Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [ExGDBd] "S.S.A"---A easy way out?

Expand Messages
  • carolyn gibb
    Richard: I just read your account of what happened at your church. How very sad! And how lonely you must feel because no one seems to understand. It is doubly
    Message 1 of 13 , May 31, 2005
    • 0 Attachment
      Richard:
      I just read your account of what happened at your church. How very sad! And how lonely you must feel because no one seems to understand. It is doubly hard when those who are supposed to be most kind are not.
      As I see it, you can do a few things. First of all, I completely agree with Mark and Bridget: Do not give uncaring, uneducated people a hammer to hit you with. So, secondly, if you stay in that church (if there is enough positive reason to do so) you may want to start the process of educating people. Both Bridget and I have done that, at first by inviting people to our homes and talking about it. My husband and I invited the Church leaders and actually had a presentation about the different aspects, causes, etc. of ssa. We also showed part of Richard Cohen's tape where he speaks about the bogus scientific studies, because even church members have bought into that lie.
      If you are not comfortable with that, you may give that person who counseled you some things to read, or tell him that he is so very lopsided in this thinking. Send him to the narth web page or others. Let some of us here email him....whatever may work. You probably could really, really use a mentor in your church if you choose to stay there, and you may need to search for such a person.
      Best of luck to you. You certainly do not deserve to be treated so rudely by the church members. Our prayers are with you as you continue your journey.
      Justmom

      Bridget Night <BridgetNight123@...> wrote:
      Mark, I agree 100 percent with what you said on who you should come out to. Thank you for saying that. Bridget
      www.1stbooks.com/bookview/12053<http://www.1stbooks.com/bookview/12053>
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Markup<mailto:markup07@...>
      To: exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com<mailto:exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2005 5:26 PM
      Subject: Re: [ExGDBd] "S.S.A"---A easy way out?



      Richard,
      I totally agree with what the counselor says about SSA. I have struggled with this for more years than I care to count. I too believe SSA is a nice way of saying homosexual attraction. It takes the edge off so to speak. And...running to another church is not the answer because people in their 'fallen condition' gossip in all groups and every denomination and will do so no matter where you go. It has nothing to do with the denomination or anything else...the bottom line is that..... on this side of heaven..... you will not find the perfect church because all churches are made up of 'imperfect people'. I totally disagree with the adivse to... 'tell all'.... But if one chooses to tell for whatever reason, they should be careful about whom they tell especially those who don't understand the condition or problem. One can and should, however, share their homosexual condition in a controlled and loving environment where this knowledge will not be used against you. It should be done
      in a trusted environment with people of similar experiences for mutal encouragement to walk in God's Will. In doing so, you realize you are not alone in your struggle and that many brethren are under going the same struggle. NOT everyone, including many Christians, can handle sensitve information of this nature no matter how much they believe they can. I speak the cold stone truth. And those of you who are truly homosexual strugglers know I do. Its bad enough to have the condition but to give 'self righteous' or ignorant people the hammmer to beat you to death with is absolutely insane! This 'tell all and anyone philosophy' that runs rampid with the most vocal members of this group appalls me! This has caused more suicides and unecessary suffering to people who already feel isolated and in a lot of spiritual and emotional pain. IFor those of you who are non-strugglers and haven't lived this condition be very careful what you advise people. "Walk a mile in my shoes...."

      Mark
      Richard <rtz3@...> wrote:
      I was talking to a leader and counselor in a church. and I was
      trying to tell him about s.s.a. He commensed telling me that there
      is no such thing as ssa, that its only a sugar coated term for
      people taking the easy way out. He told me that if a person has
      homosexual attractions, then that person is gay, and you cant get
      around it by using a loose term such as s.s.a. The bad thing about
      it is he is right in that i have hid behind the term s.s.a. It made
      me stop and wonder just how many guys out there are saying there are
      ssa, but are in active homosexual sin whether actively with a
      person, or cybersex or masturbating alone? He more of less told me
      that everyone in the church knew i was gay and that i should just
      come out in the open with it. I am so ashamed, and have based every
      decision in my life around this fact. I very reluctantly confessed
      to the counselors, then a couple of days later I was made fun of by
      one of the relatives of this so called counselor. I felt like i was
      manipulated to confess my secrets. I noticed that when i was around
      this relative person and their husband that they literally went to
      the opposite side of the building. I am very weary being ostracized
      by the church body. This is not the first time something of this
      nature has happened in church.

      Back when i joined these groups, I took the door of hope course at
      that setting captives free website, I did really well and graduated
      with success. Now I have let this situation with church people to
      drag me back down. I know several guys are taking it, but I want to
      forewarn you of the fact that you are still going to come accross
      christian people that are just not going to understand, and you
      might be tripped up. You cant just tell anyone these days who will
      keep it to themselves.






