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Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

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  • merle lester
    u don t need anyone at the top of the tree ...merle
    Message 1 of 15 , May 1 11:36 PM
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       u don't need anyone at the" top of the tree"...merle



      On 02/05/2011, at 3:02 PM, Steve Corsini wrote:



      When it comes down to it SOMEBODY has to be at the top of the hierarchy - and act as a symbolic figurehead for the "Sovereignty of the people"  
       
      Although I'm not that keen on the idea of hereditary kings and Queens, they are at least constrained by Parliament
      I'd rather have QE2 at the top of the tree than say Donald Trump, Robert Mugabe, Colonel Gadaffi or Pol Pot
       
      SJC


      From: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com [mailto:evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ED
      Sent: Monday, 2 May 2011 12:40 AM
      To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest



      The moral of the story is: Refrain from spoiling the fun and games that the powerful, rich and famous are having, and especially when the vast majority of commoners also relish the pageant with its joyful vibrations, including every princess openly indulging in her fantasies of marrying a prince.

       

      --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Corsini" <sjcarc@...> wrote:

      They should consider themselves lucky they were actually charged -
      They could have been held as terrorists and been kept incommunicado for weeks or months ...
      SJC


      Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

      by Michael Balter on  29 April 2011, 2:08 PM

      Yesterday evening, while Prince William and Kate Middleton (now the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge) were making last minute preparations for their royal wedding, two well-known anthropologists were arrested for helping to plan a "Zombie Wedding" in downtown London. Although the anti-monarchist protest was advertised as street theater, police were apparently not amused by the promised appearance of a working guillotine, and the benediction "May Royal Heads Roll!" They hauled the couple off to jail.

      Anthropologists Chris Knight and Camilla Power, who live together in south London, were arrested at their home along with a third activist for conspiracy to cause a public nuisance and breach of the peace. The arrest was filmed by a film crew and later posted on YouTube. Scotland Yard confirmed that they were still in custody as of 1 p.m. E.D.T. today.

      To go with the wedding, the pair had planned street theater that they called a "Right Royal Orgy," to begin in London's Soho Square, proceed to Piccadilly Circus, and end at Westminster Abbey just when William and Kate were to be married.

      Power teaches anthropology at the University of East London, where Knight also worked until 2009, when he was fired by the university in connection with organizing a previous political protest. The pair are celebrated for their contributions to the study of the evolution of human culture and symbolism, and are a regular fixture at evolution of language meetings. They are also founders and leaders in the London-based Radical Anthropology Group, and are known for their sometimes provocative political actions.

      As Knight's Web page, which has not been updated since the arrest, puts it: "I do science; I also do political street theatre. I hope you'll respect the science, but please don't take my theatrical pronouncements too seriously or literally. A sense of humor is presupposed!"

      Source: Science
      http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2011/04/anti-royal-anthropologists-arrested.html?etoc

      Posted by
      Robert Karl Stonjek





    • Graeme
      merle lester wrote u don t need anyone at the top of the tree ...merle Graeme: other than symbolically! Our Prime Minister is an elected MHR (Member of the
      Message 2 of 15 , May 2 2:46 AM
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        merle lester wrote

         

         u don't need anyone at the" top of the tree"...merle


        Graeme: other than symbolically!  Our Prime Minister is an elected MHR (Member of the House of Representatives) whose job it is to represent me, not to lead me.  I can lead myself perfectly well, if I am educated (rather than schooled or indoctrinated) and am permitted access to the information required to make decisions.  I would hope, but not assume, that such a person at the top had both access to the same information, and a capacity to interpret it then act in the interests of those who elect them. 

         

        Graeme Deeth B.V.Sc., B.A. (Psych), B.Psych (Hons 1st class), FACCP.
        P.O. Box 548
        Southport BC
        QLD 4215
        Australia
        M: +61418751617
        Ph: +61755911193
        Fax: +61755939492

        Web: www.cpccpc.com.au

         

        This correspondence is for the named persons only.
        It may contain confidential or privileged information or both.
        No confidentiality or privilege is waived or lost by any mis transmission.
        If you receive this correspondence in error please delete it from your system immediately and notify the sender.
        You must not disclose, copy or relay on any part of this correspondence, if you are not the intended recipient.
        Any opinions expressed in this message are those of the individual sender except where the sender expressly, and with the authority, states them to be the opinions of the defined organisation.

