Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [existlist] Please read and Follow your heart

Expand Messages
  • Bill Harris
    Eduard, It would seem these women are emotionally involved with what is a political issue. At some threshold level the moralistic juices kick in and it is
    Message 1 of 13 , Dec 2, 2002
    • 0 Attachment
      Eduard, It would seem these women are emotionally involved with what is a political issue. At some threshold level the moralistic juices kick in and it is assumed we should all run along with the melee.
      I agree with their conclusion but for very different reasons. I would not join their cause because it is too late to change Bush`s mind and too early to use this issue to be rid of him. Vladimir Putin will have more to say about Bush`s choices of peace or war. Petitions are too late and it is too early to go to the streets. I hope cooler heads like Vladimir prevail. Bill
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: eduard
      To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 12:05 PM
      Subject: RE: [existlist] Please read and Follow your heart


      Dani,

      Where were these women when Saddam gassed the tribes in the north of
      Iran?? Where were these women when the Taliban was shooting women in
      that soccer stadium?? Where were these women when those Saudi girls
      were allowed to burn to death, rather than to have them exposed to the
      public without their veils?? etc. etc. I get the feeling that this
      walk-out has more to do with getting their 15 minutes of fame than
      doing anything productive.

      eduard

      -----Original Message-----
      From: Dani Moss [mailto:angelwoman@...]
      Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 7:48 AM
      To: DaniMoss333@...
      Subject: [existlist] Please read and Follow your heart


      Women United Against War

      [snip]


      Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
      ADVERTISEMENT




      Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
      (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

      TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
      existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

      Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Bill Harris
      Eduard, I just finished a long text on sub atomic particles. Fascinating and philosophically relevant. Perhaps we can discuss in Nouism. Bill ... From: eduard
      Message 2 of 13 , Dec 2, 2002
      • 0 Attachment
        Eduard, I just finished a long text on sub atomic particles. Fascinating and philosophically relevant. Perhaps we can discuss in Nouism. Bill
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: eduard
        To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 12:05 PM
        Subject: RE: [existlist] Please read and Follow your heart


        Dani,

        Where were these women when Saddam gassed the tribes in the north of
        Iran?? Where were these women when the Taliban was shooting women in
        that soccer stadium?? Where were these women when those Saudi girls
        were allowed to burn to death, rather than to have them exposed to the
        public without their veils?? etc. etc. I get the feeling that this
        walk-out has more to do with getting their 15 minutes of fame than
        doing anything productive.

        eduard

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Dani Moss [mailto:angelwoman@...]
        Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 7:48 AM
        To: DaniMoss333@...
        Subject: [existlist] Please read and Follow your heart


        Women United Against War

        [snip]


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
        ADVERTISEMENT




        Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
        (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

        TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
        existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Fictional Character
        When idiots have societies and groups with causes that are greater than the individual it is exactly these things that bring about the altercation, violence
        Message 3 of 13 , Dec 2, 2002
        • 0 Attachment
          When idiots have societies and groups with causes that are
          "greater than the individual" it is exactly these things that bring
          about the altercation, violence and mass destruction.

          Following my interest, I have no interest in a grouping...a bad
          one or one that might come under the guise of 'goodness' which
          one would need to define for me anyway. More dangerous than a
          single 'Duard with a loud mouth and stupid opinions are
          groups...of any sort.

          If you want to do good as a group, go find and join with Al Qaida,
          and ruin the 'purity' of their rank and file by not wanting to be part
          of the group you are in.

          Fedup Myheart
          -----------------------------
        • Dani Moss
          Actually, we have been signing petitions since Feb,,,at the first whispers of this war. And we have held many peace rallies. There will be a HUGE rally in DC
          Message 4 of 13 , Dec 3, 2002
          • 0 Attachment
            Actually, we have been signing petitions since Feb,,,at the first whispers
            of this war. And we have held many peace rallies. There will be a HUGE rally
            in DC and SF the 18 and 19th of Jan...where have you guys been? People have
            been fighting toth and nail to stop this all along. Do you not read the
            news? Are you unware that the unelected shrub took away mostof your rights
            with the passing of the Patroit Act and took away the rest with the passing
            of the Homeland Securty Bill? Perhaps if people like you realized you do
            have a voice and used it that bill wouldn't have been passed...it was only
            pased by 6 votes...Many people are working hard to put an end to this.
            Yes, that one petition did sound emotional, but mist don't. We need mor e
            people involved and if shrub can play on people's fear in order to paralyze
            them for stopping him, we can pull on people's hearts strings in order to
            cause them to act.
            As far as all the injustices done to women on thrid world countries, us
            women are much more aware of that than most men and have been fighting that
            for a long time. All the proceeds for the Lilith concerts go to fight that
            as do all them from the Vagina Miniloges and many many other groups of women
            supporting women through out the world.
            We are trying to bring about knowledge and respect for other cultures, hence
            peace, not more blood shed.
            Dani