      Questions about the group? Contact our Director & Founder, Alan Levering, directly at: ncxds@...

      The Ex-Gay Discussion Board is a ministry of NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Christian Ministries

      MINISTRY LINKS!! Feel free to link to these pages on your own website:

      Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks<http://geocities.com/exgaylinks>> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard>> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa> | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart>> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>>




      ---------------------------------
      Yahoo! Groups Links

      To visit your group on the web, go to:
      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/>

      To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      exgaydiscussionboard-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

      Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


      __________________________________________________
      Do You Yahoo!?
      Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
      http://mail.yahoo.com<http://mail.yahoo.com/>

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



      Questions about the group? Contact our Director & Founder, Alan Levering, directly at: ncxds@...

      The Ex-Gay Discussion Board is a ministry of NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Christian Ministries

      MINISTRY LINKS!! Feel free to link to these pages on your own website:

      Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks<http://geocities.com/exgaylinks>> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard>> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa> | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart>> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>>




      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      Yahoo! Groups Links

      a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/>

      b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      exgaydiscussionboard-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<mailto:exgaydiscussionboard-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>

      c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



      Questions about the group? Contact our Director & Founder, Alan Levering, directly at: ncxds@...

      The Ex-Gay Discussion Board is a ministry of NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Christian Ministries

      MINISTRY LINKS!! Feel free to link to these pages on your own website:

      Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>




      ---------------------------------
      Yahoo! Groups Links

      To visit your group on the web, go to:
      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/

      To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      exgaydiscussionboard-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

      Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.




      ---------------------------------
      Discover Yahoo!
      Find restaurants, movies, travel & more fun for the weekend. Check it out!

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Richard
      I want to thank everyone for their replies. I have to say that this has been boiling in me for several months. I have kept it inside and told noone the extent
      Message 2 of 13 , Jun 1 12:28 AM
      • 0 Attachment
        I want to thank everyone for their replies. I have to say that this
        has been boiling in me for several months. I have kept it inside and
        told noone the extent of the hurt and shame I felt the whole time. I
        did "walk" the night this relative make the gay gesture at me, and
        didnt look back. I was feeling overwhelming shame and intense
        paranoia already, and all this did was plummage me from the church
        body all together. While at the church I was having flashes as a
        child, and I'm not sure why. It was all very weird. Everything that
        happened, managed to sabatoge my walk in Christ, and I have not been
        in a right mind since then.


        I have to admit out of my shame and hurt, I over exaggerated on the
        ssa part of that posting,and overexaggerated my need for attention.
        The fact is the parts about ssa were from my own fact of feeling
        completely deflated about my issues with same sex attraction. If it
        is choosed for me to be banned from the group, so be it.

        This has caused a big rift in my families, they are very
        conservative. They try not to act prejudice, but they are, and have
        slipped up and said things to me, and around me on more than one
        occasion. I feel like things about me leaked out to family members,
        and at the time the way they all were acting did nothing but confirm
        that they had been told through one source or another. I left a
        journal at the church one day where I was writing down very personal
        things, and I feel like it fell into the wrong hands, when i wasnt
        around. I will have nothing else to do with church for along while,
        hopefully in the future i can move to another town. I just cant
        mentally handle it anymore of this junk from people, its too much.

        I have more or less have had this type of thing happened to me with
        two other leaders in two other churches I was in, and left because
        of the paranoia of not trusting people in leadership in the
        churches, but in my mind it was very much verified that it had
        leaked out in these places as well.

        I need to you to know, it is not my conscious intent to get pity.
        But it more than likely comes accross as pity as i was told at the
        church that I more or less try to get pity. I will not reply anymore
        to this thread, if you want to talk to me, you will have to email me.

        P.S. There are no safe churches in my area where I could possibly
        go, unless i go into a denominational church. The one venture I did
        make before I went to the above mentioned church spent way too much
        time on condeming homosexuals. Obviously there is a big lack of
        understanding in my area to offer hope to people that are struggling
        or defeated with same sex issues.
      • Richard
        At this point, I am removing myself from all the EXGAY groups I am in, because i am hell bent on making trouble. ... this ... and ... I ... that ... been ...
        Message 3 of 13 , Jun 1 1:02 AM
        • 0 Attachment
          At this point, I am removing myself from all the EXGAY groups I am
          in, because i am hell bent on making trouble.



