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EV Digest, Vol 28, Issue 1

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      Today's Topics:

      1. Re: Mythbusters: Golf Ball Effect improves aerodynamics
      (nicklogan)
      2. Re: Distance per single charge records (Willie McKemie)
      3. Vacuum pump continously running (hazemsedra)
      4. Re: Vacuum pump continously running (Douglas A. Stansfield)
      5. Re: Vacuum pump continously running (Douglas A. Stansfield)
      6. Re: Vacuum pump continously running (James Massey)
      7. Re: Distance per single charge records (Rodney Cook)
      8. EV's at SEMA (Ryan Stotts)
      9. Re: Vacuum pump continously running (Hazem Sedra)
      10. Re: Racing Disc (Buddy Mills)
      11. Re: Vacuum pump continously running (Bob Rice)
      12. Re: Distance per single charge records (Bob Rice)
      13. Re: Vacuum pump continously running (Bob Rice)
      14. Re: LiFePO4 discharge characteristics (Bill Dube)
      15. Re: Distance per single charge records (David Sharpe)
      16. Re: Distance per single charge records (Roger Heuckeroth)
      17. MY EV experience so far (hazemsedra)
      18. Re: MY EV experience so far (Steven Ciciora)
      19. Re: MY EV experience so far (gottdi@...)
      20. Re: MY EV experience so far (Bob Rice)
      21. Re: MY EV experience so far (Dave Davidson)
      22. Re: Distance per single charge records (Bob Rice)
      23. Great Story on Jerry (Steven Lough)
      24. Re: Distance per single charge records (Lee Hart)
      25. Re: Distance per single charge records (Lee Hart)


      ----------------------------------------------------------------------

      Message: 1
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 14:21:02 -0700 (PDT)
      From: nicklogan <jnicholson@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Mythbusters: Golf Ball Effect improves
      aerodynamics
      To: ev@...
      Message-ID: <26145997.post@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii


      I got flat stainless steel ones for my EV (mainly because I liked the looks -
      they aren't going to improve the aerodynamics of a pick-up truck much!) :

      http://www.jcwhitney.com/WHEEL_COVERS_RACING_DISC?ID=12;0;0;0;100001;ProductName;0;0;0;N;2003995;0;0




      Moon disks! Back to the 50s.

      --
      View this message in context: http://old.nabble.com/Mythbusters%3A-Golf-Ball-Effect-improves-aerodynamics-tp26020851p26145997.html
      Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.



      ------------------------------

      Message: 2
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 17:36:17 -0500
      From: Willie McKemie <mckemie@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records
      To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <20091031223617.GH24144@c25>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

      On Sat, Oct 31, 2009 at 12:33:30PM -0400, Roger Heuckeroth wrote:
      >
      > On Oct 30, 2009, at 9:23 PM, Lee Hart wrote:
      > >
      > > - That said... who *needs* a car that goes 600+ miles without
      > > stopping?
      > > Who would even want to *pay* for it?
      >
      > Well my Jetta TDI goes over 600 miles driving at 70-75 MPH on a tank
      > of diesel. I drive from NY to SC 4-6 times a year on business.
      > That's 850 miles each way and I normally do it in one long trip. Only
      > have to stop once on the way down and once on the way back for fuel.
      > However when I take my truck I typically consume about 100 gallons of
      > gas for the trip. Its not uncommon for me to travel 200-300 miles in
      > one day

      Same here. For highway driving we use a TDI Golf. San Antonio is
      about 160 miles round trip. Dallas Ft Worth is over 200 miles one way.
      Houston is about 160 miles. Texarkana is about 350 miles. Those are
      all places we go once or twice a year. The point is, with our ~ 120
      mile LFP conversion, we can only do Austin (60-80 miles round trip).
      We can do San Antonio one way, but then we need several hours of
      charging before we can come home. Texarkana, Houston, and Dallas are
      usually trips of two or more days, so a range that will reach those
      places one way can be useful.

      Bottom line from my perspective: A 200-400 mile range IS desirable and
      would be used.

      --
      Willie, ONWARD! Through the fog!
      http://counter.li.org Linux registered user #228836 since 1995
      Debian3.1/GNU/Linux system uptime 686 days 11 hours 16 minutes



      ------------------------------

      Message: 3
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 15:54:02 -0700 (PDT)
      From: hazemsedra <hazemsedra@...>
      Subject: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running
      To: ev@...
      Message-ID: <26146716.post@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii


      I am a new to this group and just starting out with my first EV.
      108v converted ford escort that I purchased from portland 1 month ago.
      Today while driving I noticed that my vacuum pump was continously running
      when
      the car was on. The brakes work well and are firm when the the brake pedal
      is applied, and
      there is enough brake fluid oil.

      I am taking it to my local mechanic who probably has not seen an EV before,
      any suggestions
      as to why the vaccum won't stop? A leak somewhere, the master cylinder, or
      just the vacuum pump
      needs to be replaced? Thanks for your help as I am just starting out with
      ev's, however I know it's
      the right thing to do.
      Thanks
      Hazem
      --
      View this message in context: http://old.nabble.com/Vacuum-pump-continously-running-tp26146716p26146716.html
      Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.



      ------------------------------

      Message: 4
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 19:03:46 -0400
      From: "Douglas A. Stansfield" <Doug@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running
      To: "'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'" <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <008701ca5a7e$66be09f0$343a1dd0$@com>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

      Probably a leak or no vacuum tank. Might want to check before you bring to
      a local mechanic. I have seen people that build EVs forget to include a
      vacuum holding tank and thus the vacuum pump continues to run.

      Just a thought....


      Sincerely;

      Douglas A. Stansfield
      President
      www.TransAtlanticElectricConversions.com
      973-875-6276 (office)
      973-670-9208 (cell)
      973-440-1619 (fax)

      WHOLESALE ELECTRICITY PROVIDERS
      And ELECTRIC CAR PRODUCERS




      -----Original Message-----
      From: ev-bounces@... [mailto:ev-bounces@...] On Behalf
      Of hazemsedra
      Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 6:54 PM
      To: ev@...
      Subject: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running


      I am a new to this group and just starting out with my first EV.
      108v converted ford escort that I purchased from portland 1 month ago.
      Today while driving I noticed that my vacuum pump was continously running
      when
      the car was on. The brakes work well and are firm when the the brake pedal
      is applied, and
      there is enough brake fluid oil.

      I am taking it to my local mechanic who probably has not seen an EV before,
      any suggestions
      as to why the vaccum won't stop? A leak somewhere, the master cylinder, or
      just the vacuum pump
      needs to be replaced? Thanks for your help as I am just starting out with
      ev's, however I know it's
      the right thing to do.
      Thanks
      Hazem
      --
      View this message in context:
      http://old.nabble.com/Vacuum-pump-continously-running-tp26146716p26146716.ht
      ml
      Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
      Nabble.com.

