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Re: [evol-psych] " Belief in Evolutionary Psychology May Be Hardwired, Study Says "

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  • james kohl
    From: Edgar Owen As usual Kohl does NOT address the issues and examples raised but just mindlessly denigrates the sender. That s NOT how
    Message 1 of 82 , Nov 30, 2012
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      From: Edgar Owen <edgarowen@...>
      As usual Kohl does NOT address the issues and examples raised but just mindlessly denigrates the sender.

      That's NOT how science is done Jim...

      JK: Science is done via research, presentations and publications. I cited research on the ram model because I included the ram model in my book chapter after first presenting with Perkins in 1993 at a symposium I organized. What is your scientific background Edgar? What qualifies you to tell me how science is done, when I'm the one with the awards for publishing?

      James V. Kohl
      Medical laboratory scientist (ASCP)
      Independent researcher
      Kohl, J.V. (2012) Human pheromones and food odors: epigenetic influences on the socioaffective nature of evolved behaviors. Socioaffective Neuroscience & Psychology, 2: 17338.


      On Nov 29, 2012, at 7:44 PM, james kohl wrote:

       

      The ram as a model for behavioral neuroendocrinology.

      Perkins A, Roselli CE.

      Horm Behav. 2007 Jun;52(1):70-7.

      The Mind's Eyes: Human pheromones, neuroscience, and male sexual preferences
      "The across-species genetic conservation of intercellular and extracellular chemical communication enables unicellular and multicellular organisms to functionally distinguish between self and non-self. Non-self olfactory/pheromonal input from the social environment elicits a vertebrate neuroendocrine response. The organization and activation of this neuroendocrine response modulates the concurrent maturation of the mammalian neuroendocrine system, the reproductive system, and the central nervous system during the development of sexual preferences that may be expressed in sexual behavior. Psycho-physiological mechanisms for the development of these sexual preferences include focus on unconscious affects that are detailed in reciprocal cause and effect relationships. Olfactory/pheromonal conditioning elicits neuroendocrine effects accompanied by unconscious affects on the development of sexual preferences. Integrating these unconscious affects extends to humans a developmental model of behavior that includes the development of male sexual preferences for other males." -- Winner of the Reiss Theory Award (2007)
      ------------------------------

      As always, Edgar knows less about this than anyone I know but is not afraid of showing that. What's great is that he's telling Sonny who will try and learn even more about this from his textbooks.
       
      James V. Kohl
      Medical laboratory scientist (ASCP)
      Independent researcher
      Kohl, J.V. (2012) Human pheromones and food odors: epigenetic influences on the socioaffective nature of evolved behaviors. Socioaffective Neuroscience & Psychology, 2: 17338.



      From: Edgar Owen <edgarowen@...>
      To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Thu, November 29, 2012 7:00:24 PM
      Subject: Re: [evol-psych] " Belief in Evolutionary Psychology May Be Hardwired, Study Says "

       

      Sonny,


      It's simply not true that homosexuality naturally occurs among other animals at anywhere near the frequency it does in humans which is just a couple of % points.

      I wrote a long explanation of this here showing how the so called evidence is something altogether different. I don't have time to repeat that post now but I'm sure it's in the archives...

      To mention one example. Male dogs occasionally mount other male dogs but this is just displaced normal sexuality which is easily proven by the introduction of a female dog in heat to the mix. When the female dog in heat is present you can bet BOTH males will go after her with great determination even to the point of serious fights among themselves.

      So the only valid conclusion is that BOTH males are STRONGLY heterosexual and NOT homosexual.

      Compare that to 2 homosexual MEN in the presence of an attractive willing female. The males will go after each other not the female.

      Conclusion? The humans ARE homosexual, the dogs ARE NOT.

      This is a good example of how modern PC nonsense consistently misinterprets evidence to conform to PC ideology often as here in a way to disparage and diminish normal masculinity and normal male power.

      True homosexuality, properly defined as consistent preference for same sex sexual unions in the presence of available partners of the opposite sex, is ALMOST NONEXISTENT IN NON HUMAN ANIMALS.

      Thus we must suspect that human homosexuality is likely largely a behavioral disorder rather than natural behavior.