          --- In exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com, "Richard" <rtz3@s...>
          wrote:
          > I want to thank everyone for their replies. I have to say that
          this
          > has been boiling in me for several months. I have kept it inside
          and
          > told noone the extent of the hurt and shame I felt the whole time.
          I
          > did "walk" the night this relative make the gay gesture at me, and
          > didnt look back. I was feeling overwhelming shame and intense
          > paranoia already, and all this did was plummage me from the church
          > body all together. While at the church I was having flashes as a
          > child, and I'm not sure why. It was all very weird. Everything
          that
          > happened, managed to sabatoge my walk in Christ, and I have not
          been
          > in a right mind since then.
          >
          >
          > I have to admit out of my shame and hurt, I over exaggerated on
          the
          > ssa part of that posting,and overexaggerated my need for
          attention.
          > The fact is the parts about ssa were from my own fact of feeling
          > completely deflated about my issues with same sex attraction. If
          it
          > is choosed for me to be banned from the group, so be it.
          >
          > This has caused a big rift in my families, they are very
          > conservative. They try not to act prejudice, but they are, and
          have
          > slipped up and said things to me, and around me on more than one
          > occasion. I feel like things about me leaked out to family
          members,
          > and at the time the way they all were acting did nothing but
          confirm
          > that they had been told through one source or another. I left a
          > journal at the church one day where I was writing down very
          personal
          > things, and I feel like it fell into the wrong hands, when i wasnt
          > around. I will have nothing else to do with church for along
          while,
          > hopefully in the future i can move to another town. I just cant
          > mentally handle it anymore of this junk from people, its too much.
          >
          > I have more or less have had this type of thing happened to me
          with
          > two other leaders in two other churches I was in, and left because
          > of the paranoia of not trusting people in leadership in the
          > churches, but in my mind it was very much verified that it had
          > leaked out in these places as well.
          >
          > I need to you to know, it is not my conscious intent to get pity.
          > But it more than likely comes accross as pity as i was told at the
          > church that I more or less try to get pity. I will not reply
          anymore
          > to this thread, if you want to talk to me, you will have to email
          me.
          >
          > P.S. There are no safe churches in my area where I could possibly
          > go, unless i go into a denominational church. The one venture I
          did
          > make before I went to the above mentioned church spent way too
          much
          > time on condeming homosexuals. Obviously there is a big lack of
          > understanding in my area to offer hope to people that are
          struggling
          > or defeated with same sex issues.
        • Bridget Night
          That was great John!! I agree with you 100%. Thanks for sharing. Bridget ... From: John To:
          Message 4 of 13 , Jun 4 11:17 AM
          • 0 Attachment
            That was great John!! I agree with you 100%. Thanks for sharing. Bridget
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: John<mailto:tygrjohn02@...>
            To: exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com<mailto:exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:29 PM
            Subject: Re: [ExGDBd] "S.S.A"---A easy way out?


            Alan:

            Being CAUTIOUS about giving out ANY information that can be used to harm us or our friends is the intelligent thing to do. As Mark says, handing the club to someone so they can proceed to pound you with it is not healthy. I don't find anyone in here saying to "tell all" to everyone. The specific instances I have seen were people wanting or contemplating sharing with someone close, i.e. a parent, church leader, close friend, etc. In these instances it is always the person sharing who makes the call. Caution and prudence are DEFINITELY the words of the day. This is good advice for anyone with any sensitive personal information. You don't hand out business cards with your social security number on it, you use judgment. A guy I have been talking to that is not in the group ( a male sufferer) was being attacked by people daily. I quickly realized he was giving them all the ammo. We worked on thinking before he talked and in a couple of days, guess what the attacks stopped..why?..because
            he stopped giving them "reasons" to attack him. So we all must be cautious in what we say and to whom.

            The "church leader" who Richard refers to below is ignorant of the facts. The term ssa has been around for decades and PRIOR to the activists turning "SSAD" into "Gay". It was recognized, not as an easy way out term, but simply a term. We operate in a world that uses language. I think most here agree that ssa is a developmental dysfunction, as is almost all issues treated in therapy. It is NOT a sugar coated term for those taking the "easy way out", in fact I don't see an "easy" way out..if you do please let me know.This preacher is using his own faulty concepts to take a "jab" at people with this issue. He appears, to me, to be cold and condescending. One can "hide" behind any term. Self reflection and action are needed to come out from behind our fascades...good medicine for ALL of us on any issues we hide behind. I don't know of anyone "getting around it" by using the term "ssa", but that is entirely possible for some. I understand his thinking, but his application of reasoning
            falls very short in attempting to force everyone to use his particular line of logic. In fact it flys directly in opposition to what Mark states about using caution, for if we were to follow this "church leader" he would in FACT be telling everyone as his quote "that i should just come out in the open with it." demonstrates.