      _______________________________________________
      General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev



      ------------------------------

      Message: 5
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 19:21:02 -0400
      From: "Douglas A. Stansfield" <Doug@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running
      To: "'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'" <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <008801ca5a80$d03999b0$70accd10$@com>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

      Also, check to make sure it has a vacuum switch and if it is working
      properly.

      -----Original Message-----
      From: ev-bounces@... [mailto:ev-bounces@...] On Behalf
      Of Douglas A. Stansfield
      Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 7:04 PM
      To: 'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running

      Probably a leak or no vacuum tank. Might want to check before you bring to
      a local mechanic. I have seen people that build EVs forget to include a
      vacuum holding tank and thus the vacuum pump continues to run.

      Just a thought....


      Sincerely;

      Douglas A. Stansfield
      President
      www.TransAtlanticElectricConversions.com
      973-875-6276 (office)
      973-670-9208 (cell)
      973-440-1619 (fax)

      WHOLESALE ELECTRICITY PROVIDERS
      And ELECTRIC CAR PRODUCERS




      -----Original Message-----
      From: ev-bounces@... [mailto:ev-bounces@...] On Behalf
      Of hazemsedra
      Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 6:54 PM
      To: ev@...
      Subject: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running


      I am a new to this group and just starting out with my first EV.
      108v converted ford escort that I purchased from portland 1 month ago.
      Today while driving I noticed that my vacuum pump was continously running
      when
      the car was on. The brakes work well and are firm when the the brake pedal
      is applied, and
      there is enough brake fluid oil.

      I am taking it to my local mechanic who probably has not seen an EV before,
      any suggestions
      as to why the vaccum won't stop? A leak somewhere, the master cylinder, or
      just the vacuum pump
      needs to be replaced? Thanks for your help as I am just starting out with
      ev's, however I know it's
      the right thing to do.
      Thanks
      Hazem
      --
      View this message in context:
      http://old.nabble.com/Vacuum-pump-continously-running-tp26146716p26146716.ht
      ml
      Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
      Nabble.com.

      _______________________________________________
      General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

      _______________________________________________
      General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev



      ------------------------------

      Message: 6
      Date: Sun, 01 Nov 2009 10:32:31 +1100
      From: James Massey <jcmassey@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running
      To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.1.20091101100805.00a76050@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

      At 09:54 AM 1/11/09, Hazem wrote:

      >I am a new to this group

      Welcome, you're in the right place for EV advice. Not the only place, but
      one of the best, and if you like the 'list' format over a 'forum' format
      then probably the best.

      ><snip> Today while driving I noticed that my vacuum pump was continously
      >running
      >when the car was on.

      This should be a simple fix, as it has to be one of the following things:

      1) pump pressure switch failure (vacuum is high enough but the switch won't
      turn off) or

      2) vacuum leak (vacuum can't get high enough). or

      3) pump is dying so can't get the vacuum high enough to turn the switch off.

      If you have a vacuum gauge as part of your system then have a look - brake
      vacuum in the range of -80 to -95kPa, (approx = -600 to -710mm mercury,
      approx = -23 to -27.5 inches mercury, should be adequate to turn the switch
      off. If you don't have a vacuum gauge it gets a lot harder to tell what is
      going on, as your vacuum can be down by half before you notice the added
      braking pedal effort needed.

      Find your vacuum pump (simple, since it is running) and follow its' supply
      wiring until you find a 'gadget' that has a tube/pipe/hose attached as well
      as the wiring. Follow the vacuum tube/pipe/hose to the vaccum system (you
      should have some kind of vacuum tank, but maybe not) looking for kinks,
      loose connections etc. If all looks well, I suggest getting a small mallet
      (large screwdriver handle will substitute) and give the vacuum switch a
      sharp tap (or two in different directions), and see if it turns off, if it
      does then it was welded shut.

      Whatever happens, please post a description of pump and switch (posting
      photos somewhere on-line and providing a link is an excelent way to help)
      and we will see what we can do to point you or your mechanic in the right
      direction to both fix the problem and make sure it is unlikely to come
      back. Brakes are too important to not have working right.

      Regards

      [Technik] James



      ------------------------------

      Message: 7
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 16:38:16 -0700
      From: "Rodney Cook" <r.cook@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records
      To: "'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'" <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP718C21197D31DBED9DFA0490B50@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

      Why not drive your Golf when you want to drive more than 120 miles and drive
      your EV the rest of the time?

      -----Original Message-----
      From: ev-bounces@... [mailto:ev-bounces@...] On Behalf
      Of Willie McKemie
      Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 3:36 PM
      To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records

      On Sat, Oct 31, 2009 at 12:33:30PM -0400, Roger Heuckeroth wrote:
      >
      > On Oct 30, 2009, at 9:23 PM, Lee Hart wrote:
      > >
      > > - That said... who *needs* a car that goes 600+ miles without
      > > stopping?
      > > Who would even want to *pay* for it?
      >
      > Well my Jetta TDI goes over 600 miles driving at 70-75 MPH on a tank
      > of diesel. I drive from NY to SC 4-6 times a year on business.
      > That's 850 miles each way and I normally do it in one long trip. Only
      > have to stop once on the way down and once on the way back for fuel.
      > However when I take my truck I typically consume about 100 gallons of
      > gas for the trip. Its not uncommon for me to travel 200-300 miles in
      > one day

      Same here. For highway driving we use a TDI Golf. San Antonio is
      about 160 miles round trip. Dallas Ft Worth is over 200 miles one way.
      Houston is about 160 miles. Texarkana is about 350 miles. Those are
      all places we go once or twice a year. The point is, with our ~ 120
      mile LFP conversion, we can only do Austin (60-80 miles round trip).
      We can do San Antonio one way, but then we need several hours of
      charging before we can come home. Texarkana, Houston, and Dallas are
      usually trips of two or more days, so a range that will reach those
      places one way can be useful.

      Bottom line from my perspective: A 200-400 mile range IS desirable and
      would be used.

      --
      Willie, ONWARD! Through the fog!
      http://counter.li.org Linux registered user #228836 since 1995
      Debian3.1/GNU/Linux system uptime 686 days 11 hours 16 minutes

      _______________________________________________
      General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev




      ------------------------------

      Message: 8
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 18:45:41 -0500
      From: Ryan Stotts <stotts.ryan@...>
      Subject: [EVDL] EV's at SEMA
      To: EVDL <ev@...>
      Message-ID:
      <d26fa1ae0910311645w1536a77fgeacbb281fae39b1c@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

      Decent power?

      http://www.factoryfive.com/whatsnew/update/altenergy/news.html
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      ------------------------------

      Message: 9
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 20:43:01 -0400
      From: Hazem Sedra <hazemsedra@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running
      To: <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <BLU127-W9E36F5E16DF1F72B961F1D5B40@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"


      Thanks so much James for taking the time to help me out
      and write your datailed note to guide me.