            -------Original Message-------

            From: existlist@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Monday, December 02, 2002 04:28:35 PM
            To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [existlist] Please read and Follow your heart

            Eduard, It would seem these women are emotionally involved with what is a
            political issue. At some threshold level the moralistic juices kick in and
            it is assumed we should all run along with the melee.
            I agree with their conclusion but for very different reasons. I would not
            join their cause because it is too late to change Bush`s mind and too early
            to use this issue to be rid of him. Vladimir Putin will have more to say
            about Bush`s choices of peace or war. Petitions are too late and it is
            too early to go to the streets. I hope cooler heads like Vladimir prevail.
            Bill
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: eduard
            To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 12:05 PM
            Subject: RE: [existlist] Please read and Follow your heart


            Dani,

            Where were these women when Saddam gassed the tribes in the north of
            Iran?? Where were these women when the Taliban was shooting women in
            that soccer stadium?? Where were these women when those Saudi girls
            were allowed to burn to death, rather than to have them exposed to the
            public without their veils?? etc. etc. I get the feeling that this
            walk-out has more to do with getting their 15 minutes of fame than
            doing anything productive.

            eduard

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Dani Moss [mailto:angelwoman@...]
            Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 7:48 AM
            To: DaniMoss333@...
            Subject: [existlist] Please read and Follow your heart


            Women United Against War

            [snip]


            Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
            ADVERTISEMENT




            Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
            (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

            TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
            existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

            Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


            Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
            ADVERTISEMENT




            Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
            (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

            TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
            existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

            Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • eduard
            Dani,
            Message 5 of 13 , Dec 3, 2002
            • 0 Attachment
              Dani,

              <<<< As far as all the injustices done to women on thrid world
              countries, us
              women are much more aware of that than most men and have been fighting
              that
              for a long time. All the proceeds for the Lilith concerts go to fight
              that
              as do all them from the Vagina Miniloges and many many other groups of
              women
              supporting women through out the world. >>>>>

              If you were more aware of the injustices, then where were the protests
              against Saddam?? I still think that it is easy to protest against the
              war and the Bush administration because it is easy and you can make
              the evening news. Walking out congress does not help anyone.

              eduard
            • Bill Harris
              Bookdoc, I think each of us carries the greed toxin. When we band together some sort of multiplier effect comes into play. The lust to power and status
              Message 6 of 13 , Dec 3, 2002
              • 0 Attachment
                Bookdoc, I think each of us carries the greed toxin. When we band together some sort of multiplier effect comes into play. The lust to power and status obliterates the original interest, goals are lost and the struggle over the carcass ensues. It all emanates from that seminal survival instinct. It seems to permeate all cellular life forms, both flora and fauna. With enough space and opportunity we can avoid the greater part of interspecies entanglements.
                You consciously limit group activity. That is one answer that I also use. I have no social life and try to limit my group associations to strictly ruled encounters. If I agree to the rules I will stick to my bargain, I expect the same of my fellows. The law, prior agreement, is the only framework in which we can interact without chaos. Good will and morals go by the by once the greed toxin inoculates a situation.
                Survival is not fun unless you take the attitude of a scrotum dragging, I must win tyrant. I find no interest in such a life. Society is a collaboration I try to minimize my involvement with. I probably draw the line at greater circumference than you do, but then that is a matter of personal interest and risk assessment. Bill
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Fictional Character
                To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 9:01 PM
                Subject: [existlist] Re: Please read and Follow your heart


                When idiots have societies and groups with causes that are
                "greater than the individual" it is exactly these things that bring
                about the altercation, violence and mass destruction.

                Following my interest, I have no interest in a grouping...a bad
                one or one that might come under the guise of 'goodness' which
                one would need to define for me anyway. More dangerous than a
                single 'Duard with a loud mouth and stupid opinions are
                groups...of any sort.

