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22978Re: [ExGDBd] Question for anyone who can give me advice about disolving domestic partnership

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  • ctickle777
    Mar 1, 2008
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      Dear Sabine,

      Wow, my heart aches with you right now because I see how enmeshed
      you are with this friend. However, I do feel very strongly that
      staying in this relationship is essentially holding you and your
      friend back from being truly free in Christ. Here's why I believe
      this based on what little information you have provided.

      1.) Your concerns are mutual in that both of you rely upon one
      another to "survive," be it in a medical sense and otherwise. God
      should be your primary Provider - not just in a spiritual sense, but
      in EVERY sense. So, I honestly feel that staying entertwined
      financially with your friend due to your particular personal
      circumstances is contradictory to what you have said.

      I can only imagine your fear in truly separating from your friend
      (moving out, separating assets, etc.). You must be riddled with fear
      of the future - and you are obviously worried about your past and
      fear God will pour out His wrath on you in the future. Guilt does
      NOT come from the Holy Spirit, Sabine. It comes from Satan. So, if
      you have accepted Christ you need to understand the finality of your
      salvation - the fullness of your freedom in Christ. You are NEW -
      your old self is not indicative of who you are NOW at this very
      moment! : ) So, rejoice in the finality of your salvation. As for
      worrying about your future - that's normal. We all worry about the
      uncertainties in life. But you can't allow this worry and fear to
      direct you down the current path. I, personally, think you need to
      separate yourself completely - figure out what you guys need to do
      to finalize the relationship. It appears that the two of you are
      very dependent upon one another but God truly needs to be the first
      one you turn to regardless your need. If your friend is filling that
      void in your life, God will never completely fill it. : )

      Finally, as for the issue of divorce. I may take a few hits with my
      opinion on this but Maurice quoted some really solid Scripture on
      this subject. (Matt. 19:3-9.) I have done numerous Bible studies on
      the topic of divorce and it is my understanding that divorce is okay
      in the event that one person has a "hardened heart." i.e.: that
      person did not want to reconcile the relationship. If you were that
      person who had the hardened heart, and you instigated the break-up
      that led to the divorce, then you may be the one at fault. Or, it
      may have been both of you, or just your husband. At any rate, living
      under the law is exactly what the Pharisees did - and Jesus
      condemned them for this time after time. Christ set us free from the
      bondage of the law (yoke). If God sends a man your way in the
      future, you can marry that man without worry that somehow you will
      be at fault or lose your salvation!!! God doesn't work that way, nor
      does His promise of salvation. You are free - forgiven - for
      EVERYTHING. God has changed you and you know what to do - if you
      were totally at peace with your living situation I don't think you'd
      have posted your questions with us - and that was a bold and
      courageous move. God is changing you, day by day, and bringing you
      into a life that He wants you to experience.

      Here's a question I have for you that I want you to ponder
      over.....How could Jesus Christ pay the penalty for your sins before
      you were ever born? He did it once and every person who has ever
      asked for God's gift of forgiveness through Jesus Christ is capable
      of receiving that FREE gift. The gift isn't contingent upon how well
      you live up to God's standards, or His laws. Truth is, we were
      forgiven for our past, present, and future before we were ever born -
      we simply had to choose to accept that free gift!!! That's why
      forgiveness, life, and salvation through Jesus Christ is a choice
      and not something God forces upon His creation. You are forgiven
      now - for the sins you have yet to even commit! Rejoice in this
      truth and know that God can repair every relationship in your life -
      and bring new relationships to fruition if that is His will and
      purpose. Sin has no scale, Sabine - remarrying isn't any worse than
      telling a lie. You made some mistakes - we all have - but we can't
      allow those mistakes to rule over us and place us back under the
      yoke of the law now that Christ has set us free. And Father loves
      you just as much right this minute, as He has always loved you - not
      because you have left the lifestyle (that is for your own benefit)
      but He loves you all the same. ; ) His love has never changed but
      your perception of yourself has changed. You realize your past was
      wrong - you've confessed and repented - now you need to rejoice and
      keep making these changes day-by-day to truly free yourself to live
      the life God created you to live in Him.

      If you're confused about all this "law" stuff, check out Bob
      George's book "Classic Christianity." It's a difficult subject that
      few Chrisians really understand (took me a couple of years to really
      work it all out mentally) but it's worth the effort. You are free
      but you aren't really experiencing the joy in being free in Christ.