      After reading your note, I looked for the valve switch on the vacuum pump and
      found it. I noticed the neck of the switch was broken off the valve assembly and is made
      of plastic. I will simply buy a new one and connect it to the valve assembly.



      I appreciate your help and this forum.

      Hazem

      > Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 10:32:31 +1100
      > To: ev@...
      > From: jcmassey@...
      > Subject: Re: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running
      >
      > At 09:54 AM 1/11/09, Hazem wrote:
      >
      > >I am a new to this group
      >
      > Welcome, you're in the right place for EV advice. Not the only place, but
      > one of the best, and if you like the 'list' format over a 'forum' format
      > then probably the best.
      >
      > ><snip> Today while driving I noticed that my vacuum pump was continously
      > >running
      > >when the car was on.
      >
      > This should be a simple fix, as it has to be one of the following things:
      >
      > 1) pump pressure switch failure (vacuum is high enough but the switch won't
      > turn off) or
      >
      > 2) vacuum leak (vacuum can't get high enough). or
      >
      > 3) pump is dying so can't get the vacuum high enough to turn the switch off.
      >
      > If you have a vacuum gauge as part of your system then have a look - brake
      > vacuum in the range of -80 to -95kPa, (approx = -600 to -710mm mercury,
      > approx = -23 to -27.5 inches mercury, should be adequate to turn the switch
      > off. If you don't have a vacuum gauge it gets a lot harder to tell what is
      > going on, as your vacuum can be down by half before you notice the added
      > braking pedal effort needed.
      >
      > Find your vacuum pump (simple, since it is running) and follow its' supply
      > wiring until you find a 'gadget' that has a tube/pipe/hose attached as well
      > as the wiring. Follow the vacuum tube/pipe/hose to the vaccum system (you
      > should have some kind of vacuum tank, but maybe not) looking for kinks,
      > loose connections etc. If all looks well, I suggest getting a small mallet
      > (large screwdriver handle will substitute) and give the vacuum switch a
      > sharp tap (or two in different directions), and see if it turns off, if it
      > does then it was welded shut.
      >
      > Whatever happens, please post a description of pump and switch (posting
      > photos somewhere on-line and providing a link is an excelent way to help)
      > and we will see what we can do to point you or your mechanic in the right
      > direction to both fix the problem and make sure it is unlikely to come
      > back. Brakes are too important to not have working right.
      >
      > Regards
      >
      > [Technik] James
      >
      > _______________________________________________
      > General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      > Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      > Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
      >


      _________________________________________________________________
      Windows 7: It works the way you want. Learn more.
      http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/windows-7/default.aspx?ocid=PID24727::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WWL_WIN_evergreen2:102009
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      ------------------------------

      Message: 10
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 22:03:31 -0400
      From: "Buddy Mills" <buddymills@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Racing Disc
      To: "'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'" <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <002101ca5a97$831d56a0$895803e0$@net>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

      Just ordered these and should be here on Tuesday

      http://hubcapmike.com/rdc01-13.html


      -----Original Message-----
      From: ev-bounces@... [mailto:ev-bounces@...] On Behalf
      Of nicklogan
      Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 5:21 PM
      To: ev@...
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Mythbusters: Golf Ball Effect improves aerodynamics


      I got flat stainless steel ones for my EV (mainly because I liked the looks
      -
      they aren't going to improve the aerodynamics of a pick-up truck much!) :

      http://www.jcwhitney.com/WHEEL_COVERS_RACING_DISC?ID=12;0;0;0;100001;Product
      Name;0;0;0;N;2003995;0;0




      Moon disks! Back to the 50s.

      --
      View this message in context:
      http://old.nabble.com/Mythbusters%3A-Golf-Ball-Effect-improves-aerodynamics-
      tp26020851p26145997.html
      Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
      Nabble.com.

      _______________________________________________
      General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev



      ------------------------------

      Message: 11
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 23:40:08 -0400
      From: "Bob Rice" <bobrice@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running
      To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <7EFDCED1B62D42A2B0817A78B1C40D8A@adminwlzisp2uc>
      Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
      reply-type=original

      Hi Hazem;

      Just a thought?Can ya pull the hose off the pump, and feel/see IF it has
      any suction? IF not, you might have a blown diaphram? SOME vacuumm pumps,
      not General Murders ones, are replacable.Best acolade for a Vac. Pump is it
      SUCKS, quite well IF, it is healthy.If yur getting good suction, you MIGHT
      have a leaky hose SOMEWHERE in the system?If the suction is weak, you will
      still have brakes, but thre pump hasta work overtime!

      Happy hunting!

      Bob
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "hazemsedra" <hazemsedra@...>
      To: <ev@...>
      Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 6:54 PM
      Subject: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running


      >
      > I am a new to this group and just starting out with my first EV.
      > 108v converted ford escort that I purchased from portland 1 month ago.
      > Today while driving I noticed that my vacuum pump was continously running
      > when
      > the car was on. The brakes work well and are firm when the the brake
      > pedal
      > is applied, and
      > there is enough brake fluid oil.
      >
      > I am taking it to my local mechanic who probably has not seen an EV
      > before,
      > any suggestions
      > as to why the vaccum won't stop? A leak somewhere, the master cylinder, or
      > just the vacuum pump
      > needs to be replaced? Thanks for your help as I am just starting out with
      > ev's, however I know it's
      > the right thing to do.
      > Thanks
      > Hazem
      > --
      > View this message in context:
      > http://old.nabble.com/Vacuum-pump-continously-running-tp26146716p26146716.html
      > Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
      > Nabble.com.
      >
      > _______________________________________________
      > General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      > Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      > Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
      >



      ------------------------------

      Message: 12
      Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 00:45:23 -0400
      From: "Bob Rice" <bobrice@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records
      To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <A7CD5DA169CD419BB7E378A66BDD8241@adminwlzisp2uc>
      Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
      reply-type=original


      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Roger Heuckeroth" <rheuckeroth@...>
      To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@...>
      Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 12:33 PM
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records


      >
      > On Oct 30, 2009, at 9:23 PM, Lee Hart wrote:
      >>
      >> - That said... who *needs* a car that goes 600+ miles without
      >> stopping?
      >> Who would even want to *pay* for it?
      >
      > Well my Jetta TDI goes over 600 miles driving at 70-75 MPH on a tank
      > of diesel. I drive from NY to SC 4-6 times a year on business.
      > That's 850 miles each way and I normally do it in one long trip.

      But I'll bet ya stop for eats, or to Piddle? Oh, I KNOW guyz that do
      600 miles in one sitting but WHY? Ya wanna streatch yur legs, etc?

      Only
      > have to stop once on the way down and once on the way back for fuel.
      > However when I take my truck I typically consume about 100 gallons of
      > gas for the trip. Its not uncommon for me to travel 200-300 miles in
      > one day
      >
      > It would be awesome to make those trips in an EV, but that's not
      > economically feasible at this time.