            I was talking to a friend whom I asked to allow me to give her name (she is a Christian therapist) to Exodus, Narth, PFOX, et al, and we were discussing "reparative therapy", the name used by many to describe the overarching "method" accepted in the profession for treatment of ssa. I told her that after reading extensively on it I was of the conclusion that IN FACT "reparative therapy" is EXACTLY the same "method" that is used to treat ALL OF US, no matter what a person comes to therapy needing assistance. In other words, to me, this issue (ssa) is ONLY different in the aspect of it's manifestation, and the methods (reparative therapy) in treating homosexuals is, in essence, the same methods to treat ALL OF US, no matter what we need healing in. In this, friends, you ARE NOT ALONE.

            Seeking a loving church is a crucial thing for those needing help. I agree with Mark, that NO church is perfect, since it is inhabited with imperfect people and no matter how loving a church there will always be some in it who gossip, tease, or whatever....they need healing. Sometimes it might be easier (and in fact a way of healing that not only helps the struggler, but the people that need healing for belittling, gossip, etc) to work within the church your in and not leave. This, again, is a matter of judgment.

            I am, and I know everyone here (that I have read posts from) is cautious about advice. One does NOT, however, need to be suffering from a thing, to understand the particulr thing. I can't "walk a mile" in your shoes, I CAN however read, listen to, walk with, share fears and tears with and understand this issue. Sometimes it is those (I have certainly experienced this in my own life) who have never had temptation with an issue, but who are grounded spiritually, who can give us good advice on what we need for healing. I am NOT an expert, I just have a heart that WANTS healing, period. I am very careful as, although I have not had this challenge, I HAVE felt it's PAIN, up close and very personal, day to day for the last 2 years or more..to the point that when I see and hear things being said to bring pain and hurt to my friends, guess who is the one who steps into the fray to pull out a mirror and hold it up to the bigots?......I just ask them to take a strong glance in that mirror at
            the "perfect" human being that delights in hurting others...and how sad indeed their life appears to be.......recipe for a rumble at times, but being 6' 2" and probably qualified, weight wise, for Sumo wrestling I don't get many takers, thank goodness.

            I got into this issue to help someone I LOVE UNCONDITIONALLY. In doing so I have found a wealth of things that are helping ME grow and be a better man, father, and friend, both spiritually and emotionally and in all ways. This has NOT been easy for me either........it is a journey.

            Your friend,

            John



            Alan Levering <ncxds2@...> wrote:
            Mark,

            I have already posted on "terms" but I agree on being cautious when "coming out" to others and
            have always stated such on this board.

            -- Alan



            --- Markup <markup07@...> wrote:

            >
            > Richard,
            > I totally agree with what the counselor says about SSA. I have struggled with this for
            > more years than I care to count. I too believe SSA is a nice way of saying homosexual
            > attraction. It takes the edge off so to speak. And...running to another church is not the
            > answer because people in their 'fallen condition' gossip in all groups and every
            > denomination and will do so no matter where you go. It has nothing to do with the
            > denomination or anything else...the bottom line is that..... on this side of heaven..... you
            > will not find the perfect church because all churches are made up of 'imperfect people'. I
            > totally disagree with the adivse to... 'tell all'.... But if one chooses to tell for
            > whatever reason, they should be careful about whom they tell especially those who don't
            > understand the condition or problem. One can and should, however, share their homosexual
            > condition in a controlled and loving environment where this knowledge will not be used
            > against you. It should be done
            > in a trusted environment with people of similar experiences for mutal encouragement to walk
            > in God's Will. In doing so, you realize you are not alone in your struggle and that many
            > brethren are under going the same struggle. NOT everyone, including many Christians, can
            > handle sensitve information of this nature no matter how much they believe they can. I speak
            > the cold stone truth. And those of you who are truly homosexual strugglers know I do. Its
            > bad enough to have the condition but to give 'self righteous' or ignorant people the
            > hammmer to beat you to death with is absolutely insane! This 'tell all and anyone
            > philosophy' that runs rampid with the most vocal members of this group appalls me! This has
            > caused more suicides and unecessary suffering to people who already feel isolated and in a
            > lot of spiritual and emotional pain. IFor those of you who are non-strugglers and haven't
            > lived this condition be very careful what you advise people. "Walk a mile in my shoes...."
            >
            > Mark
            > Richard <rtz3@...> wrote:
            > I was talking to a leader and counselor in a church. and I was
            > trying to tell him about s.s.a. He commensed telling me that there
            > is no such thing as ssa, that its only a sugar coated term for
            > people taking the easy way out. He told me that if a person has
            > homosexual attractions, then that person is gay, and you cant get
            > around it by using a loose term such as s.s.a. The bad thing about
            > it is he is right in that i have hid behind the term s.s.a. It made
            > me stop and wonder just how many guys out there are saying there are
            > ssa, but are in active homosexual sin whether actively with a
            > person, or cybersex or masturbating alone? He more of less told me
            > that everyone in the church knew i was gay and that i should just
            > come out in the open with it. I am so ashamed, and have based every
            > decision in my life around this fact. I very reluctantly confessed
            > to the counselors, then a couple of days later I was made fun of by
            > one of the relatives of this so called counselor. I felt like i was
            > manipulated to confess my secrets. I noticed that when i was around
            > this relative person and their husband that they literally went to
            > the opposite side of the building. I am very weary being ostracized
            > by the church body. This is not the first time something of this
            > nature has happened in church.
            >
            > Back when i joined these groups, I took the door of hope course at
            > that setting captives free website, I did really well and graduated
            > with success. Now I have let this situation with church people to
            > drag me back down. I know several guys are taking it, but I want to
            > forewarn you of the fact that you are still going to come accross
            > christian people that are just not going to understand, and you
            > might be tripped up. You cant just tell anyone these days who will
            > keep it to themselves.
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Questions about the group? Contact our Director & Founder, Alan Levering, directly at:
            > ncxds@...
            >
            > The Ex-Gay Discussion Board is a ministry of NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Christian Ministries
            >
            > MINISTRY LINKS!! Feel free to link to these pages on your own website:
            >
            > Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks<http://geocities.com/exgaylinks>> | Discussion Board:
            > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard>> | Spanish Language Discussion Board:
            > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa> | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group:
            > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart>> | Chat:
            > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>>
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ---------------------------------
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            > To visit your group on the web, go to:
            > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/>
            >
            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > exgaydiscussionboard-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
            >
            >
            > __________________________________________________
            > Do You Yahoo!?
            > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
            > http://mail.yahoo.com<http://mail.yahoo.com/>
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >


            -- In Him who leads us to the Absolute Truth,
            Alan Levering; Founder, NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Ministries

            Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks<http://geocities.com/exgaylinks>> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard>> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa> | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart>> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>>
            Feel free to link to these pages on your own website!!!



            __________________________________
            Yahoo! Mail
            Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
            http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html<http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html>



            Questions about the group? Contact our Director & Founder, Alan Levering, directly at: ncxds@...

            The Ex-Gay Discussion Board is a ministry of NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Christian Ministries

            MINISTRY LINKS!! Feel free to link to these pages on your own website:

            Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks<http://geocities.com/exgaylinks>> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard>> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa> | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart>> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>>




            ---------------------------------
            Yahoo! Groups Links

            To visit your group on the web, go to:
            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/>

            To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            exgaydiscussionboard-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

            Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



            Questions about the group? Contact our Director & Founder, Alan Levering, directly at: ncxds@...

            The Ex-Gay Discussion Board is a ministry of NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Christian Ministries

            MINISTRY LINKS!! Feel free to link to these pages on your own website:

            Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks<http://geocities.com/exgaylinks>> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard>> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa> | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart>> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>>




            ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
            Yahoo! Groups Links

            a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/>

            b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            exgaydiscussionboard-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<mailto:exgaydiscussionboard-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>

            c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Alan Levering
            E-mail me privately. Prhaps the mod team can give you guidance on finding a new place of worship. -- Alan ... -- In Him who leads us to the Absolute Truth,
            Message 5 of 13 , Jun 4 4:09 PM
            • 0 Attachment
              E-mail me privately. Prhaps the mod team can give you guidance on finding a new place of
              worship.

              -- Alan


              --- Richard <rtz3@...> wrote:

              > I want to thank everyone for their replies. I have to say that this
              > has been boiling in me for several months. I have kept it inside and
              > told noone the extent of the hurt and shame I felt the whole time. I
              > did "walk" the night this relative make the gay gesture at me, and
              > didnt look back. I was feeling overwhelming shame and intense
              > paranoia already, and all this did was plummage me from the church
              > body all together. While at the church I was having flashes as a
              > child, and I'm not sure why. It was all very weird. Everything that
              > happened, managed to sabatoge my walk in Christ, and I have not been
              > in a right mind since then.
              >
              >
              > I have to admit out of my shame and hurt, I over exaggerated on the
              > ssa part of that posting,and overexaggerated my need for attention.
              > The fact is the parts about ssa were from my own fact of feeling
              > completely deflated about my issues with same sex attraction. If it
              > is choosed for me to be banned from the group, so be it.
              >
              > This has caused a big rift in my families, they are very
              > conservative. They try not to act prejudice, but they are, and have
              > slipped up and said things to me, and around me on more than one
              > occasion. I feel like things about me leaked out to family members,
              > and at the time the way they all were acting did nothing but confirm
              > that they had been told through one source or another. I left a
              > journal at the church one day where I was writing down very personal
              > things, and I feel like it fell into the wrong hands, when i wasnt
              > around. I will have nothing else to do with church for along while,
              > hopefully in the future i can move to another town. I just cant
              > mentally handle it anymore of this junk from people, its too much.
              >
              > I have more or less have had this type of thing happened to me with
              > two other leaders in two other churches I was in, and left because
              > of the paranoia of not trusting people in leadership in the
              > churches, but in my mind it was very much verified that it had
              > leaked out in these places as well.
              >
              > I need to you to know, it is not my conscious intent to get pity.
              > But it more than likely comes accross as pity as i was told at the
              > church that I more or less try to get pity. I will not reply anymore
              > to this thread, if you want to talk to me, you will have to email me.
              >
              > P.S. There are no safe churches in my area where I could possibly
              > go, unless i go into a denominational church. The one venture I did
              > make before I went to the above mentioned church spent way too much
              > time on condeming homosexuals. Obviously there is a big lack of
              > understanding in my area to offer hope to people that are struggling
              > or defeated with same sex issues.
              >
              >
              >
              >