         

         

        On 02/05/2011, at 3:02 PM, Steve Corsini wrote:



         

        When it comes down to it SOMEBODY has to be at the top of the hierarchy - and act as a symbolic figurehead for the "Sovereignty of the people"  

         

        Although I'm not that keen on the idea of hereditary kings and Queens, they are at least constrained by Parliament

        I'd rather have QE2 at the top of the tree than say Donald Trump, Robert Mugabe, Colonel Gadaffi or Pol Pot

         

        SJC

         


        From: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com [mailto:evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ED
        Sent: Monday, 2 May 2011 12:40 AM
        To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

         


        The moral of the story is: Refrain from spoiling the fun and games that the powerful, rich and famous are having, and especially when the vast majority of commoners also relish the pageant with its joyful vibrations, including every princess openly indulging in her fantasies of marrying a prince.

         

        --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Corsini" <sjcarc@...> wrote:

        They should consider themselves lucky they were actually charged -

        They could have been held as terrorists and been kept incommunicado for weeks or months ...

        SJC

         


        --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, RKS  wrote:

         

        Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

        by Michael Balter on 29 April 2011, 2:08 PM

        Yesterday evening, while Prince William and Kate Middleton (now the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge) were making last minute preparations for their royal wedding, two well-known anthropologists were arrested for helping to plan a "Zombie Wedding" in downtown London. Although the anti-monarchist protest was advertised as street theater, police were apparently not amused by the promised appearance of a working guillotine, and the benediction "May Royal Heads Roll!" They hauled the couple off to jail.

        Anthropologists Chris Knight and Camilla Power, who live together in south London, were arrested at their home along with a third activist for conspiracy to cause a public nuisance and breach of the peace. The arrest was filmed by a film crew and later posted on YouTube. Scotland Yard confirmed that they were still in custody as of 1 p.m. E.D.T. today.

        To go with the wedding, the pair had planned street theater that they called a "Right Royal Orgy," to begin in London's Soho Square, proceed to Piccadilly Circus, and end at Westminster Abbey just when William and Kate were to be married.

        Power teaches anthropology at the University of East London, where Knight also worked until 2009, when he was fired by the university in connection with organizing a previous political protest. The pair are celebrated for their contributions to the study of the evolution of human culture and symbolism, and are a regular fixture at evolution of language meetings. They are also founders and leaders in the London-based Radical Anthropology Group, and are known for their sometimes provocative political actions.

        As Knight's Web page, which has not been updated since the arrest, puts it: "I do science; I also do political street theatre. I hope you'll respect the science, but please don't take my theatrical pronouncements too seriously or literally. A sense of humor is presupposed!"

        Source: Science
        http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2011/04/anti-royal-anthropologists-arrested.html?etoc

        Posted by
        Robert Karl Stonjek

         

         

         

      • Edgar Owen
        This is an atavistic notion. The ideal government is a completely non political meritocracy where government employees rise to the top based on competence and
        Message 3 of 15 , May 2 5:01 AM
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          This is an atavistic notion. The ideal government is a completely non political meritocracy where government employees rise to the top based on competence and the government is almost totally a civil service devoted to providing essential services to the populace. In such a system a strong leader is unnecessary.

          Edgar



          On May 2, 2011, at 1:02 AM, Steve Corsini wrote:

           

          When it comes down to it SOMEBODY has to be at the top of the hierarchy - and act as a symbolic figurehead for the "Sovereignty of the people"  
           
          Although I'm not that keen on the idea of hereditary kings and Queens, they are at least constrained by Parliament
          I'd rather have QE2 at the top of the tree than say Donald Trump, Robert Mugabe, Colonel Gadaffi or Pol Pot
           
          SJC


          From: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com [mailto:evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ED
          Sent: Monday, 2 May 2011 12:40 AM
          To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

           


          The moral of the story is: Refrain from spoiling the fun and games that the powerful, rich and famous are having, and especially when the vast majority of commoners also relish the pageant with its joyful vibrations, including every princess openly indulging in her fantasies of marrying a prince.