      Well, not yet? The First steamboats didn't make it ALL the way on
      steam, they cheated ,and sailed under favorable winds, not a bad idea today?
      But the Tesla, I think, was reported in this comical, er, chronocle,of going
      300 miles on a charge? Hell! Wait til Battery research is made priority,
      sorta like the Nuke Bomb, or Jet fighter plane? Sad that these machines of
      destruction were priority, and you can argue that elsewhere? But you can
      book Jet Blue(happy Jetting! they say, and they DO have a cents of humor as
      the damn plane is called an "Air BUS!") and go anywhere ya need to go in a
      few hours? Like to the Races??But Battery Tech WILL improve, IF ya remember
      the first cell fones and that they ran out of juice, pretty quick, not a BAD
      thing as it made yur train/bus ride a lot quieter!IF battery tech goes on
      like this yur have your 600-800 mile EV? Chill out, it's coming? As well as
      NOT having to rebuild yur Suspension and brakes to do a conversion? IF you
      want to, you will be able to just go BUY an EV and drive it home with title
      on the passenger seat., as David Roden sez?Oh folks will STILL do
      conversions for their personal pleasure, like the legions of 34-38 Ford
      "roadsters" with auto trannies, disc brakes and hulking V-8's STUFFED in
      their engine rooms!
      >>
      >> - BAT International packed a golf cart full of *primary* batteries,
      >> and drove it over 1000 miles on a charge (on a closed track at low
      >> speeds). What does that prove?

      Not a hellova lot?! Bob Aronson in his Mars 2 ran rediculous
      range(couple hundered miles) with Led Acids 40YEARS ago, around a trak, at
      20-30 MPH? This must have been as much fun as steering a ship! Helmsman(Ship
      Drivers) MUST be the most BORING job on the planet! You CAN, if ya ask the
      skipper nicely, and he'll let ya try, but in 15 minutes yur ready to move on
      to the engine room. Especially if it's a Triple Expansion STEAM
      engine?!Turbines are a bore, NOTHING going up and down and roundy- round!

      Seeya

      Bob



      ------------------------------

      Message: 13
      Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 00:53:06 -0400
      From: "Bob Rice" <bobrice@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running
      To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <D770A2F2815F469AADBD81F12C2C47D7@adminwlzisp2uc>
      Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
      reply-type=original


      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Hazem Sedra" <hazemsedra@...>
      To: <ev@...>
      Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 8:43 PM
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running


      >
      > Thanks so much James for taking the time to help me out
      > and write your datailed note to guide me.
      >
      > After reading your note, I looked for the valve switch on the vacuum pump
      > and
      > found it. I noticed the neck of the switch was broken off the valve
      > assembly and is made
      > of plastic. I will simply buy a new one and connect it to the valve
      > assembly.
      >
      A Happy ending! Great! Happy motoring Hazem!

      Bob
      >
      > I appreciate your help and this forum.
      >
      > Hazem
      >
      >> Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 10:32:31 +1100
      >> To: ev@...
      >> From: jcmassey@...
      >> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Vacuum pump continously running
      >>
      >> At 09:54 AM 1/11/09, Hazem wrote:
      >>
      >> >I am a new to this group
      >>
      >> Welcome, you're in the right place for EV advice. Not the only place, but
      >> one of the best, and if you like the 'list' format over a 'forum' format
      >> then probably the best.
      >>
      >> ><snip> Today while driving I noticed that my vacuum pump was continously
      >> >running
      >> >when the car was on.
      >>
      >> This should be a simple fix, as it has to be one of the following things:
      >>
      >> 1) pump pressure switch failure (vacuum is high enough but the switch
      >> won't
      >> turn off) or
      >>
      >> 2) vacuum leak (vacuum can't get high enough). or
      >>
      >> 3) pump is dying so can't get the vacuum high enough to turn the switch
      >> off.
      >>
      >> If you have a vacuum gauge as part of your system then have a look -
      >> brake
      >> vacuum in the range of -80 to -95kPa, (approx = -600 to -710mm mercury,
      >> approx = -23 to -27.5 inches mercury, should be adequate to turn the
      >> switch
      >> off. If you don't have a vacuum gauge it gets a lot harder to tell what
      >> is
      >> going on, as your vacuum can be down by half before you notice the added
      >> braking pedal effort needed.
      >>
      >> Find your vacuum pump (simple, since it is running) and follow its'
      >> supply
      >> wiring until you find a 'gadget' that has a tube/pipe/hose attached as
      >> well
      >> as the wiring. Follow the vacuum tube/pipe/hose to the vaccum system (you
      >> should have some kind of vacuum tank, but maybe not) looking for kinks,
      >> loose connections etc. If all looks well, I suggest getting a small
      >> mallet
      >> (large screwdriver handle will substitute) and give the vacuum switch a
      >> sharp tap (or two in different directions), and see if it turns off, if
      >> it
      >> does then it was welded shut.
      >>
      >> Whatever happens, please post a description of pump and switch (posting
      >> photos somewhere on-line and providing a link is an excelent way to help)
      >> and we will see what we can do to point you or your mechanic in the right
      >> direction to both fix the problem and make sure it is unlikely to come
      >> back. Brakes are too important to not have working right.
      >>
      >> Regards
      >>
      >> [Technik] James
      >>
      >> _______________________________________________
      >> General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      >> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      >> Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      >> Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
      >>
      >
      >
      > _________________________________________________________________
      > Windows 7: It works the way you want. Learn more.
      > http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/windows-7/default.aspx?ocid=PID24727::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WWL_WIN_evergreen2:102009
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      > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
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      >



      ------------------------------

      Message: 14
      Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2009 22:53:15 -0600
      From: Bill Dube <billdube@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] LiFePO4 discharge characteristics
      To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <20091101050531.09E68CA7CC@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed

      It is the voltage that causes the damage. The LifePo4 cells are much
      less sensitive to low voltage than the older metal oxide cells,
      however. (The old metal oxide cells would simply not recover from
      being taken below about 2.5 or 2.0 volts.) Reverse voltage is what
      you _really_ want to avoid because it does a lot of damage.

      Once the cell is below 2.5 volts, there is hardly any energy
      left so you might as well stop the discharge there. Electronics
      generally does not want to run below 2 volts, so they sound the alarm
      around 2.5 volts.

      To keep from false triggering, the low voltage sensing for
      LiFePO4 should allow brief excursions below 2.5 volts to perhaps as
      low 1.0 volts, perhaps even a bit lower.