      One final thought - your friend's salvation is not dependent upon
      you, Sabine. The Holy Spirit has to lead her to Him - you can plant
      the seeds but it may not be God's plan for you to see it through.
      Our assistant pastor said something so profound this past Sunday. He
      explained that on average, un-saved people need to hear the gospel
      message seven times. Then our pastor asked, "Are you willing to be
      witness number six?" What about witness number four, or even one?"

      I'll be praying for you both.

      In Christ,
      Christa Tickle

      --- In exgaydiscussionboard@yahoogroups.com, Thomas Morey
      <moreytom@...> wrote:
      > Dear Sabine:
      > Just as Ralph wisely said here, I also have no clear
      > directive for you from the Holy Spirit and Holy
      > Scripture, and it appears to me that you do now have
      > sufficient understanding of His Word, a broken spirit
      > and a contrite heart before God our Father. Remember,
      > He delights is such a disposition (Psalm 51:17), and
      > in one who takes seriously and heeds His Word (James
      > 1:25)! He certainly is not holding your choice from
      > the past against you. It is all under the blood of His
      > beloved Son; and washed away, as the driven snow is
      > white (Psalm 51:7), and as far as the east is from the
      > west (Psalm 103:12)!
      > May I add this related thought that has just come to
      > my mind, that the Apostle Paul and the author of
      > Hebrews (whether these are one and the same, we're not
      > sure) seem to make a big difference out of those who
      > had committed sin out of ignorance (1 Timothy 1:13),
      > and those who didn't because they already had made a
      > profession of faith and had access to all the
      > resources of His grace (Hebrews 6:4-6;10:26-31).
      > Another Pauline principle that is just coming to mind
      > is the concept of remaining in the circumstances in
      > which one was called to faith (unless of course this
      > is, or may become, a stumbling block to you and/or to
      > another or others) as described in 1 Corinthians
      > 7:17-39.
      > So it sounds as though you weren't a believer when the
      > DP contractual agreement became personally binding by
      > state law, correct? And, it also sounds as though you
      > believe that it is not a stumbling block to your
      > relationship with the Lord for you at present. The
      > question appears to remain whether it is stumbling
      > block, a benign matter, or possibly even a stepping
      > stone of sorts concerning your witness to your friend.
      > Is this right?
      > If so, concerning the issue of it being a possible
      > stumbling block, my suggestion is, if you haven't
      > already, is to get counsel from an Exodus-related
      > counselor and/or do either a personal study on the
      > issue of emotional dependency [Lori
      > Thorkelson-Rentzel's booklet of the same name (you can
      > get it at Exodus International website)], and to
      > continue to ask God how He sees it all after you have
      > done so. I'd also write down an exhaustive list of
      > advantages and disadvantages either way concerning
      > your own welfare and the welfare of your friend, after
      > doing either or both of my recommendations.
      > Obviously, this issue is not a cut and dry one, but
      > rather God's desire will be revealed to you from a
      > wisdom from above about your situation and what's in
      > your heart. So, only the Holy Spirit can reveal the
      > answer to you as You seek His will. However, I do ask
      > you to be at peace about it until He gives you a
      > clearer direction, because He is!
      > I hope this helps. Let us know how things are going in
      > your search for God's desire!
      > Blessings,
      > Tom
      > --- Maurice Brown <maurices5000@...> wrote:
      > > The scripture you are looking for is found at Matt
      > > 19:3 - 9.
      > >
      > > "3 And Pharisees came up to him, intent on
      > > tempting him and saying: "Is it lawful for a man to
      > > divorce his wife on every sort of ground?" 4 In
      > > reply he said: "Did YOU not read that he who created
      > > them from [the] beginning made them male and female
      > > 5 and said, `For this reason a man will leave his
      > > father and his mother and will stick to his wife,
      > > and the two will be one flesh'? 6 So that they are
      > > no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore, what God
      > > has yoked together let no man put apart." 7 They
      > > said to him: "Why, then, did Moses prescribe giving
      > > a certificate of dismissal and divorcing her?" 8 He
      > > said to them: "Moses, out of regard for YOUR
      > > hardheartedness, made the concession to YOU of
      > > divorcing YOUR wives, but such has not been the case
      > > from [the] beginning. 9 I say to YOU that whoever
      > > divorces his wife, except on the ground of
      > > fornication, and marries another commits adultery."
      > > "
      > >
      > > Has your husband remarried? If he has remarried
      > > then he has put you away and you may remarry.
      > > However, my church's understanding of the
      > > traditional stance in regards to this scripture is
      > > that the adulterer CANNOT put the innocent party
      > > away.
      > >
      > > So this is where i agree with you. If he has not