           

          --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Corsini" <sjcarc@...> wrote:

          They should consider themselves lucky they were actually charged -
          They could have been held as terrorists and been kept incommunicado for weeks or months ...
          SJC


          Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

          by Michael Balter on 29 April 2011, 2:08 PM

          Yesterday evening, while Prince William and Kate Middleton (now the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge) were making last minute preparations for their royal wedding, two well-known anthropologists were arrested for helping to plan a "Zombie Wedding" in downtown London. Although the anti-monarchist protest was advertised as street theater, police were apparently not amused by the promised appearance of a working guillotine, and the benediction "May Royal Heads Roll!" They hauled the couple off to jail.

          Anthropologists Chris Knight and Camilla Power, who live together in south London, were arrested at their home along with a third activist for conspiracy to cause a public nuisance and breach of the peace. The arrest was filmed by a film crew and later posted on YouTube. Scotland Yard confirmed that they were still in custody as of 1 p.m. E.D.T. today.

          To go with the wedding, the pair had planned street theater that they called a "Right Royal Orgy," to begin in London's Soho Square, proceed to Piccadilly Circus, and end at Westminster Abbey just when William and Kate were to be married.

          Power teaches anthropology at the University of East London, where Knight also worked until 2009, when he was fired by the university in connection with organizing a previous political protest. The pair are celebrated for their contributions to the study of the evolution of human culture and symbolism, and are a regular fixture at evolution of language meetings. They are also founders and leaders in the London-based Radical Anthropology Group, and are known for their sometimes provocative political actions.

          As Knight's Web page, which has not been updated since the arrest, puts it: "I do science; I also do political street theatre. I hope you'll respect the science, but please don't take my theatrical pronouncements too seriously or literally. A sense of humor is presupposed!"

          Source: Science
          http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2011/04/anti-royal-anthropologists-arrested.html?etoc

          Posted by
          Robert Karl Stonjek




        • mark hubey
          Maybe one day they can have happening in which anthropologists are cooked in great pots like in cartoons. It would be nice also to have people play the roles
          Message 4 of 15 , May 2 6:19 AM
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            Maybe one day they can have "happening" in which anthropologists
            are cooked in great pots like in cartoons. It would be nice also to have people play the roles of cannibals and roast some anthropologists.

            Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

            by Michael Balter on 29 April 2011, 2:08 PM

            Yesterday evening, while Prince William and Kate Middleton (now the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge) were making last minute preparations for their royal wedding, two well-known anthropologists were arrested for helping to plan a "Zombie Wedding" in downtown London. Although the anti-monarchist protest was advertised as street theater, police were apparently not amused by the promised appearance of a working guillotine, and the benediction "May Royal Heads Roll!" They hauled the couple off to jail.



            --
            Regards,
            Mark Hubey

            "If it can't be expressed in figures, it is not science; it is opinion." — Robert Heinlein--Spoken by character Lazarus Long in Time Enough for Love (1973). In Leon E. Stover, Heinlein (1987)


          • ED
            Why and how did the transformation of leadership style from Queen Victoria to QE2 occur? --ED In his book Late Victorian Holocausts, published in 2001, Mike
            Message 5 of 15 , May 2 8:21 AM
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              Why and how did the transformation of leadership style from Queen Victoria to QE2 occur?  --ED

               

              "In his book Late Victorian Holocausts, published in 2001, Mike Davis tells the story of famines that killed between 12 and 29 million Indians.

              These people were, he demonstrates, murdered by British state policy. When an El Niño drought destituted the farmers of the Deccan plateau in 1876 there was a net surplus of rice and wheat in India.

              But the viceroy, Lord Lytton, insisted that nothing should prevent its export to England. In 1877 and 1878, at the height of the famine, grain merchants exported a record 6.4m hundredweight of wheat. As the peasants began to starve, officials were ordered "to discourage relief works in every possible way".

              The Anti-Charitable Contributions Act of 1877 prohibited "at the pain of imprisonment private relief donations that potentially interfered with the market fixing of grain prices".

              The only relief permitted in most districts was hard labour, from which anyone in an advanced state of starvation was turned away.

              In the labour camps, the workers were given less food than inmates of Buchenwald. In 1877, monthly mortality in the camps equated to an annual death rate of 94%.

              As millions died, the imperial government launched "a militarised campaign to collect the tax arrears accumulated during the drought".

              The money, which ruined those who might otherwise have survived the famine, was used by Lytton to fund his war in Afghanistan.