      Bill Dube'

      At 09:28 PM 10/30/2009, you wrote:
      >Hey Lee you out there? Or anyone who can answer this question for me?
      >
      >Since the typical discharge curves for the LiFePO4 batteries is way
      >more flat than for lead acid, there is a very sharp drop once
      >they reach ~95% DOD. So looking across the temperature
      >characteristics the voltage takes a dive or tanks at or below the 80% DOD
      >level for colder temps (-25*C to -40*). The question is, in
      >designing an LVD for these things, if you were operating at -40
      >degrees could you actually let the voltage tank as far down as it
      >can go (meaning never activate the LVD) since the actual capacity
      >in the cell (if it were at room temp) is still more than 80% DOD?
      >
      >Is it the absolute voltage that causes cell damage and subtracts
      >from its useful life, or the depth of discharge?
      >
      >(OK so 2 questions ;-)
      >
      >Mike
      >
      >_______________________________________________
      >General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      >Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      >Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      >Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev



      ------------------------------

      Message: 15
      Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 16:24:09 +1100
      From: "David Sharpe" <dsh63475@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records
      To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <2FBB94A189144F3D92375522E417AFD7@oemuser63906e6>
      Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
      reply-type=original

      http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2009/10/simon-hackett-breaks-ev-world-record-for-distance-on-a-single-charge/

      The above indicates that Simon Hackett did 501 ks on a single charge with
      his non-legal (in Aus) Tesla doing 55kphr average. He had a vehicle with a
      Diesel generating set. As this accompanied him & his supporting team with
      other non EV vehicles should we also look at the total fuel use to achieve
      this result? Readers will have seen my Melbourne to Canberra & return run
      which I did on grid power alone & NO SUPPORT TEAM using a much more humble
      EV in which I could have done 160ks on a charge using 140Ahrs of batteries
      but averaged about 100ks per charge at 75-80 kphr. So the 500ks would have
      needed in XS of 520 Ahrs of batteries with my EV. Charging time would have
      been 3X as long with same on board chargers. You've got to charge EVentually
      regardless of battery capacity on a long trip.


      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Bob Rice" <bobrice@...>
      To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@...>
      Sent: Sunday, November 01, 2009 3:45 PM
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records


      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "Roger Heuckeroth" <rheuckeroth@...>
      > To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@...>
      > Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 12:33 PM
      > Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records
      >
      >
      >>
      >> On Oct 30, 2009, at 9:23 PM, Lee Hart wrote:
      >>>
      >>> - That said... who *needs* a car that goes 600+ miles without
      >>> stopping?
      >>> Who would even want to *pay* for it?
      >>
      >> Well my Jetta TDI goes over 600 miles driving at 70-75 MPH on a tank
      >> of diesel. I drive from NY to SC 4-6 times a year on business.
      >> That's 850 miles each way and I normally do it in one long trip.
      >
      > But I'll bet ya stop for eats, or to Piddle? Oh, I KNOW guyz that do
      > 600 miles in one sitting but WHY? Ya wanna streatch yur legs, etc?
      >
      > Only
      >> have to stop once on the way down and once on the way back for fuel.
      >> However when I take my truck I typically consume about 100 gallons of
      >> gas for the trip. Its not uncommon for me to travel 200-300 miles in
      >> one day
      >>
      >> It would be awesome to make those trips in an EV, but that's not
      >> economically feasible at this time.
      >
      > Well, not yet? The First steamboats didn't make it ALL the way on
      > steam, they cheated ,and sailed under favorable winds, not a bad idea
      > today?
      > But the Tesla, I think, was reported in this comical, er, chronocle,of
      > going
      > 300 miles on a charge? Hell! Wait til Battery research is made priority,
      > sorta like the Nuke Bomb, or Jet fighter plane? Sad that these machines of
      > destruction were priority, and you can argue that elsewhere? But you can
      > book Jet Blue(happy Jetting! they say, and they DO have a cents of humor
      > as
      > the damn plane is called an "Air BUS!") and go anywhere ya need to go in a
      > few hours? Like to the Races??But Battery Tech WILL improve, IF ya
      > remember
      > the first cell fones and that they ran out of juice, pretty quick, not a
      > BAD
      > thing as it made yur train/bus ride a lot quieter!IF battery tech goes on
      > like this yur have your 600-800 mile EV? Chill out, it's coming? As well
      > as
      > NOT having to rebuild yur Suspension and brakes to do a conversion? IF you
      > want to, you will be able to just go BUY an EV and drive it home with
      > title
      > on the passenger seat., as David Roden sez?Oh folks will STILL do
      > conversions for their personal pleasure, like the legions of 34-38 Ford
      > "roadsters" with auto trannies, disc brakes and hulking V-8's STUFFED in
      > their engine rooms!
      >>>
      >>> - BAT International packed a golf cart full of *primary* batteries,
      >>> and drove it over 1000 miles on a charge (on a closed track at low
      >>> speeds). What does that prove?
      >
      > Not a hellova lot?! Bob Aronson in his Mars 2 ran rediculous
      > range(couple hundered miles) with Led Acids 40YEARS ago, around a trak, at
      > 20-30 MPH? This must have been as much fun as steering a ship!
      > Helmsman(Ship
      > Drivers) MUST be the most BORING job on the planet! You CAN, if ya ask the
      > skipper nicely, and he'll let ya try, but in 15 minutes yur ready to move
      > on
      > to the engine room. Especially if it's a Triple Expansion STEAM
      > engine?!Turbines are a bore, NOTHING going up and down and roundy- round!
      >
      > Seeya
      >
      > Bob
      >
      > _______________________________________________
      > General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      > Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      > Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
      >
      >



      ------------------------------

      Message: 16
      Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 09:10:23 -0500
      From: Roger Heuckeroth <rheuckeroth@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records
      To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <6AA61F9F-7958-4645-8A60-26250BC12612@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes


      On Nov 1, 2009, at 12:45 AM, Bob Rice wrote:

      >>> - That said... who *needs* a car that goes 600+ miles without
      >>> stopping?
      >>> Who would even want to *pay* for it?
      >>
      >> Well my Jetta TDI goes over 600 miles driving at 70-75 MPH on a tank
      >> of diesel. I drive from NY to SC 4-6 times a year on business.
      >> That's 850 miles each way and I normally do it in one long trip.
      >
      > But I'll bet ya stop for eats, or to Piddle? Oh, I KNOW guyz
      > that do
      > 600 miles in one sitting but WHY? Ya wanna streatch yur legs, etc?

      Sure. But where do you stop to get a quick half hour charge on the
      way? Nowhere at this point. Plus, my charger would take 4 hours from
      20% to 80%, so not real practical either.

      Maybe someday...



      ------------------------------

      Message: 17
      Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 06:41:05 -0800 (PST)
      From: hazemsedra <hazemsedra@...>
      Subject: [EVDL] MY EV experience so far
      To: ev@...
      Message-ID: <26148899.post@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8


      First of all, thank you guys for taking the time to help me with your
      insightful comments regarding my continously running vacuum pump.
      I couldn't believe all the help I got..it needs a new valve starter switch
      and my beloved EV
      should be back on the road soon.

      I bought my converted 85 Ford escort approximately 1 month ago with a lot of
      trepidation. I am in the middle of northwest minnesota in a small town, I
      don't have a a mechanical or electrical background as I am in the health
      care profession, and the closest EV shop is GEM motors in Fargo, three hours
      from where I live.

