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[ExGDBd] Re: apostasy

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  • ctickle777
    Whoopsidaisy s! Christa : ) ... | Spanish Language Discussion Board:
    Message 1 of 42 , Nov 30, 2004
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      Whoopsidaisy's!

      Christa : )

      --- In exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com, Alan Levering
      <ncxds2@y...> wrote:
      > OOPs -- Let's not get started in doctrinal debates.
      > Thanks, C!
      >
      > --A
      >
      > --- ctickle777 <ctickle777@y...> wrote:
      >
      > >
      > > I have something to add...
      > >
      > > I would suggest that apostasy is in reality, the
      > > individual never
      > > came to Christ to begin with...because people can be
      > > completely
      > > saved by grace, and not "live" like it. Our
      > > salvation isn't
      > > determined by our ability to live up to a God-given
      > > standard, but
      > > instead, a free gift, one that is not earned, nor
      > > maintained, by our
      > > own actions. The Book Classic Christianity addresses
      > > the law and how
      > > it pertains to us today. We, as born-again
      > > believers, are called to
      > > a higher law, and putting one another under that
      > > law, almost always
      > > backfires. If our salvation is conditional, then it
      > > wasn't a free
      > > gift to begin with...
      > >
      > > If a person experiences sin, or lives in it, and
      > > feels no remorse,
      > > then I would question if that person had the living
      > > Spirit of God
      > > inside him/her, as the Holy Spirit convicts those in
      > > whom it
      > > resides. If there is no conviction of sin, now or
      > > later, then the
      > > person has quite likely never truly been spiritually
      > > reborn. So,
      > > that person came to God without the proper motive,
      > > and therefore,
      > > never truly experienced an exchanged life in Jesus
      > > Christ.
      > >
      > > Just my 2 cents!
      > >
      > > Christa
      > >
      > >
      > > --- In exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com, Matt
      > > Painter
      > > <mplebanon@y...> wrote:
      > > > zippair,
      > > >
      > > > I appreciate your support, but I disagree with
      > > your one comment
      > > about my wife being a christian and therefore she
      > > will go to heaven,
      > > too..........I believe in apostasy (falling away
      > > from God) and by
      > > deliberately engaging in homosexuality while knowing
      > > what God has to
      > > say about it........I wonder where her soul is
      > > going. I try not to
      > > judge......but as christians, even the apostle Paul
      > > held churches
      > > and people accountable for their actions.......and I
      > > feel as a
      > > christian I should inform my wife of her
      > > transgressions. I do this
      > > out of love.
      > > >
      > > > Only God knows if we're going to heaven......and
      > > only he knows the
      > > true desires of our heart when our time is up.
      > > >
      > > > zippair <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > Eric,
      > > >
      > > > Kat's opinion is sensible to me but Pastor Bob's
      > > isn't.
      > > >
      > > > As you have married your wife, you shouldn't
      > > divorce unless it is
      > > > because of adultery. I think you have promised
      > > before her and God
      > > to
      > > > love her no matter what has happened.
      > > >
      > > > Continue to love her and hope God will help your
      > > marriage.
      > > >
      > > > Of course, your wife is saved and will go to
      > > heaven with you,
      > > simply
      > > > because she is Christian.
      > > >
      > > > I appreciate your bravery and openness to share
      > > your tough
      > > marriage
      > > > here. I pray that He is your saviour continously.
      > > >
      > > > To Pastor Bob,
      > > >
      > > > I am unsure if you really are a pastor. Even
      > > though you are a
      > > > recognised pastor, you can't be a good pastor by
      > > how you
      > > critisized
      > > > Eric. Eric isn't your sheep; and you are not his
      > > shepherd, this is
      > > > for sure.
      > > >
      > > > A genuine pastor has a Jesus heart and he is
      > > gentle and loving.
      > > >
      > > > I am surprised by how you wrote to a stranger like
      > > Eric here.
      > > >
      > > > D
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > --- In exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com,
      > > "Katherine Davies"
      > > > <katdavies1973@y...> wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > Hi Matt,
      > > > >
      > > > > I am sorry that you have to go through this.
      > > No doubt it is
      > > very
      > > > > difficult. I encourage you to do what you can
      > > to keep your
      > > > marriage
      > > > > and to take a very active role in your
      > > children's lives. When
      > > one
      > > > > parent is having an affair whether or not is of
      > > the same sex -
      > > that
      > > > > affair consumes their time, interest, focus
      > > etc...
      > > > >
      > > > > I also encourage you to talk about this with
      > > others - here in
      > > this
      > > > > forum or in your safe group of friends -
      > > remember be selective
      > > > > because gossip flies fast.
      > > > >
      > > > > I remember my high school boyfriend proposing to
      > > me. I told him
      > > I
      > > > > could not get married until I had gone through
      > > what I needed to
      > > go
      > > > > through. I could not bring a family through my
      > > troubles like
      > > > this.
      > > > > When I hear of stories such as yours, my heart
      > > aches, because it
      > > is
      > > > > a long, long road to realization and then
      > > healing. I pray for
      > > you
      > > > > and your family.
      > > > >
      > > > > Kat D.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > --- In exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com,
      > > Matt Painter
      > > > > <mplebanon@y...> wrote:
      > > > > > Pastor Bob,
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Why do you think my interest in my wife is
      > > selfish? As a
      > > > > christian, I believe it is my duty to put trust
      > > in God that he
      > > can
      > > > > change anyone......it's called hope. I realize
      > > that if she
      > > changed
      > > > > it would make both my life and my children's
      > > lives
      > > better.......but
      > > > > I am more interested in my wife's soul and
      > > whether she is going
      > > to
      > > > > heaven or hell for her actions. I try not to
      > > judge.....but I
      > > would
      > > > > judge her by the same standard I would judge
      > > myself......and the
      > > > > Bible is the standard.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Even if my wife and I don't make it..........I
      > > pray
      > === message truncated ===
      >
      >
      > =====
      > -- In Him who leads us to the Absolute Truth,
      > Alan Levering; Founder, NCXDS Ex-Gay Internet Ministries
      >
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    • saltnlight@netryders.com
      Pastor Bob is so full of denial over what he said in this letter below that I was not going to approve his post but then decided I would so you could
      Message 42 of 42 , Dec 2, 2004
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        Pastor Bob is so full of denial over what he said in this letter below
        that I was not going to approve his post but then decided I would so you
        could see....For example:
        Bob:
        This is what you said in your post to Eric:
        “You do not hold her accountable for her actions.”
        “It is easier for you to let her get away with her behavior with no
        accountability”.

