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59894Re: [existlist] Re: was brain drain/ thought

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  • eduardathome
    Jun 13, 2013
      I’m not saying that you cannot obtain enjoyment from your senses ... or at
      least to identify some things you sense as being enjoyable.

      What I am saying is that the process of thinking is essentially digital.
      That coffee you are tasting doesn’t enter your brain as coffee. It enters
      as an electrochemical signal from your taste buds. And your sensing of what
      is hot and what is cold. And much of this is learnt. When I was a kid, I
      didn’t like coffee as it tasted bitter. But now I can’t wait till I get my
      first coffee of the day.

      The thing is that Existentialism is about mental states ... your judgement
      about something. As such, it is appropriate to look into the manner in
      which the brain comes up with a judgement or choice. For example, Wikipedia
      defines Bad faith (or "self-deception") as “the guise of existing as a
      character, individual, or person who defines himself through the social
      categorization of his formal identity”. Your “character“ is a mental state
      in that you have adopted mental scripts which produce the role that you try
      to play. It is your chosen behaviour and mannerisms. On this basis there
      is a means to discussion.

      Why should we say that the waiter in playing the role of waiter .. or
      overplaying it .. is a matter of bad faith. The waiter has taken on mental
      scripts that enable him to play that role. Why should this be wrong when he
      needs to play the role of waiter in order to earn a living. On gets the
      feeling that Sartre [as perhaps many French] have a thing against waiters.
      His life is spent in restaurants with his fellow intellectual friends.
      Perhaps the waiter is an interruption and thus Sartre focuses on the waiter
      to give an example Bad Faith.

      Wikipedia goes further in saying ...

      Living a life defined by one's occupation, social, racial, or economic
      class, is the very essence of "bad faith", the condition in which people
      cannot transcend their situations in order to realize what they must be
      (human) and what they are not (waiter, grocer, etc.).

      That makes no sense. The waiter cannot just leave his job at the whim of
      trying to be *human*. And even if he did, would he not then be playing at
      being a human so that may also be bad faith.

      eduard

      -----Original Message-----
      From: hermit crab
      Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2013 7:20 AM
      To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [existlist] Re: was brain drain/ thought

      Human experience is whatever is being experienced. I hear a train. a fan,
      chattering birds, and distant thunder as I type. I feel a cool breeze,
      smell fresh air. I reach for my coffee and take a sip. It's that simple.
      Ah, now some pouring rain. Mmm, the air smells good. You are talking
      about some *outside world* but there is no inside/outside really. It's
      all one thing. I'm thinking that cool word *torrential* now because it's
      really coming down now. Like cats and dogs.

      h.

      On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 7:52 PM, eduardathome <yeoman@...> wrote:

      > Human experience is a matter of how you react to the outside world. In as
      > much as all reactions are mental states, it becomes important put them in
      > the correct context. We cannot monitor our neural processes, but that
      > does
      > not mean that they do not occur. Neither does mean that your reaction
      > isn’t weighed and directed by previous experience. Existentialism, as far
      > as I understand it, is about mental states. It is your view of the
      > outside
      > world and this view is a brain thing.
      >
      > eduard
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: hermit crab
      > Sent: Wednesday, June 12, 2013 4:13 PM
      > To: existlist@yahoogroups.com
      > Subject: [existlist] Re: was brain drain/ thought
      >
      > On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 1:11 PM, Mary <josephson45r@...> wrote:
      >
      > > Society and people are mutually implicating, but this wholeness doesn't
      > > preclude activism with its setbacks and victories which engender such
      > > unfolding. I think ideals are what drive progress. I'm not a fan of
      > > withdrawal, but to each his own. If we are implicated, withdrawal also
      > > affects the unfolding. As Sartre said, even not choosing is a choice
      > > with
      > > consequences. Camus reminded us of limits and suggested adopting an
      > absurd
      > > logic toward change. The causal loop between individual and society
      > > indicates to me that we have both the freedom and the responsibility to
      > > act. So what this means, pace Eduard, is that I study the philosophy of
      > > thought rather than the science of neurons.
      > >
      > > ===I have been thinking quite a lot about thought as I remembered
      > polymath
      > Douglas Hofstadter a few days ago and read excerpts from his books,
      > watched
      > him discuss thought on youtube and so forth. I see that it is possible to
      > watch my own thinking processes but I cannot know a thing about my
      > personal
      > neurons (what they are doing) and Existentialism is about concrete human
      > experience.
      >
      > DH sees analogy as the core of cognition:
      >
      > http://prelectur.stanford.edu/lecturers/hofstadter/analogy.html
      > http://onpoint.wbur.org/2013/04/26/the-brain-as-analogy-machine
      > http://www.amazon.com/Surfaces-Essences-Analogy-Fuel-Thinking/dp/0465018475
      >
      >
      >
      > hc
      >
      >


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