      However I just knew there must be an alternative out there to gas engines,
      and there must be something cleaner for our environment...so why havn't we
      got there with all this incredible technology around us? Gas prices
      continued to rise, the recession hit in, GM/Ford execs traveling in planes
      to congress to beg for our money, and Exxon/Mobil making record profits
      while our precious environment continues to deteriorate and is in state of
      unforeseen worrisome changes.

      That's when the electric vehicle made absolute sense to me. However it was
      a difficult choice, because I knew nothing about taking care of a single
      battery, and then I was faced with 18 of them, a controller, a charger and
      now a vacuum pump. Nevertheless after driving it for 500 miles so far, and
      passing by those dirty gas stations, I discovered a new found freedom!

      I think you know what I mean...there is a freedom and an independence that
      comes with an EV which is just so refreshing. There is a pioneering spirit
      that comes with it...that you are doing something completely different and
      unique. It's like the feeling when email and the internet first came on the
      scene in the early 90's. I was blown away by it, and it
      changed how I did things from that moment. Sure I crashed windows 95 several
      times, didn't know the difference between aol and world wide web, but I
      stuck with it because I saw the potential and now I can't function at home
      or at work without the net. Same feelings, reactions, and this excitement
      about my EV and the possibilities later on. Now, I don't think I can ever
      return to a gas clunker again!

      Thank you guys again for your help and this forum. I wish I can be as
      optimistic as Bob Rice regarding new battery technology in the near horizon
      given the corporate greed of the automotive/oil industry?we will see.

      Hazem

      --
      View this message in context: http://old.nabble.com/MY-EV-experience-so-far-tp26148899p26148899.html
      Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.




      ------------------------------

      Message: 18
      Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 06:56:02 -0800 (PST)
      From: Steven Ciciora <karmannelectric@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] MY EV experience so far
      To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <999362.70904.qm@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8

      Congratulations! I am always most impressed with people who take the plunge on their own, especially ones who "... don't have a mechanical or electrical background...". I _do_ have a mechanical and electrical background, but was inspired by seeing others around me converting cars to electric. I can hardly imagine going EV on my own, and can't imagine the guts it would take to just jump in and make the commitment without a local support group.

      Way to go!

      - Steven Ciciora

      --- On Sun, 11/1/09, hazemsedra <hazemsedra@...> wrote:

      > From: hazemsedra <hazemsedra@...>
      > Subject: [EVDL] MY EV experience so far
      > To: ev@...
      > Date: Sunday, November 1, 2009, 7:41 AM
      >
      > First of all, thank you guys for taking the time to help me
      > with your
      > insightful comments regarding my continously running vacuum
      > pump.
      > I couldn't believe all the help I got..it needs a new valve
      > starter switch
      > and my beloved EV
      > should be back on the road soon.
      >
      > I bought my converted 85 Ford escort approximately 1 month
      > ago with a lot of
      > trepidation.? I am in the middle of northwest
      > minnesota in a small town, I
      > don't have a? a mechanical or electrical background as
      > I am in the health
      > care profession, and the closest EV shop is GEM motors in
      > Fargo, three hours
      > from where I live.
      >
      > However I just knew there must be an alternative out there
      > to gas engines,
      > and there must be something cleaner for our
      > environment...so why havn't we
      > got there with all this incredible technology around
      > us?? Gas prices
      > continued to rise, the recession hit in, GM/Ford execs
      > traveling in planes
      > to congress to beg for our money, and Exxon/Mobil making
      > record profits
      > while our precious environment continues to deteriorate and
      > is in state of
      > unforeseen worrisome changes.
      >
      > That's when the electric vehicle made absolute sense to
      > me.? However it was
      > a difficult choice, because I knew nothing about taking
      > care of a single
      > battery, and then I was faced with 18 of them, a
      > controller, a charger and
      > now a vacuum pump. Nevertheless after driving it for 500
      > miles so far, and
      > passing by those dirty gas stations, I discovered a new
      > found freedom!
      >
      > I think you know what I mean...there is a freedom and an
      > independence that
      > comes with an EV which is just so refreshing. There is a
      > pioneering spirit
      > that comes with it...that you are doing something
      > completely different and
      > unique. It's like the feeling when email and the internet
      > first came on the
      > scene in the early 90's. I was blown away by it, and it
      > changed how I did things from that moment. Sure I crashed
      > windows 95 several
      > times, didn't know the difference between aol and world
      > wide web, but I
      > stuck with it because I saw the potential and now I can't
      > function at home
      > or at work without the net. Same feelings, reactions, and
      > this excitement
      > about my EV and the possibilities later on. Now, I don't
      > think I can ever
      > return to a gas clunker again!
      >
      > Thank you guys again for your help and this forum. I wish I
      > can be as
      > optimistic as Bob Rice regarding new battery technology in
      > the near horizon
      > given? the corporate greed of the automotive/oil
      > industry?we will see.
      >
      > Hazem
      >
      > --
      > View this message in context: http://old.nabble.com/MY-EV-experience-so-far-tp26148899p26148899.html
      > Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list
      > archive at Nabble.com.
      >
      >
      > _______________________________________________
      > General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      > Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      > Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
      >
      >






      ------------------------------

      Message: 19
      Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 07:09:13 -0800
      From: gottdi@...
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] MY EV experience so far
      To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <558DF13E-02E8-41D9-8EBA-4AA8262791DA@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes

      This is the local support group! Enough information here to take the
      plunge with or without the EE degrees. It does not take a degree to do
      this you know! Just lots of friend

      Pete :)


      On Nov 1, 2009, at 6:56 AM, Steven Ciciora wrote:

      > without a local support group.



      ------------------------------

      Message: 20
      Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 11:01:11 -0500
      From: "Bob Rice" <bobrice@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] MY EV experience so far
      To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <A6D5AE93883B48049234222DA15F4158@adminwlzisp2uc>
      Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8";
      reply-type=original

      Hi Hazem;

      Hey! We're all family here, I mean that in a good way; "You choose yur
      friends your stuck with your family<g>?"!Is the norm. Sheeple, or friends
      don't let friends build an electric car in a rickety garage in Speonk NY or
      Surprise AZ, BOTH actual places, without friends, or in OUR case the
      "net!"Were here to help. Over 200 of us in all walks of life and places.
      Central Connecticut, here.Yur in MN, don't forget we have one of our most
      knowledgable guyz on here, Lee Hart, up in Sartell, MN, so it 'ain't a
      wasteland of EV stuff..CA and Or are the hotbed of EV activity, although it
      is spreading out east. ANOTHER EV was born in my garage last night!! Yup!
      Mike and I FINALLY hooked the Curtis controller up so it RAN! Mike has a 20
      mile RT for HIS daily run, so a 144 volt '97 S-10 SHOULD do it, and he can
      stop off at Home Despot or Blowes for stuff, as needed? For MORE EV stuff
      check out the Yahell Groups; the NEDRA one and EVen OURS "NEEAA" New England
      Electric Auto Assoc.That's ME and about 30 other guyz into EV's, a "Build it
      and they will come" sorta thing. Have club meetings at your home, fixed
      date, do show and tell, fill yur yard with EV's we've had a dozen,
      here!Electric meter spinnning like a CD player!Good food, company and tech
      talk.EV Chapters ARE springing up around the USA, as sheeple get the word,
      like YOU have! Great note of introduction ya posted!As you know EV's issues
      aren't technical, but political? I can't go into that, or I'll get yelled
      at, but I'm SURE you have scene the docu-flik "Who Killed the Electric Car"
      You haven't? Go rent/buy it, and report back, but DON'T watch it on a full
      stomach!I THINK there is a sequil in the works;After all we have Teslas out
      there for you guys with deep pockets or a few oil wells in yur back, or
      front yard? But you wouldn't NEED them for yourself, though?Although it IS
      easier to clean paint brushes, and sprayers with gas than electricity!