              -- In Him who leads us to the Absolute Truth,
              Alan Levering; Founder, NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Ministries

              Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>
              Feel free to link to these pages on your own website!!!



              __________________________________
              Discover Yahoo!
              Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out!
              http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html
            • John
              Richard: Ban you..........I know you may be serious buddy, but you have me falling off the chair in laughter...c mon friend why on earth would you be
              Message 6 of 13 , Jun 4 4:20 PM
              • 0 Attachment
                Richard:

                Ban you..........I know you may be serious buddy, but you have me falling off the chair in laughter...c'mon friend why on earth would you be "banned"??? In case you didn't get a good look around here, I think you will find a couple of sinners still in the group, myself included. I KNOW there are others here that walk a better walk than I do, even with their personal "challenges".

                Let's try and find you a secure place.....any of us would help you...I will personally if you wish, try to find you a church and if you wish some counseling near you that is trustworthy and grounded.

                To Alan: If you need help let me know I will help in any way finding Richard a secure and compassionate place I will do whatever I can....John


                Alan Levering <ncxds2@...> wrote:
                E-mail me privately. Prhaps the mod team can give you guidance on finding a new place of
                worship.

                -- Alan


                --- Richard <rtz3@...> wrote:

                > I want to thank everyone for their replies. I have to say that this
                > has been boiling in me for several months. I have kept it inside and
                > told noone the extent of the hurt and shame I felt the whole time. I
                > did "walk" the night this relative make the gay gesture at me, and
                > didnt look back. I was feeling overwhelming shame and intense
                > paranoia already, and all this did was plummage me from the church
                > body all together. While at the church I was having flashes as a
                > child, and I'm not sure why. It was all very weird. Everything that
                > happened, managed to sabatoge my walk in Christ, and I have not been
                > in a right mind since then.
                >
                >
                > I have to admit out of my shame and hurt, I over exaggerated on the
                > ssa part of that posting,and overexaggerated my need for attention.
                > The fact is the parts about ssa were from my own fact of feeling
                > completely deflated about my issues with same sex attraction. If it
                > is choosed for me to be banned from the group, so be it.
                >
                > This has caused a big rift in my families, they are very
                > conservative. They try not to act prejudice, but they are, and have
                > slipped up and said things to me, and around me on more than one
                > occasion. I feel like things about me leaked out to family members,
                > and at the time the way they all were acting did nothing but confirm
                > that they had been told through one source or another. I left a
                > journal at the church one day where I was writing down very personal
                > things, and I feel like it fell into the wrong hands, when i wasnt
                > around. I will have nothing else to do with church for along while,
                > hopefully in the future i can move to another town. I just cant
                > mentally handle it anymore of this junk from people, its too much.
                >
                > I have more or less have had this type of thing happened to me with
                > two other leaders in two other churches I was in, and left because
                > of the paranoia of not trusting people in leadership in the
                > churches, but in my mind it was very much verified that it had
                > leaked out in these places as well.
                >
                > I need to you to know, it is not my conscious intent to get pity.
                > But it more than likely comes accross as pity as i was told at the
                > church that I more or less try to get pity. I will not reply anymore
                > to this thread, if you want to talk to me, you will have to email me.
                >
                > P.S. There are no safe churches in my area where I could possibly
                > go, unless i go into a denominational church. The one venture I did
                > make before I went to the above mentioned church spent way too much
                > time on condeming homosexuals. Obviously there is a big lack of
                > understanding in my area to offer hope to people that are struggling
                > or defeated with same sex issues.
                >
                >
                >
                >


                -- In Him who leads us to the Absolute Truth,
                Alan Levering; Founder, NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Ministries

                Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>
                Feel free to link to these pages on your own website!!!



