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3491Re: [ExExGayMinistry] My schizophrenia

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  • Scott Russell
    Mar 1, 2005
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      Hi Korry,

      Here's my scatter-shot response (at first blush):

      Yeah, I studied Joe Nicolosi too. I met him several times and he does seem to be a compassionate and convincing speaker.

      But in the end it is an issue of biblical worldview.

      Reparative therapists and Fundies CANNOT conceive that homosexuals could be anything else but heterosexuals who are misbehaving. Scripture leaves no room for long-term, committed same-sex relationships, not just because they had no experience of such, but sex was meant for PROCREATION nothing else. This is the biblical mandate -- be fruitful and multiply, grow the nation.

      Could God have plans for other of his children? Might there be another role for us to play besides breeding?

      As much as individuals might want to "become" heterosexual, all I have ever witnessed were individuals that Exodus helped "behave" hetersexually. No change in orientation, only change in behavior. Is this healthy? Dobson and others would say so -- it makes them more comfortable. I honestly don't recall any "successes" in Exodus that said their orientation changed. My theory is that those who have the best behavioral change are those who are truly bi-sexual the first place. But conservatives don't believe in bi-sexuals either. I have never and will never have feelings for women -- I'm just trying to be honest. If that makes me an abomination, I will put my self in the hands of a loving and merciful God. God save me from the clutches of his loyal "followers."

      In the Episcopal Church we are fighting to protect our first openly gay bishop -- it is an issue of honesty. Gene Robinson tried reparative therapy -- it didn't work. Rather than live as a priest and now bishop in the closet, he is being honest and open with his life and his story. He's being called every name in the book, but in the end he is simply a man of integrity.

      I'm glad to see you are reading Yeats and Renoir not just Paul or Joe Nicolosi.

      Keep it up!


      korrykorrykoan <korrykorrykoan@...> wrote:

      "Things fall apart/The center cannot hold...The best lack all
      conviction/And the worst are full of passionate intensity."

      W.B. Yeats, The Second Coming

      The Yeats poem kind of sums up how I feel at the moment with regards
      to both sides of the debate. That, and Jean Renoir�s "It is a time
      when everyone is lying" from La Regle de la Ju

      I go back and forth with regards to the sexual identity thing. I have
      read just about everything there is to read regarding reparative
      therapy that I could find, especially NARTH.

      I find myself agreeing with most of what Josesph Nicolosi writes. As
      a gay man I find myself agreeing with just about everything he has to
      write regarding the pathological roots of same-sex attraction in men.
      I should know, I was the classic "kitchen window boy" in my
      childhood, estranged from my crazy, temperamental, alcoholic father,
      as well as my hostile and abusive older brothers. By contrast, I was
      always finding comfort, consolation and compassion in the company of
      my mother, grandmother, or any of my many aunts.

      I was overweight as a kid from a combination of too much junk food
      and hardly any physical activity. I was the boy who was a complete
      screw-up in gymn and was the butt of ridicule and abuse from the
      other kids. Of course I was artistic, precocious, and sensitive. And
      profoundly haunted by that feeling of "gender emptiness" and a deep
      sense of shame over being such a sissy.

      But the curious thing is that until adolescence hit, I had hetero-
      erotic feelings. I�d pop an instant boner whenever I looked at my
      brother�s stolen copies of Playboy; big tits, curvaceous ass, the
      whole bit. I also had some latent erotic feelings looking at naked
      guys, especially guy�s butts, but it wasn�t until I turned twelve
      that I experienced a major sea change in my feelings. Women no longer
      turned me on, but the other boys and the other guys did -- BIG TIME.

      Still, adolescence (which for me was in the late 70�s) was hellish. I
      got beat up a lot for being a wimp and a nerd, my father died from
      alcoholism, and my brothers just got meaner and more abusive.

      I grew up close to NYC, and got into the cruising scene pretty early,
      having sex in tea rooms and alleys, and in the private homes of older
      (and old) men. All the time I loathed myself for a myriad of reasons.

      Gay life is sleazy and dysfunctional, though it may not politically
      correct to broach this. But I have seen quite a bit of gay life in
      New York, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Seattle, Vancouver,
      Denver...and many other places. I have attended Radical Faerie
      gatherings, and boy oh boy the things I have seen (and sometimes

      Why I agree with Nicolosi is because I see the trauma over and over
      again. I see guys estranged from their own masculinity, guys who were
      overmothered and underfathered, who somehow think that another�s
      guy�s cum is a sort of elixer that will provide them the missing
      element in their hearts. The body types I notice in the gay male
      community tend to be 1)out-of-shape or 2)when guys do start pumping
      up, they become ultra-narcissitic about their bodies.

      There is the surprisingly high level of mental illness prevalent in
      the gay male community, at least I have found. More so than in the
      company of straight men, I find too many hysterical drama queens who
      overreact emotionally to all sorts of circumstances, and too many
      overeducated gay men with inflated egos about their academic and
      artistic gifts. There is the high amount of drinking, doping, and
      smoking that goes on as well.

      Then there is the sex addiction, which all too often is more powerful
      than any fear of death or disease. Which is why you read about gay
      male safe-sex educators who work in public clinics admitting that
      they engage in unsafe sex in bathhouses and circuit parties.

      But I feel equally pessimistic about "reparative therapy" for gay
      men. Women are a different story altogehter, and I have known way too
      man ex-lesbians who transition all the time without the need of
      therapy or religion. They just do.

      By contrast, my own experience with Exodus was not encouraging, and
      when even Alan Medinger, one of the main proponents of Christian ex-
      gay therapy states that Exodus�s definition of heterosexuality DOES
      NOT include either erotic feelings or fantasies about the opposite
      sex, you have to wonder: go figure.

      Indeed, I find the right-wing Christian ex-gay trip the flip side of
      the same coin of dysfunction as the gay male lifestyle.

      When you notice that the hottest category for porn these days
      is "young straight guys" then you know that what we are craving in
      our sexual feelings is both our mascunility ("straight") and
      innocence ("young").

      But even if we learn how to play touch football, find surrogate
      fathers and brothers, and pray to Jesus...I have seen scant evidence
      that that makes you straight. It�s pathetic when I correspond
      with "ex-gay" guys who claim that they have been on "the healing
      path" for 15 years and are just, ALMOST (perhaps?) have "feelings"
      for women. How pathetic.

      So what�s the solution? I will write more in my next post after I get
      flamed for this one.

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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