                If you want to do good as a group, go find and join with Al Qaida,
                and ruin the 'purity' of their rank and file by not wanting to be part
                of the group you are in.

                Fedup Myheart
                -----------------------------


                Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                ADVERTISEMENT




                Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
                (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

                TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
                existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Bill Harris
                ... From: Bill Harris To: existlist@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 10:29 AM Subject: Re: [existlist] Re: Please read and Follow your heart
                Message 7 of 13 , Dec 4, 2002
                • 0 Attachment
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Bill Harris
                  To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 10:29 AM
                  Subject: Re: [existlist] Re: Please read and Follow your heart


                  Bookdoc, I think each of us carries the greed toxin. When we band together some sort of multiplier effect comes into play. The lust to power and status obliterates the original interest, goals are lost and the struggle over the carcass ensues. It all emanates from that seminal survival instinct. It seems to permeate all cellular life forms, both flora and fauna. With enough space and opportunity we can avoid the greater part of interspecies entanglements.
                  You consciously limit group activity. That is one answer that I also use. I have no social life and try to limit my group associations to strictly ruled encounters. If I agree to the rules I will stick to my bargain, I expect the same of my fellows. The law, prior agreement, is the only framework in which we can interact without chaos. Good will and morals go by the by once the greed toxin inoculates a situation.
                  Survival is not fun unless you take the attitude of a scrotum dragging, I must win tyrant. I find no interest in such a life. Society is a collaboration I try to minimize my involvement with. I probably draw the line at greater circumference than you do, but then that is a matter of personal interest and risk assessment. Bill
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Fictional Character
                  To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 9:01 PM
                  Subject: [existlist] Re: Please read and Follow your heart


                  When idiots have societies and groups with causes that are
                  "greater than the individual" it is exactly these things that bring
                  about the altercation, violence and mass destruction.

                  Following my interest, I have no interest in a grouping...a bad
                  one or one that might come under the guise of 'goodness' which
                  one would need to define for me anyway. More dangerous than a
                  single 'Duard with a loud mouth and stupid opinions are
                  groups...of any sort.

                  If you want to do good as a group, go find and join with Al Qaida,
                  and ruin the 'purity' of their rank and file by not wanting to be part
                  of the group you are in.

                  Fedup Myheart
                  -----------------------------


                  Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                  ADVERTISEMENT




                  Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
                  (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

                  TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
                  existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


                  Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                  ADVERTISEMENT




                  Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
                  (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

                  TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
                  existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Fictional Character
                  I don t mean to come
                  Message 8 of 13 , Dec 5, 2002
                  • 0 Attachment
                    <<I probably draw the line at greater circumference than you do,
                    but then that is a matter of personal interest and risk
                    assessment. >>

                    I don't mean to come off as a hermit, though I expect it doesn't
                    matter. I don't, however, consider myself part of 'society' except in
                    those cases where I am forced to participate or sacrifice other
                    interest (schooling children, taxes, etc.). I used to fight these
                    things...imagine the absurdity of 'authority'? Why one can lord it
                    over another makes nonsense...except in the primal notation. I
                    can attend 'social' events but fear I don't see them as more than
                    a gathering of chance.

                    If society were to be a tasty entity, it would be one that the
                    constituents entered into willfully...and positively. And while there
                    are nice thoughts there, theory will fail as constituents seek
                    'advantage'. Regretfully, there is no reinforcement for those who
                    seek to share their help...but then there are interesting new-ish
                    behaviors that suggest there may be ways to share and be
                    repaid (shareware?). However, the whole concept of value turns
                    to greed and melts in the spotlight as if made of wax. The society
                    is purist at its beginning...yet that beginning always fades.

                    My only interest in society and social threory was an idea I had
                    for Destructionism...a system which continually UNBUILT itself,
                    rather than forming constituencies and such...but I couldn't come
                    to a mechanism that would affect the dissemblance.