      I can think of a number of reasons for this I won't go into now but a lot of it has to do with modern human females making themselves psychologically unattractive to men in a number of ways.


      Edgar



      On Nov 29, 2012, at 8:55 AM, clarence_sonny_williams wrote:

       

      Edgar,

      Yes, "rife," is a poor word. Same sex pairings occur in many species,
      apparently at (low) levels comparable to humans.

      --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, Edgar Owen
      <edgarowen@...> wrote:
      >
      > Sonny,
      >
      > As I've pointed out in great detail "homosexual behavior is NOT rife
      in nature". That's a total PC misreading of animal behavior...
      >
      > Edgar
      >
      > On Nov 28, 2012, at 7:13 PM, clarence_sonny_williams wrote:
      >
      <snip>




    • Anna
      In such case, let’s have a look at sexual immorality. How would you link it to empathy considering that immorality is that what is not moral? Anna
      Message 82 of 82 , Dec 7, 2012
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        In such case, let’s  have a look at sexual  immorality. How would you link it  to empathy considering that immorality is that what is not moral?
         
        Anna
         
        immorality (ˌɪməˈrælɪtɪ) [Click for IPA pronunciation guide]
        n , pl -ties
         the quality, character, or state of being immoral
         immoral behaviour, esp in sexual matters; licentiousness; profligacy or promiscuity
        an immoral act
         
        From: Brad
        Sent: Friday, December 07, 2012 6:49 AM
        Subject: Re: [evol-psych] " Belief in Evolutionary Psychology May Be Hardwired, Study Says "
         
         

        Anna writes: "Morality can be based on  group’s interests which have nothing to do with empathy. "


        What's best for the group might be better defined as an ideology rather than based on morality.
        Is it that the human sense of morality has been overtly domesticated or better yet indoctrinated by ideologies?
         
        Memetic transfusion
         
        Brad



        "In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."


        -- George Orwell

        From: Anna <pantheon@...>
        To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Thursday, December 6, 2012 6:25 PM
        Subject: Re: [evol-psych] " Belief in Evolutionary Psychology May Be Hardwired, Study Says "
         
         
        No, this is typical  ‘intentional reasoning’. 
        Morality can be based on  group’s interests which have nothing to do with empathy.  
        Anyway, if animals had the same morality as humans, they would not survive one day in the wild.
        “Something like moral sense” is human interpretation of animal behavior.
         
        Anna
         
        From: Brad
        Sent: Thursday, December 06, 2012 7:07 AM
        Subject: Re: [evol-psych] " Belief in Evolutionary Psychology May Be Hardwired, Study Says "
         
         
        Anna writes: "but morality. Empathy and altruism are not the same as morality"



        Empathy and Reciprocity are at the very foundation of morality. The behaviour is innate in all primates but we self proclaimed higher primates gave it a category and name.
        What you sent is a montage of Postmodernist jargon that is laughable and debunked by Alan Sokal and Jean Bricmont.
        http://www.amazon.com/Intellectual-Impostures-Alan-Sokal/dp/1861976313
        I recall your originally citing Frans De Waal because you agreed with this work. He has altered his views as demonstrated in the video I posted.
        De Waal, a pioneer in the topic of animal empathy, said that this is just one example of mammals displaying something approaching a moral sense. He said that mammals frequently display empathy and reciprocity, crucial components of morality.
        De Waal : "I do think that human morality didn't start from scratch -- human morality started with the primate psychology which has all these tendencies of reciprocity and empathy and following social rules and so on...so we took that psychology and we turned it into a moral system," he said.
         

        If you're not an animal then what are you?
         
        Brad



        "In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."


        -- George Orwell

        From: Anna <pantheon@...>
        To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Wednesday, December 5, 2012 8:33 PM
        Subject: Re: [evol-psych] " Belief in Evolutionary Psychology May Be Hardwired, Study Says "
         
         
        The example with the gorilla shows that gorillas are capable of altruism,  what I have never denied.
        However,  it is not what we are arguing, but morality. Empathy and altruism are not the same as morality.  And they do not have to be a foundation of morals.
        I have send  you the most common definition, but you still insist on defending your  position, although it is a major reasoning error to derive such conclusion..
        Perhaps then you need to study  the paper I am including below  to understand how  and why you did it.
        Anna
         
        <snip>


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