              Even in places that had produced a crop surplus, the government's export policies, like Stalin's in Ukraine, manufactured hunger.

              In the north-western provinces, Oud and the Punjab, which had brought in record harvests in the preceeding three years, at least 1.25m died."

              Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2005/dec/27/eu.turkey

               

              --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, SJC wrote:


              > When it comes down to it SOMEBODY has to be at the top of the hierarchy - and act as a symbolic figurehead for the "Sovereignty of the people"

              > Although I'm not that keen on the idea of hereditary kings and Queens, they are at least constrained by Parliament
              > I'd rather have QE2 at the top of the tree than say Donald Trump, Robert Mugabe, Colonel Gadaffi or Pol Pot

              >  SJC

               
              > > The moral of the story is: Refrain from spoiling the fun and games that the powerful, rich and famous are having, and especially when the vast majority of commoners also relish the pageant with its joyful vibrations, including every princess openly indulging in her fantasies of marrying a prince.

              --ED

            • Steve Corsini
              If you put three humans in a room they will form a hierarchy. If your put 300 people in a retail supermarket or 30,000 in a government organisation they will
              Message 6 of 15 , May 2 5:20 PM
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                If you put three humans in a room they will form a hierarchy. If your put 300 people in a retail supermarket or 30,000 in a government organisation they will form a hierarchy, if you put 6,000,000 in a country they will form a hierarchy.
                 
                In a non-political meritocracy, who decides who has merit?
                 
                Although you may think a non-political meritocracy may be the most desirable system (and to a degree I agree it is attractive), in any examination of any organisation will find some people who want to be one of the bosses, others who want to do good work and others who want to do nothing but hitch a free ride on the backs of those who feel motivated to work hard through a sense of duty, honour, guilt or for money or for whatever else motivates people to work.
                 
                SJC 

                From: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com [mailto:evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Edgar Owen
                Sent: Monday, 2 May 2011 8:02 PM
                To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

                 

                This is an atavistic notion. The ideal government is a completely non political meritocracy where government employees rise to the top based on competence and the government is almost totally a civil service devoted to providing essential services to the populace. In such a system a strong leader is unnecessary.


                Edgar



                On May 2, 2011, at 1:02 AM, Steve Corsini wrote:

                 

                When it comes down to it SOMEBODY has to be at the top of the hierarchy - and act as a symbolic figurehead for the "Sovereignty of the people"  
                 
                Although I'm not that keen on the idea of hereditary kings and Queens, they are at least constrained by Parliament
                I'd rather have QE2 at the top of the tree than say Donald Trump, Robert Mugabe, Colonel Gadaffi or Pol Pot
                 
                SJC


                From: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com [mailto:evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ED
                Sent: Monday, 2 May 2011 12:40 AM
                To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

                 


                The moral of the story is: Refrain from spoiling the fun and games that the powerful, rich and famous are having, and especially when the vast majority of commoners also relish the pageant with its joyful vibrations, including every princess openly indulging in her fantasies of marrying a prince.


                 

                --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Corsini" <sjcarc@...> wrote:

                They should consider themselves lucky they were actually charged -
                They could have been held as terrorists and been kept incommunicado for weeks or months ...
                SJC


                Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

                by Michael Balter on 29 April 2011, 2:08 PM

                Yesterday evening, while Prince William and Kate Middleton (now the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge) were making last minute preparations for their royal wedding, two well-known anthropologists were arrested for helping to plan a "Zombie Wedding" in downtown London. Although the anti-monarchist protest was advertised as street theater, police were apparently not amused by the promised appearance of a working guillotine, and the benediction "May Royal Heads Roll!" They hauled the couple off to jail.

                Anthropologists Chris Knight and Camilla Power, who live together in south London, were arrested at their home along with a third activist for conspiracy to cause a public nuisance and breach of the peace. The arrest was filmed by a film crew and later posted on YouTube. Scotland Yard confirmed that they were still in custody as of 1 p.m. E.D.T. today.

                To go with the wedding, the pair had planned street theater that they called a "Right Royal Orgy," to begin in London's Soho Square, proceed to Piccadilly Circus, and end at Westminster Abbey just when William and Kate were to be married.