      Yeah! I GUESS I can be optimistic about badd-eries, I have followed all
      this over 40 years, old fart here,the wonderful, all conquoring battery is
      just around the corner? The Titanic's coming in Friday, and the US Budget
      will be balanced in OUR lifetime. Frankly I'm betting in the Titanic!The
      THIRD ship, in their fleet, WAS gunna be called the "Gigantic"But the name
      game changed, after the world's most famous boating accident, they let her
      go with "Britannic".Sad that we need a national emergency to make stuff
      happen, we go from chrisis to chrisis, nowadaze.But Tesla got some money
      from the Feds!Waiting for the model "S" to come out, for the rest of us, who
      might wanna travel with a Significent Other AND a suitcase or two? Better
      times ARE coming, in a EVer changing world. Thanks for joining OURS, you
      newbees, out there, too many to mention.This List grew from a few posts a
      day to todaze many, in , what, 10 years?Been a fun 10 years?

      Seeya

      Bob, only state without a drag strip; Corrupticut!

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "hazemsedra" <hazemsedra@...>
      To: <ev@...>
      Sent: Sunday, November 01, 2009 9:41 AM
      Subject: [EVDL] MY EV experience so far


      >
      > First of all, thank you guys for taking the time to help me with your
      > insightful comments regarding my continously running vacuum pump.
      > I couldn't believe all the help I got..it needs a new valve starter switch
      > and my beloved EV
      > should be back on the road soon.
      >
      > I bought my converted 85 Ford escort approximately 1 month ago with a lot
      > of
      > trepidation. I am in the middle of northwest minnesota in a small town, I
      > don't have a a mechanical or electrical background as I am in the health
      > care profession, and the closest EV shop is GEM motors in Fargo, three
      > hours
      > from where I live.
      >
      > However I just knew there must be an alternative out there to gas engines,
      > and there must be something cleaner for our environment...so why havn't we
      > got there with all this incredible technology around us? Gas prices
      > continued to rise, the recession hit in, GM/Ford execs traveling in planes
      > to congress to beg for our money, and Exxon/Mobil making record profits
      > while our precious environment continues to deteriorate and is in state of
      > unforeseen worrisome changes.
      >
      > That's when the electric vehicle made absolute sense to me. However it
      > was
      > a difficult choice, because I knew nothing about taking care of a single
      > battery, and then I was faced with 18 of them, a controller, a charger and
      > now a vacuum pump. Nevertheless after driving it for 500 miles so far, and
      > passing by those dirty gas stations, I discovered a new found freedom!
      >
      > I think you know what I mean...there is a freedom and an independence that
      > comes with an EV which is just so refreshing. There is a pioneering spirit
      > that comes with it...that you are doing something completely different and
      > unique. It's like the feeling when email and the internet first came on
      > the
      > scene in the early 90's. I was blown away by it, and it
      > changed how I did things from that moment. Sure I crashed windows 95
      > several
      > times, didn't know the difference between aol and world wide web, but I
      > stuck with it because I saw the potential and now I can't function at home
      > or at work without the net. Same feelings, reactions, and this excitement
      > about my EV and the possibilities later on. Now, I don't think I can ever
      > return to a gas clunker again!
      >
      > Thank you guys again for your help and this forum. I wish I can be as
      > optimistic as Bob Rice regarding new battery technology in the near
      > horizon
      > given the corporate greed of the automotive/oil industry?we will see.
      >
      > Hazem
      >
      > --
      > View this message in context:
      > http://old.nabble.com/MY-EV-experience-so-far-tp26148899p26148899.html
      > Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
      > Nabble.com.
      >
      >
      > _______________________________________________
      > General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      > Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      > Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
      >
      >



      ------------------------------

      Message: 21
      Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 11:12:48 -0500
      From: Dave Davidson <davetex99@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] MY EV experience so far
      To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@...>
      Message-ID:
      <36b5c54c0911010812i28ebb8b0pbac0a49e6ae4d085@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252

      I'll second Bob on that. He's built a number of EVs and generally has
      at least one under construction. There's a EAA chapter in MN, but
      don't know how close it is to you. Check out www.mneaa.com for
      details. If too far away, round up a few enthusiasts around you and
      start your own chapter.