        Yet you deny having said this.

        You yell at me with this:
        “HOW DARE YOU SAY THAT I SAID THAT ERIC SHOULD GET A DIVORCE!! NO
        WHERE IN ANY MESSAGE I HAVE POSTED HAVE I EVER SAID THAT!!”
        Just what are you saying here in the post?????
        “This is harsh to say but if you really love her you will let her go into
        God's hands and stop permitting her to act this way toward you and your
        children. What you are doing is **keeping her around** so that you can
        avoid any conflict with her when **letting her go** would be much more
        difficult and cause you to lose this "hope".

        If this is not insinuating Eric leave her or let her leave him what is it??

        The first statement may have been different but in the second sentence you
        seals it, rather than keep her around he suggests Eric let her go
        literally.

        Bob you may have attempted to cover your tracks but you failed miserably.

        Another thing, Eric was not thinking only of himself when he spoke of the
        income. They have children and they would suffer and may be placed in
        foster homes if Eric sent his wife away or he left etc. You are the one
        who has selfish motives behind what you say to Eric. Why you aren't even
        thinking as Christ would over the situation. I did not nor did I have to
        twist what you said, you said it and that is fact, you were not as slick
        as you thought yourself to be. I do not feel that you had a right to say
        all that you did and that is my opinion.

        Bob, you seem to advocate for the wife in this matter more than try to
        help a man who is struggling with his love for a wayward wife. Reading
        into Eric’s post so easily and not giving him the benefit of encouragement
        for holding onto the mother of his kids. What you wrote not knowing Eric
        any more than from what he wrote in the post says to me that you would
        rather see the adulterous perverse relationship ensue than for his wife to
        come to her senses and be the wife she was supposed to be to Eric.

        You may not want to do a thesis but you need to return to studies for you
        do not have a mind that thinks of what this will one day mean to those
        children. Your entire thought is on today and satisfaction of the flesh.

        This woman married Eric, why? Because she loved him once. Who can say but
        what she will want out of this thing she has entered into and need Eric. I
        give him credit for having stuck in there this long.



        Janet





        > Janet:
        >
        > I really wonder why you have to twist and change what I have said:
        >
        > I said:
        >
        > "You do not hold her accountable for her actions."
        >
        > You say I said:
        >
        >
        > Now please tell me where I said that she had "no accountability?" I
        > said that Eric is not holding her accountable!** See above.

        "You judge my life from a few notes I have posted?" **Bob you judged Eric
        by the few he posted, look at your comments on his being an enabler etc.


        (and how can you say that I say God is dead
        just because I made a mistake and said "Christ had with the Church"?)
        **I never said that Bob had called God dead.
        > HOW DARE YOU SAY THAT I SAID THAT ERIC SHOULD GET A DIVORCE!! NO
        > WHERE IN ANY MESSAGE I HAVE POSTED HAVE I EVER SAID THAT!!

        Well, I don't know how you will take any of this but if this is any
        example then I guess you will not take it as it is meant. Bob you have
        forgiven me for what you percieve of me doing and that's alright but not
        necessary. Because you think I have done something to you that warrants
        forgiveness I accept and we will have to agree to disagree.

        Janet
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