nothing more and nothing
                          less.

                          Ed Tyler

                          http://hometown.aol.com/leeedgartyler/myhomepage/index.html



                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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