                Power teaches anthropology at the University of East London, where Knight also worked until 2009, when he was fired by the university in connection with organizing a previous political protest. The pair are celebrated for their contributions to the study of the evolution of human culture and symbolism, and are a regular fixture at evolution of language meetings. They are also founders and leaders in the London-based Radical Anthropology Group, and are known for their sometimes provocative political actions.

                As Knight's Web page, which has not been updated since the arrest, puts it: "I do science; I also do political street theatre. I hope you'll respect the science, but please don't take my theatrical pronouncements too seriously or literally. A sense of humor is presupposed!"

                Source: Science
                http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2011/04/anti-royal-anthropologists-arrested.html?etoc

                Posted by
                Robert Karl Stonjek




              • Steve Corsini
                You think murder would be NICE what sort of sicko are you? I know you have a huge chip on your shoulder about everybody not being mathematicians, but it
                Message 7 of 15 , May 2 5:23 PM
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                  You think murder would be "NICE" what sort of sicko are you?
                   
                  I know you have a huge chip on your shoulder about everybody not being mathematicians, but it would be a pretty dull  non-functional and short lived world if its was.
                   
                  SJC


                  From: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com [mailto:evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mark hubey
                  Sent: Monday, 2 May 2011 9:20 PM
                  To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

                   


                  Maybe one day they can have "happening" in which anthropologists

                  are cooked in great pots like in cartoons. It would be nice also to have people play the roles of cannibals and roast some anthropologists.

                  Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

                  by Michael Balter on 29 April 2011, 2:08 PM

                  Yesterday evening, while Prince William and Kate Middleton (now the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge) were making last minute preparations for their royal wedding, two well-known anthropologists were arrested for helping to plan a "Zombie Wedding" in downtown London. Although the anti-monarchist protest was advertised as street theater, police were apparently not amused by the promised appearance of a working guillotine, and the benediction "May Royal Heads Roll!" They hauled the couple off to jail.



                  --
                  Regards,
                  Mark Hubey

                  "If it can't be expressed in figures, it is not science; it is opinion." — Robert Heinlein--Spoken by character Lazarus Long in Time Enough for Love (1973). In Leon E. Stover, Heinlein (1987)


                • hibbsa
                  Humans do naturally form hierarchies...often multiple hierarchies. Sometimes a particular hierarchy can create negative effects, but in general there is no
                  Message 8 of 15 , May 2 9:52 PM
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                    Humans do naturally form hierarchies...often multiple hierarchies.
                    Sometimes a particular hierarchy can create negative effects, but in
                    general there is no other way to manage the world and this is why
                    evolution has moved it so far into our instinctual behavour we cannot
                    but form hierarchies.

                    Lists like this are an experiment in removing hiearchies, but how well
                    has it worked? On the one side you have ignorant sprogs like me talking
                    to ace boffins like whoever else, but over the longer term do the
                    boffins decide there's nothing in it for them at their natural level?
                    Probably the answer is yes, regretfully. So then the boffins need to
                    form another list and make it more exclusive, and who can argue that
                    isn't a perfectly reasonable thing to do, and something in other
                    contexts almost all of us opt to do as well? As a slight divergence of
                    how it could be...I see a useful list model being that of maybe 3
                    related lists where all and every frequent one, fewer the next, and
                    fewer the next. But at least some people in all three. That would be a
                    great model that would allow sprogs like me to get some benefit from the
                    boffins while not forcing the boffins to exist in some sort of
                    sacrificial state of intellectual starvation.

                    Maybe you don't like the idea of it, or it sticks in the throat. Maybe
                    you worry the people who only get to be in bottom list will feel
                    belittled. But if what those people in bottom list originally hoped to
                    get was lots of rich interaction with all sorts of people they'd never
                    get the chance to be with in their real lives, then the real equation
                    for them would be whether bottom list delivered it. The question for us
                    is whether this list delivers that and to what extent?

                    OK this isn't about lists. My wider point, for society at large, is that
                    the best solutions that address the natural needs that cause hierarchies
                    to form in the first place, while also alleviating the negative impacts
                    associated with some of those hierarchies, are likely to be more smartly
                    designed hierarchies, than attempts to tear it all down. The reason is
                    that better designs are probably very available, such as that very
                    obvious example involving lists. The other reason is that it isn't even
                    possible to get rid of something that so naturally takes form as a
                    hierarchy. All you can do is replace it with some other hierarchy.
                    Worse...if that happens within an ideological framework that denies
                    hierarchies even exist, what you end up with are hiearchies that exist
                    but don't have to admit they exist so have absolutely no constraint on
                    their power. If power doesn't exist, then nor does the implicit
                    responsibility that comes with power.

