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3374Re: [ExExGayMinistry] Re: Digest Number 384

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  • JC
    Feb 1, 2005
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      I agree with you regarding the term "anti-gay", Drew. I was simply quoting it from the previous post I was responding to.

      Cheers,
      James

      Drew VanDyche <vandyche@...> wrote:

      James: Forgive me, but I find the term "anti-gay" misused, overused and a simplistic label to throw around and incompatible with conversations about such a complex issue as "faith and sexuality" and I wish we would stop using it. It is a polarized, sociological/political term and I prefer to speak in psychological terms regarding individuals rather than lumping people together as factions. Again, to postulate in those terms is partaking of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. We are all fallen short of the glory of God. Only when one relinquishes control to freedom in Christ are we free to love self and others. That love only becomes unconditional when we cease to judge. I'm not sure that "righteous anger" is accessible to any human being not born of a virgin.
      Just my thoughts,
      Drew

      JC wrote:
      Sorry guys... but I cannot even "come to the table" with the idea that anti-gay Christians are often very well intentioned. They may *believe* that they are, but that does not make it so. Their actions are based in the desire to control; and this desire to control is based in fear. "Perfect love casts out all fear."

      Having grown up in a fundamentalist family, and having been educated in an evangelical college and seminary, I say from my own experience that some of our more conservative brothers and sisters are often not ready to let God do the saving of individuals and of the creation. There is this need to manipulate that is based in doubt and fear and not the sovereignty of God.

      When I rest in the idea that Jesus is the Lord of all, then I let go of my own desires to control what does not belong to me.

      My Two Cents,
      James


      nyguy_1225 wrote:

      <his view on homosexuality), you would have to conclude that he is
      pro-family, pro-God, and advocates love. I challenge you to remove
      his viewpoint on homosexuality and see if you would not agree with
      his position on most everything else. If not, then who is following
      Christ's teaching and who is not?>>

      Jerry, take a closer look. The arguments of the anti-gay folks,
      like Dobson, are often very well-intentioned, but their goals and
      objectives seem to be different from those of Jesus. The arguments
      have to do with very secular concerns: control over chaos, majority
      rule, fear of the other, fear of the unknown, and an idealization of
      a family unit that Jesus himself never lived or idealized.

      -Alex


      --- In exexgayministry@yahoogroups.com, "Jerry" wrote:
      >
      > Once again my point was proven over and over again because a
      person cannot express anything but left-wing views on this site
      without being attacked. Do you think Jesus would respond in such a
      fashion? Definitely not! You talk about James Dobson spreading
      hate? How so? For a person to speak about his understanding of
      what the Bible teaches is not hatred, unless it contains hatred in
      words or deeds. It may be wrong, but it is not hatred unless he
      hates people and advocates hatred. I see no evidence of that at all
      in what he teaches. If you were to be able to just take every
      viewpoint he has (except his view on homosexuality), you would have
      to conclude that he is pro-family, pro-God, and advocates love. I
      challenge you to remove his viewpoint on homosexuality and see if
      you would not agree with his position on most everything else. If
      not, then who is following Christ's teaching and who is not?
      >
      > Jerry
      >
      >
      > THOUGHT FOR THE MONTH: Jesus said it: "Do unto others as you would
      have them do unto you."
      >


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      Drew VanDyche
      aka: Drewcifer, Drewski, Drewblood...
      http://profiles.yahoo.com/vandyche



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