                    Otter Creek
                    ------------------------
                  • Bill Harris
                    Otter, Ah Hah, and thus your idea of joining Al Queda to corrupt it from within. You know it works but is a two edged sword. I just finished a tour with a
                    Message 9 of 13 , Dec 5, 2002
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Otter, Ah Hah, and thus your idea of joining Al Queda to corrupt it from within. You know it works but is a two edged sword. I just finished a tour with a group with a strict confidentuality rule. The fact I will not speak of specifics is proof of the duplicitous effects of such encounters. The members were radically different from me. I found I did not detest them personally but their ideas still are repulsive to me.
                      Withdrawal of interest is a powerful action. It seems to leave feelings of guilt in the abandoned. It seems a good vehicle for forcing introspection upon idealogue dullards. Bill
                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: Fictional Character
                      To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 6:33 AM
                      Subject: [existlist] Re: Please read and Flop


                      <<I probably draw the line at greater circumference than you do,
                      but then that is a matter of personal interest and risk
                      assessment. >>

                      I don't mean to come off as a hermit, though I expect it doesn't
                      matter. I don't, however, consider myself part of 'society' except in
                      those cases where I am forced to participate or sacrifice other
                      interest (schooling children, taxes, etc.). I used to fight these
                      things...imagine the absurdity of 'authority'? Why one can lord it
                      over another makes nonsense...except in the primal notation. I
                      can attend 'social' events but fear I don't see them as more than
                      a gathering of chance.

                      If society were to be a tasty entity, it would be one that the
                      constituents entered into willfully...and positively. And while there
                      are nice thoughts there, theory will fail as constituents seek
                      'advantage'. Regretfully, there is no reinforcement for those who
                      seek to share their help...but then there are interesting new-ish
                      behaviors that suggest there may be ways to share and be
                      repaid (shareware?). However, the whole concept of value turns
                      to greed and melts in the spotlight as if made of wax. The society
                      is purist at its beginning...yet that beginning always fades.

                      My only interest in society and social threory was an idea I had
                      for Destructionism...a system which continually UNBUILT itself,
                      rather than forming constituencies and such...but I couldn't come
                      to a mechanism that would affect the dissemblance.

                      Otter Creek
                      ------------------------


                      Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                      ADVERTISEMENT




                      Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
                      (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

                      TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
                      existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                      Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Fictional Character
                      Actually, no. Interesting connection, though. What I was thinking, more-or-less,
                      Message 10 of 13 , Dec 5, 2002
                      • 0 Attachment
                        <<Ah Hah, and thus your idea of joining Al Queda to corrupt it from
                        within.>>

                        Actually, no. Interesting connection, though.

                        What I was thinking, more-or-less, was that the actual setup of the
                        government would strip individuals of rights and powers as they
                        developed the rights and powers, so you'd never have stuff like
                        unlimited expense accounts. The mechanism would have to be chaotic,
                        so the individuals would never know when/if they were losing a power
                        or benefit or getting fired. Idea being, there would be a virtual
                        elimination of loopholes, as no one would have time to discover,
                        invent or endulge them...nor the will to bother with the effort.

                        Cracked Up
                        ----------
                      • Bill Harris
                        Cracked, Your idea is similar to the concept of the executive authority that has been undermined by civil service and the courts. Now a chief exex has a
                        Message 11 of 13 , Dec 5, 2002
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Cracked, Your idea is similar to the concept of the executive authority that has been undermined by civil service and the courts. Now a chief exex has a brief window after election to discard the terminally worthless. Soon it is back to business as usual. That sort of system seems to imply a great deal of personal will to authority. In small business we can still wield the ax but reputation of severity is a hard thing to shake.
                          Having a "system" that produces eternal revolution sounds like Marx. I think that behind it someone has to wear the black hat. Pay me enough and I`ll do it, just don`t erode my authority when I am in mid swing of the blade. Bill
                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: Fictional Character
                          To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
                          Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 11:28 AM
                          Subject: [existlist] Re: Please read and Flop 2


                          <<Ah Hah, and thus your idea of joining Al Queda to corrupt it from
                          within.>>

                          Actually, no. Interesting connection, though.

                          What I was thinking, more-or-less, was that the actual setup of the
                          government would strip individuals of rights and powers as they
                          developed the rights and powers, so you'd never have stuff like
                          unlimited expense accounts. The mechanism would have to be chaotic,
                          so the individuals would never know when/if they were losing a power
                          or benefit or getting fired. Idea being, there would be a virtual
                          elimination of loopholes, as no one would have time to discover,
                          invent or endulge them...nor the will to bother with the effort.

                          Cracked Up
                          ----------


                          Our Home: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/existlist
                          (Includes community book list, chat, and more.)

                          TO UNSUBSCRIBE from this group, send an email to:
                          existlist-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.