                    Rgds,

                    Al


                    --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Corsini"
                    <sjcarc@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > If you put three humans in a room they will form a hierarchy. If your
                    put
                    > 300 people in a retail supermarket or 30,000 in a government
                    organisation
                    > they will form a hierarchy, if you put 6,000,000 in a country they
                    will form
                    > a hierarchy.
                    >
                    > In a non-political meritocracy, who decides who has merit?
                    >
                    > Although you may think a non-political meritocracy may be the most
                    desirable
                    > system (and to a degree I agree it is attractive), in any examination
                    of any
                    > organisation will find some people who want to be one of the bosses,
                    others
                    > who want to do good work and others who want to do nothing but hitch a
                    free
                    > ride on the backs of those who feel motivated to work hard through a
                    sense
                    > of duty, honour, guilt or for money or for whatever else motivates
                    people to
                    > work.
                    >
                    > SJC
                    >
                    > _____
                    >
                    > From: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
                    > [mailto:evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Edgar
                    Owen
                    > Sent: Monday, 2 May 2011 8:02 PM
                    > To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested
                    for
                    > Planned Protest
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > This is an atavistic notion. The ideal government is a completely non
                    > political meritocracy where government employees rise to the top based
                    on
                    > competence and the government is almost totally a civil service
                    devoted to
                    > providing essential services to the populace. In such a system a
                    strong
                    > leader is unnecessary.
                    >
                    >
                    > Edgar
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > On May 2, 2011, at 1:02 AM, Steve Corsini wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > When it comes down to it SOMEBODY has to be at the top of the
                    hierarchy -
                    > and act as a symbolic figurehead for the "Sovereignty of the people"
                    >
                    > Although I'm not that keen on the idea of hereditary kings and Queens,
                    they
                    > are at least constrained by Parliament
                    > I'd rather have QE2 at the top of the tree than say Donald Trump,
                    Robert
                    > Mugabe, Colonel Gadaffi or Pol Pot
                    >
                    > SJC
                    >
                    > _____
                    >
                    > From: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
                    > [mailto:evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ED
                    > Sent: Monday, 2 May 2011 12:40 AM
                    > To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested
                    for
                    > Planned Protest
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > The moral of the story is: Refrain from spoiling the fun and games
                    that the
                    > powerful, rich and famous are having, and especially when the vast
                    majority
                    > of commoners also relish the pageant with its joyful vibrations,
                    including
                    > every princess openly indulging in her fantasies of marrying a prince.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Corsini"
                    sjcarc@
                    > wrote:
                    > >
                    >
                    > They should consider themselves lucky they were actually charged -
                    > They could have been held as terrorists and been kept incommunicado
                    for
                    > weeks or months ...
                    >
                    > SJC
                    >
                    >
                    > --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, RKS wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest
                    >
                    > by Michael Balter on 29 April 2011, 2:08 PM
                    >
                    > Yesterday evening, while Prince William and Kate Middleton (now the
                    Duke and
                    > Duchess of Cambridge) were making last minute preparations for their
                    royal
                    > wedding, two well-known anthropologists were arrested for helping to
                    plan a
                    > " <http://meltdown.uk.net/election/Royal_Wedding.html> Zombie Wedding"
                    in
                    > downtown London. Although the anti-monarchist protest was advertised
                    as
                    > street theater, police were apparently not amused by the promised
                    appearance
                    > of a working guillotine, and the benediction "May Royal Heads Roll!"
                    They
                    > hauled the couple off to jail.
                    >
                    > Anthropologists Chris Knight and Camilla Power, who live together in
                    south
                    > London, were arrested at their home along with a third activist for
                    > conspiracy to cause a public nuisance and breach of the peace. The
                    arrest
                    > was filmed by a film crew and later
                    > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOli98fgBP0&feature=player_embedded>
                    posted
                    > on YouTube. Scotland Yard confirmed that they were still in custody as
                    of 1
                    > p.m. E.D.T. today.
                    >
                    > To go with the wedding, the pair had planned street theater that they
                    called
                    > a "Right Royal Orgy," to begin in London's Soho Square, proceed to
                    > Piccadilly Circus, and end at Westminster Abbey just when William and
                    Kate
                    > were to be married.
                    >
                    > Power teaches anthropology at the University of East London, where
                    > <http://www.chrisknight.co.uk/2009/06/03/my-suspension> Knight also
                    worked
                    > until 2009, when he was fired by the university in connection with
                    > organizing a previous political protest. The pair are celebrated for
                    their
                    > contributions to the study of the evolution of human culture and
                    symbolism,
                    > and are a regular fixture at evolution of language meetings. They are
                    also
                    > founders and leaders in the London-based
                    > <http://www.radicalanthropologygroup.org/new/RAG.html> Radical
                    Anthropology
                    > Group, and are known for their sometimes provocative political
                    actions.
                    >
                    > As Knight's Web page, which has not been updated since the arrest,
                    puts it:
                    > "I do science; I also do
                    >
                    <http://current.com/items/89920520_government-of-the-dead-hang-a-banker.\
                    htm>
                    > political street theatre. I hope you'll respect the science, but
                    please
                    > don't take my theatrical pronouncements too seriously or literally. A
                    >
                    <http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2009/mar/31/g20-protests-chris-kn\
                    ight
                    > > sense of humor is presupposed!"
                    >
                    > Source: Science
                    >
                    >
                    <http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2011/04/anti-royal-anthropolo\
                    gist
                    > s-arrested.html?etoc>
                    >
                    http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2011/04/anti-royal-anthropolog\
                    ists
                    > -arrested.html?etoc
                    >
                    > Posted by
                    > Robert Karl Stonjek
                    >
                  • Edgar Owen
                    Steve, In the ideal meritocracy merit is decided by the educational system which is designed specifically to produce the best and most objective and fair
                    Message 9 of 15 , May 3 3:55 AM
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Steve,

