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940Re: [existlist] Re: Digest Number 226

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  • Edward Alf
    Mar 9, 2001
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      i dont believe in common sense ... it seems to imply that the verification
      of truth is dependent some kind of democratic vote ... if 3 people versus 2
      say that the sun comes up in the west, then it must be so ... or to put it
      another way, the problem of common sense is that it is all so very uncommon
      ...

      anyway ... i think you are speaking about two different things in reference
      to science giving explanation and people wanting to invent something greater
      than themselves ... if science gives an explanation it isnt to the detriment
      of anyone (well perhaps to some) ... but it does provide a better grasp on
      reality ... if religion is just neurons firing away, then some groups would
      have to find some other reason for persecuting their fellow humans ... and
      the church just might come to the realisation that we are here on earth for
      more than just creating more "souls" ... that is if there is indeed such a
      thing as a "soul" ...

      with respect to finding something greater, i think that this is a basic
      tendency for everyone .. a human sort of thing ... i dont think it is a
      "crutch" ... it is more in the way of providing a focus ... that does not
      mean that people who do not have a specific religion do not need a focus ...
      i would bet that these people find focus in other ways ...

      i accept the concept of god ... not that i believe in a god right now, but i
      accept the concept and am going in that direction ... i intend to invent one
      if i cant find suitable candidate ... afterall that is what the present
      religions did ... they invented their god and wrote the books and everyone
      went along with it, not because it was logical, but because it was
      successful ... that is the proof of the pudding ...

      but you may object that this is not the same thing ... one does not simply
      go around inventing gods upon whim ... well lets look at an example ...
      perhaps a poor one, but i will detail it anyway ... say you have been
      advised by your doctor to go on an ocean cruise ... but you cant afford the
      cost ... so you come to me and i tell you i would charge you only $50 ...
      astonished, you ask how i would do it for so little ... i explain that an
      ocean cruise is reducible down to only one sensation ... that of the rolling
      deck beneath your feet ... thus, i will paint over your windows and get my
      cousin to use his forklift to rock your house back and forth ... voila, an
      ocean cruise ... but you object ... to you a cruise is more than a rolling
      deck, there has to be the smell of the salt laden air and the sound of gulls
      flying overhead ... ok ... for an extra $25 i can blow salt air through your
      ventilation system ... and i think i can trap a few gulls that have been
      scavenging around the town dump ... you can see how this goes ... it is not
      the thing in itself (the cruise) which is of importance but the sensations
      that come to your brain (sense of rolling, smell of salt air, sound of
      gulls) ... so too it is not religion or god of themselves that are of
      importance, but what you get out of it ... it was once said that god created
      man, because he needed an audience ... i suppose you could turn that around
      to say that man created god because man preferred to be an audience ...

      my point is that all of this is a matter of function ... what role does god
      perform and what are the derived benefits ...

      i suppose that that is a rational way of looking at an irrational activity
      ... but one can follow a certain logic and come to the conclusion that it is
      time to make the jump to the irrational (leap of faith, so to speak) ...

      the bottom line is that in order to make that leap, we have to have a solid
      foundation and therefore, we may need an elaborate scientific way of stating
      the obvious ....

      have fun ...

      eduard



      > > Hi Edward,
      >
      > Marilyn Monroe is definitely a very attractive woman.
      > Yet one may find Gillian Anderson, who conveys a
      > cooler, more intelligent (in my opinion) kind of aura,
      > equally attractive in a very different way. Similarly,
      > there is not much disagreement between us when it
      > comes to ultimate matters of religious impulse and our
      > place in the cosmos.
      >
      > I guess my take on this is to suggest, if you'll
      > forgive the expression, that we should render on to
      > Caesar what is his, and on to God what is His. By that
      > I mean, that you don't really need science to explain
      > the religious impulse in people, just common sense.
      > There is simply too much pretentious scientific
      > explanation of what is basically expressive of our
      > nature as humans. People feel small and insignificant,
      > so they invent or discover something greater than
      > themselves that can help them cope with the pain of
      > being human. Some of us need that (for me) "crutch"
      > and some of us don't. I don't. I am not a believer. I
      > do not really accept the concept of God.
      >
      > I fear that as traditional concepts of God become less
      > and less intellectually respectable, more and more
      > people tend to deify science--which is very
      > unscientific, but it is "scientism." Science
      > talk--often having no real meaning--is the jargon of
      > our times. I suggest we take a step back and consider
      > whether we need an elaborate scientific way of stating
      > the obvious.
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
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