                __________________________________
                Discover Yahoo!
                Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out!
                http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html



                Questions about the group? Contact our Director & Founder, Alan Levering, directly at: ncxds@...

                The Ex-Gay Discussion Board is a ministry of NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Christian Ministries

                MINISTRY LINKS!! Feel free to link to these pages on your own website:

                Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>




                ---------------------------------
                Yahoo! Groups Links

                To visit your group on the web, go to:
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/

                To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                exgaydiscussionboard-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Alan Levering
                You have not been making trouble here but you have been bringing up valid questions that many of our members struggle with. You have been a blessing by
                Message 7 of 13 , Jun 5 9:22 AM
                • 0 Attachment
                  You have not been "making trouble" here but you have been bringing up valid questions that
                  many of our members struggle with. You have been a blessing by forcing us to think through
                  these things.

                  I hope and pray you decide to stay.

                  -- Alan



                  --- Richard <rtz3@...> wrote:

                  > At this point, I am removing myself from all the EXGAY groups I am
                  > in, because i am hell bent on making trouble.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > --- In exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com, "Richard" <rtz3@s...>
                  > wrote:
                  > > I want to thank everyone for their replies. I have to say that
                  > this
                  > > has been boiling in me for several months. I have kept it inside
                  > and
                  > > told noone the extent of the hurt and shame I felt the whole time.
                  > I
                  > > did "walk" the night this relative make the gay gesture at me, and
                  > > didnt look back. I was feeling overwhelming shame and intense
                  > > paranoia already, and all this did was plummage me from the church
                  > > body all together. While at the church I was having flashes as a
                  > > child, and I'm not sure why. It was all very weird. Everything
                  > that
                  > > happened, managed to sabatoge my walk in Christ, and I have not
                  > been
                  > > in a right mind since then.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > I have to admit out of my shame and hurt, I over exaggerated on
                  > the
                  > > ssa part of that posting,and overexaggerated my need for
                  > attention.
                  > > The fact is the parts about ssa were from my own fact of feeling
                  > > completely deflated about my issues with same sex attraction. If
                  > it
                  > > is choosed for me to be banned from the group, so be it.
                  > >
                  > > This has caused a big rift in my families, they are very
                  > > conservative. They try not to act prejudice, but they are, and
                  > have
                  > > slipped up and said things to me, and around me on more than one
                  > > occasion. I feel like things about me leaked out to family
                  > members,
                  > > and at the time the way they all were acting did nothing but
                  > confirm
                  > > that they had been told through one source or another. I left a
                  > > journal at the church one day where I was writing down very
                  > personal
                  > > things, and I feel like it fell into the wrong hands, when i wasnt
                  > > around. I will have nothing else to do with church for along
                  > while,
                  > > hopefully in the future i can move to another town. I just cant
                  > > mentally handle it anymore of this junk from people, its too much.
                  > >
                  > > I have more or less have had this type of thing happened to me
                  > with
                  > > two other leaders in two other churches I was in, and left because
                  > > of the paranoia of not trusting people in leadership in the
                  > > churches, but in my mind it was very much verified that it had
                  > > leaked out in these places as well.
                  > >
                  > > I need to you to know, it is not my conscious intent to get pity.
                  > > But it more than likely comes accross as pity as i was told at the
                  > > church that I more or less try to get pity. I will not reply
                  > anymore
                  > > to this thread, if you want to talk to me, you will have to email
                  > me.
                  > >
                  > > P.S. There are no safe churches in my area where I could possibly
                  > > go, unless i go into a denominational church. The one venture I
                  > did
                  > > make before I went to the above mentioned church spent way too
                  > much
                  > > time on condeming homosexuals. Obviously there is a big lack of
                  > > understanding in my area to offer hope to people that are
                  > struggling
                  > > or defeated with same sex issues.
                  >
                  >
                  >


                  -- In Him who leads us to the Absolute Truth,
                  Alan Levering; Founder, NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Ministries

                  Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>
                  Feel free to link to these pages on your own website!!!

                  __________________________________________________
                  Do You Yahoo!?
                  Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
                  http://mail.yahoo.com
                • Alan Levering
                  If he is willing, I trust your judgement. ... -- In Him who leads us to the Absolute Truth, Alan Levering; Founder, NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Ministries Web:
                  Message 8 of 13 , Jun 6 3:57 PM
                  • 0 Attachment
                    If he is willing, I trust your judgement.