                      In the ideal meritocracy merit is decided by the educational system which is designed specifically to produce the best and most objective and fair problem solvers to fill government positions at all levels.

                      Edgar



                      On May 2, 2011, at 8:20 PM, Steve Corsini wrote:

                       

                      If you put three humans in a room they will form a hierarchy. If your put 300 people in a retail supermarket or 30,000 in a government organisation they will form a hierarchy, if you put 6,000,000 in a country they will form a hierarchy.
                       
                      In a non-political meritocracy, who decides who has merit?
                       
                      Although you may think a non-political meritocracy may be the most desirable system (and to a degree I agree it is attractive), in any examination of any organisation will find some people who want to be one of the bosses, others who want to do good work and others who want to do nothing but hitch a free ride on the backs of those who feel motivated to work hard through a sense of duty, honour, guilt or for money or for whatever else motivates people to work.
                       
                      SJC 

                      From: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com [mailto:evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Edgar Owen
                      Sent: Monday, 2 May 2011 8:02 PM
                      To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

                       

                      This is an atavistic notion. The ideal government is a completely non political meritocracy where government employees rise to the top based on competence and the government is almost totally a civil service devoted to providing essential services to the populace. In such a system a strong leader is unnecessary.


                      Edgar



                      On May 2, 2011, at 1:02 AM, Steve Corsini wrote:

                       

                      When it comes down to it SOMEBODY has to be at the top of the hierarchy - and act as a symbolic figurehead for the "Sovereignty of the people"  
                       
                      Although I'm not that keen on the idea of hereditary kings and Queens, they are at least constrained by Parliament
                      I'd rather have QE2 at the top of the tree than say Donald Trump, Robert Mugabe, Colonel Gadaffi or Pol Pot
                       
                      SJC


                      From: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com [mailto:evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ED
                      Sent: Monday, 2 May 2011 12:40 AM
                      To: evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [evol-psych] News: Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

                       


                      The moral of the story is: Refrain from spoiling the fun and games that the powerful, rich and famous are having, and especially when the vast majority of commoners also relish the pageant with its joyful vibrations, including every princess openly indulging in her fantasies of marrying a prince.