      > > remarried, you may still be bound to him until he
      > > shows by his actions that he has put you away. I
      > > don't know if that means dating or engaged to
      > > another woman or marriage. I would presume that if
      > > he has not remarried, neither can you.
      > >
      > > If he has married another woman, you are free to
      > > remarry. A man cannot have but one wife.
      > >
      > > Legally, I've heard of people setting their own
      > > terms. People do this all the time when they are
      > > wealthy. The bread winner never wants to give half
      > > his possessions to his wife. They usually set the
      > > terms of what EVEN is. For example a person can take
      > > the house while another can take the car and other
      > > stuff. Or they may choose to sell them and divide
      > > the money. I think there are quite a few options,
      > > but I've never been married and my education is
      > > solely from TELEVISION. :-)
      > >
      > > Just some thoughts. I hope it is useful.
      > >
      > > Sabine <pugpaws01-paingroup@...> wrote:
      > > Hi,
      > >
      > > I have been in a relationship with my girlfriend for
      > > 15 years. Last
      > > year I turned my life over to Christ and repented of
      > > my sin of
      > > homosexuality. Its been very difficult because I
      > > care deeply for my
      > > friend and want more than anything for her to get
      > > saved as well.
      > >
      > > We have had many long talks, angry talks, as she
      > > doesn't understand
      > > how this could happen. I have decided to stay living
      > > as room-mates
      > > and friends (we own our house and everything else as
      > > joint). We now
      > > live in separate rooms and no longer are intimate.
      > > Though this is
      > > very difficult for my friend, she has accepted it
      > > and is trying to
      > > cope. God has taken away my desire for the first
      > > time in my life
      > > continue in homosexuality.
      > >
      > > I have been praying for my friend and she agreed to
      > > begin going to
      > > church with me. I don't know whether it is to please
      > > me because she
      > > hopes I will change my mind or what - but at this
      > > point I am just
      > > happy that she is going as I really needed to get
      > > back into church.
      > > I just continue to pray for her and ask God daily to
      > > help me show her
      > > an example of what He can do in her life.
      > >
      > > Here's the thing - I don't feel as if I am doing
      > > wrong by continuing
      > > to live with her as a friend for many reasons.
      > > First, we have always
      > > been very close friends and I want to keep that,
      > > second I want her to
      > > get saved and I honestly believe if I just leave and
      > > abandon her, she
      > > will never come to Christ, third, we both have
      > > severe medical
      > > conditions and neither of us have anyone else to
      > > take care of each
      > > other when we are in the hospital, (which seems to
      > > be frequently) and
      > > I think we should continue to support each other in
      > > this way, fourth,
      > > I am divorced and I cannot remarry based on what the
      > > bible says
      > > regarding divorce and remarriage. My husband did not
      > > commit adultery
      > > on me and therefore if I remarry I commit adultery.
      > > (I do have a
      > > verse for this but can't think if it off the top of
      > > my head).
      > >
      > > Here's my concern - I'm not worried about what other
      > > people think -
      > > first, I tell everyone that we are not together, we
      > > are just room-
      > > mates and living in California with high costs of
      > > housing its not
      > > unusual for 2 or 3 or 4 people to live together to
      > > be able to buy a
      > > house.
      > >
      > > However, we entered into a domestic parternship many
      > > years ago for
      > > the sole reason of protecting us when either of us
      > > was in the
      > > hospital. Unfortunately the rules have changed and
      > > now its like
      > > getting a divorce and very complicated. I feel as if
      > > I should have
      > > this disolved, but everything I read says that they
      > > divide our
      > > property and order support etc. I don't want that.
      > > We would
      > > continue to own our house together and everything
      > > else. I don't want
      > > alimony ordered either. I don't even know if we have
      > > the right to
      > > say we just want the domestic order disolved, but we
      > > want to make our
      > > own divisions - (or non divisions as it may be).
      > >
      > > I would appreciate any advice that anybody might
      > > have regarding this,
      > > and what you think about disolving the domestic
      > > partnership agreement
      > > itself.
      > >
      > > I still suffer so much guilt for having lived this
      > > way and sometimes
      > > I fear that God will punish me for keeping this
      > > domestic partnership
      > > agreement together.
      > >
      > > Thanks for any info anyone can give me.
      > >
      > > Sabine
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > ---------------------------------
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      > >
      > >
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