                    --- John <tygrjohn02@...> wrote:

                    > Richard:
                    >
                    > Ban you..........I know you may be serious buddy, but you have me falling off the chair in
                    > laughter...c'mon friend why on earth would you be "banned"??? In case you didn't get a good
                    > look around here, I think you will find a couple of sinners still in the group, myself
                    > included. I KNOW there are others here that walk a better walk than I do, even with their
                    > personal "challenges".
                    >
                    > Let's try and find you a secure place.....any of us would help you...I will personally if
                    > you wish, try to find you a church and if you wish some counseling near you that is
                    > trustworthy and grounded.
                    >
                    > To Alan: If you need help let me know I will help in any way finding Richard a secure and
                    > compassionate place I will do whatever I can....John
                    >
                    >
                    > Alan Levering <ncxds2@...> wrote:
                    > E-mail me privately. Prhaps the mod team can give you guidance on finding a new place of
                    > worship.
                    >
                    > -- Alan
                    >
                    >
                    > --- Richard <rtz3@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > > I want to thank everyone for their replies. I have to say that this
                    > > has been boiling in me for several months. I have kept it inside and
                    > > told noone the extent of the hurt and shame I felt the whole time. I
                    > > did "walk" the night this relative make the gay gesture at me, and
                    > > didnt look back. I was feeling overwhelming shame and intense
                    > > paranoia already, and all this did was plummage me from the church
                    > > body all together. While at the church I was having flashes as a
                    > > child, and I'm not sure why. It was all very weird. Everything that
                    > > happened, managed to sabatoge my walk in Christ, and I have not been
                    > > in a right mind since then.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > I have to admit out of my shame and hurt, I over exaggerated on the
                    > > ssa part of that posting,and overexaggerated my need for attention.
                    > > The fact is the parts about ssa were from my own fact of feeling
                    > > completely deflated about my issues with same sex attraction. If it
                    > > is choosed for me to be banned from the group, so be it.
                    > >
                    > > This has caused a big rift in my families, they are very
                    > > conservative. They try not to act prejudice, but they are, and have
                    > > slipped up and said things to me, and around me on more than one
                    > > occasion. I feel like things about me leaked out to family members,
                    > > and at the time the way they all were acting did nothing but confirm
                    > > that they had been told through one source or another. I left a
                    > > journal at the church one day where I was writing down very personal
                    > > things, and I feel like it fell into the wrong hands, when i wasnt
                    > > around. I will have nothing else to do with church for along while,
                    > > hopefully in the future i can move to another town. I just cant
                    > > mentally handle it anymore of this junk from people, its too much.
                    > >
                    > > I have more or less have had this type of thing happened to me with
                    > > two other leaders in two other churches I was in, and left because
                    > > of the paranoia of not trusting people in leadership in the
                    > > churches, but in my mind it was very much verified that it had
                    > > leaked out in these places as well.
                    > >
                    > > I need to you to know, it is not my conscious intent to get pity.
                    > > But it more than likely comes accross as pity as i was told at the
                    > > church that I more or less try to get pity. I will not reply anymore
                    > > to this thread, if you want to talk to me, you will have to email me.
                    > >
                    > > P.S. There are no safe churches in my area where I could possibly
                    > > go, unless i go into a denominational church. The one venture I did
                    > > make before I went to the above mentioned church spent way too much
                    > > time on condeming homosexuals. Obviously there is a big lack of
                    > > understanding in my area to offer hope to people that are struggling
                    > > or defeated with same sex issues.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    > -- In Him who leads us to the Absolute Truth,
                    > Alan Levering; Founder, NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Ministries
                    >
                    > Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks> | Discussion Board:
                    > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard> | Spanish Language Discussion Board:
                    > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group:
                    > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart> | Chat:
                    > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>
                    > Feel free to link to these pages on your own website!!!
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > __________________________________
                    > Discover Yahoo!
                    > Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out!
                    > http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Questions about the group? Contact our Director & Founder, Alan Levering, directly at:
                    > ncxds@...
                    >
                    > The Ex-Gay Discussion Board is a ministry of NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Christian Ministries
                    >
                    > MINISTRY LINKS!! Feel free to link to these pages on your own website:
                    >
                    > Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks> | Discussion Board:
                    > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard> | Spanish Language Discussion Board:
                    > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group:
                    > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart> | Chat:
                    > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ---------------------------------
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    > To visit your group on the web, go to:
                    > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/
                    >
                    > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                    > exgaydiscussionboard-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    >
                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >


                    -- In Him who leads us to the Absolute Truth,
                    Alan Levering; Founder, NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Ministries

                    Web: <http://geocities.com/exgaylinks> | Discussion Board: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard> | Spanish Language Discussion Board: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgayenespa | "Wounded Heart" Abused Men's Group: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/woundedheart> | Chat: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/exgaydiscussionboard/chat>
                    Feel free to link to these pages on your own website!!!



                    __________________________________
                    Yahoo! Mail
                    Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
                    http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html
                  Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.