                       

                      --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Corsini" <sjcarc@...> wrote:

                      They should consider themselves lucky they were actually charged -
                      They could have been held as terrorists and been kept incommunicado for weeks or months ...
                      SJC


                      Anti-Royal Anthropologists Arrested for Planned Protest

                      by Michael Balter on 29 April 2011, 2:08 PM

                      Yesterday evening, while Prince William and Kate Middleton (now the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge) were making last minute preparations for their royal wedding, two well-known anthropologists were arrested for helping to plan a "Zombie Wedding" in downtown London. Although the anti-monarchist protest was advertised as street theater, police were apparently not amused by the promised appearance of a working guillotine, and the benediction "May Royal Heads Roll!" They hauled the couple off to jail.

                      Anthropologists Chris Knight and Camilla Power, who live together in south London, were arrested at their home along with a third activist for conspiracy to cause a public nuisance and breach of the peace. The arrest was filmed by a film crew and later posted on YouTube. Scotland Yard confirmed that they were still in custody as of 1 p.m. E.D.T. today.

                      To go with the wedding, the pair had planned street theater that they called a "Right Royal Orgy," to begin in London's Soho Square, proceed to Piccadilly Circus, and end at Westminster Abbey just when William and Kate were to be married.

                      Power teaches anthropology at the University of East London, where Knight also worked until 2009, when he was fired by the university in connection with organizing a previous political protest. The pair are celebrated for their contributions to the study of the evolution of human culture and symbolism, and are a regular fixture at evolution of language meetings. They are also founders and leaders in the London-based Radical Anthropology Group, and are known for their sometimes provocative political actions.

                      As Knight's Web page, which has not been updated since the arrest, puts it: "I do science; I also do political street theatre. I hope you'll respect the science, but please don't take my theatrical pronouncements too seriously or literally. A sense of humor is presupposed!"

                      Source: Science
                      http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2011/04/anti-royal-anthropologists-arrested.html?etoc

                      Posted by
                      Robert Karl Stonjek







                    • R A Fonda
                      ... Don t worry about them having to actually hear what ordinary people are thinking: it might do them good, in the unlikely event they actually pay any
                      Message 10 of 15 , May 3 7:46 AM
                      • 0 Attachment
                        On 5/3/2011 12:52 AM, hibbsa wrote:
                        ace boffins

                        Don't worry about them having to actually hear what ordinary people are thinking: it might do them good, in the unlikely event they actually pay any attention and allow original ideas to penetrate the PC fog of academia.

                        Remember the old adage I posted recently?

                        "The toad under the harrow knows where every sharp tine goes"

                        Many of us being 'harrowed' by the power elite know a lot more about what is going on than the privileged academics. And even in the case of their supposed expertise, they are often unable to accept the implications of data that conflict with the doctrines and dogmas which permeate academia and with which they feel impelled to maintain cognitive assonance.


                        Actually, I think THEY are the ones who COULD benefit by exposure to the realities which are not permitted expression in academia.

                        RAF
                      • hibbsa
                        yeah....I think the mental picture of social hierarchies flipped me into role playing mode, a pinch of dickens maybe. Our place, our pride [:D] ... are ...
                        Message 11 of 15 , May 3 4:05 PM
                        • 0 Attachment

                          yeah....I think the mental picture of social hierarchies flipped me into  role playing mode, a pinch of dickens maybe. Our place, our pride :D


                          --- In evolutionary-psychology@yahoogroups.com, R A Fonda <rafonda@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > On 5/3/2011 12:52 AM, hibbsa wrote:
                          > > ace boffins
                          >
                          > Don't worry about them having to actually hear what ordinary people are
                          > thinking: it might do them good, in the unlikely event they actually pay
                          > any attention and allow original ideas to penetrate the PC fog of academia.
                          >
                          > Remember the old adage I posted recently?
                          >
                          > "The toad under the harrow knows where every sharp tine goes"
                          >
                          > Many of us being 'harrowed' by the power elite know a lot more about
                          > what is going on than the privileged academics. And even in the case of
                          > their supposed expertise, they are often unable to accept the
                          > implications of data that conflict with the doctrines and dogmas which
                          > permeate academia and with which they feel impelled to maintain
                          > cognitive assonance.
                          >
                          > Actually, I think THEY are the ones who COULD benefit by exposure to the
                          > realities which are not permitted expression in academia.
                          >
                          > RAF
                          >

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