      Dave

      On 11/1/09, Bob Rice <bobrice@...> wrote:
      > Hi Hazem;
      >
      > Hey! We're all family here, I mean that in a good way; "You choose yur
      > friends your stuck with your family<g>?"!Is the norm. Sheeple, or friends
      > don't let friends build an electric car in a rickety garage in Speonk NY or
      > Surprise AZ, BOTH actual places, without friends, or in OUR case the
      > "net!"Were here to help. Over 200 of us in all walks of life and places.
      > Central Connecticut, here.Yur in MN, don't forget we have one of our most
      > knowledgable guyz on here, Lee Hart, up in Sartell, MN, so it 'ain't a
      > wasteland of EV stuff..CA and Or are the hotbed of EV activity, although it
      > is spreading out east. ANOTHER EV was born in my garage last night!! Yup!
      > Mike and I FINALLY hooked the Curtis controller up so it RAN! Mike has a 20
      > mile RT for HIS daily run, so a 144 volt '97 S-10 SHOULD do it, and he can
      > stop off at Home Despot or Blowes for stuff, as needed? For MORE EV stuff
      > check out the Yahell Groups; the NEDRA one and EVen OURS "NEEAA" New England
      > Electric Auto Assoc.That's ME and about 30 other guyz into EV's, a "Build it
      > and they will come" sorta thing. Have club meetings at your home, fixed
      > date, do show and tell, fill yur yard with EV's we've had a dozen,
      > here!Electric meter spinnning like a CD player!Good food, company and tech
      > talk.EV Chapters ARE springing up around the USA, as sheeple get the word,
      > like YOU have! Great note of introduction ya posted!As you know EV's issues
      > aren't technical, but political? I can't go into that, or I'll get yelled
      > at, but I'm SURE you have scene the docu-flik "Who Killed the Electric Car"
      > You haven't? Go rent/buy it, and report back, but DON'T watch it on a full
      > stomach!I THINK there is a sequil in the works;After all we have Teslas out
      > there for you guys with deep pockets or a few oil wells in yur back, or
      > front yard? But you wouldn't NEED them for yourself, though?Although it IS
      > easier to clean paint brushes, and sprayers with gas than electricity!
      >
      > Yeah! I GUESS I can be optimistic about badd-eries, I have followed all
      > this over 40 years, old fart here,the wonderful, all conquoring battery is
      > just around the corner? The Titanic's coming in Friday, and the US Budget
      > will be balanced in OUR lifetime. Frankly I'm betting in the Titanic!The
      > THIRD ship, in their fleet, WAS gunna be called the "Gigantic"But the name
      > game changed, after the world's most famous boating accident, they let her
      > go with "Britannic".Sad that we need a national emergency to make stuff
      > happen, we go from chrisis to chrisis, nowadaze.But Tesla got some money
      > from the Feds!Waiting for the model "S" to come out, for the rest of us, who
      > might wanna travel with a Significent Other AND a suitcase or two? Better
      > times ARE coming, in a EVer changing world. Thanks for joining OURS, you
      > newbees, out there, too many to mention.This List grew from a few posts a
      > day to todaze many, in , what, 10 years?Been a fun 10 years?
      >
      > Seeya
      >
      > Bob, only state without a drag strip; Corrupticut!
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "hazemsedra" <hazemsedra@...>
      > To: <ev@...>
      > Sent: Sunday, November 01, 2009 9:41 AM
      > Subject: [EVDL] MY EV experience so far
      >
      >
      >>
      >> First of all, thank you guys for taking the time to help me with your
      >> insightful comments regarding my continously running vacuum pump.
      >> I couldn't believe all the help I got..it needs a new valve starter switch
      >> and my beloved EV
      >> should be back on the road soon.
      >>
      >> I bought my converted 85 Ford escort approximately 1 month ago with a lot
      >> of
      >> trepidation. I am in the middle of northwest minnesota in a small town, I
      >> don't have a a mechanical or electrical background as I am in the health
      >> care profession, and the closest EV shop is GEM motors in Fargo, three
      >> hours
      >> from where I live.
      >>
      >> However I just knew there must be an alternative out there to gas engines,
      >> and there must be something cleaner for our environment...so why havn't we
      >> got there with all this incredible technology around us? Gas prices
      >> continued to rise, the recession hit in, GM/Ford execs traveling in planes
      >> to congress to beg for our money, and Exxon/Mobil making record profits
      >> while our precious environment continues to deteriorate and is in state of
      >> unforeseen worrisome changes.
      >>
      >> That's when the electric vehicle made absolute sense to me. However it
      >> was
      >> a difficult choice, because I knew nothing about taking care of a single
      >> battery, and then I was faced with 18 of them, a controller, a charger and
      >> now a vacuum pump. Nevertheless after driving it for 500 miles so far, and
      >> passing by those dirty gas stations, I discovered a new found freedom!
      >>
      >> I think you know what I mean...there is a freedom and an independence that
      >> comes with an EV which is just so refreshing. There is a pioneering spirit
      >> that comes with it...that you are doing something completely different and
      >> unique. It's like the feeling when email and the internet first came on
      >> the
      >> scene in the early 90's. I was blown away by it, and it
      >> changed how I did things from that moment. Sure I crashed windows 95
      >> several
      >> times, didn't know the difference between aol and world wide web, but I
      >> stuck with it because I saw the potential and now I can't function at home
      >> or at work without the net. Same feelings, reactions, and this excitement
      >> about my EV and the possibilities later on. Now, I don't think I can ever
      >> return to a gas clunker again!
      >>
      >> Thank you guys again for your help and this forum. I wish I can be as
      >> optimistic as Bob Rice regarding new battery technology in the near
      >> horizon
      >> given the corporate greed of the automotive/oil industry?we will see.
      >>
      >> Hazem
      >>
      >> --
      >> View this message in context:
      >> http://old.nabble.com/MY-EV-experience-so-far-tp26148899p26148899.html
      >> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
      >> Nabble.com.
      >>
      >>
      >> _______________________________________________
      >> General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      >> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      >> Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      >> Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
      >>
      >>
      >
      > _______________________________________________
      > General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      > Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      > Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
      >
      >

      --
      Sent from my mobile device



      ------------------------------

      Message: 22
      Date: Sun, 1 Nov 2009 11:25:41 -0500
      From: "Bob Rice" <bobrice@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records
      To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <ECB8C0C46E534F0C8646CEBFECDDE7DC@adminwlzisp2uc>
      Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
      reply-type=original


      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Roger Heuckeroth" <rheuckeroth@...>
      To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@...>
      Sent: Sunday, November 01, 2009 9:10 AM
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records


      >
      > On Nov 1, 2009, at 12:45 AM, Bob Rice wrote:
      >
      >>>> - That said... who *needs* a car that goes 600+ miles without
      >>>> stopping?
      >>>> Who would even want to *pay* for it?
      >>>
      >>> Well my Jetta TDI goes over 600 miles driving at 70-75 MPH on a tank
      >>> of diesel. I drive from NY to SC 4-6 times a year on business.
      >>> That's 850 miles each way and I normally do it in one long trip.
      >>
      >> But I'll bet ya stop for eats, or to Piddle? Oh, I KNOW guyz
      >> that do
      >> 600 miles in one sitting but WHY? Ya wanna streatch yur legs, etc?
      >
      > Sure. But where do you stop to get a quick half hour charge on the
      > way? Nowhere at this point. Plus, my charger would take 4 hours from
      > 20% to 80%, so not real practical either.
      >
      > Maybe someday...
      I THINK the Tesla folks are working on this? When they have several
      thousand of them running around MAYBE somebody would set up a small
      substation needed to Dump Charge them while you eat!?Charge at 300 amps?
      Hell! Why not? IF the batteries could take it. We used to charge Bob
      Aronson's Mars 2 Renaults in 45 min at 20-300 amps, 40 years ago!What's a
      few hunderd amps to a substation or BIG biz?With those cables going in the
      size of your wrist?

      Seeya

      Bob, NOW if you could hacve a decent food restaurant there, too?
      > _______________________________________________
      > General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
      > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
      > Archives: http://evdl.org/archive/
      > Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
      >



      ------------------------------

      Message: 23
      Date: Sun, 01 Nov 2009 08:49:36 -0800
      From: Steven Lough <stevenslough@...>
      Subject: [EVDL] Great Story on Jerry
      To: seva@..., Electric Vehicle Discussion List RCVR
      <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <4AEDBC20.7030904@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed

      GREAT Story on Jerry Pohorsky, My Counterparat,
      President of the Silicon Valley Chapter
      of the Electric Auto Association (EAA)

      at: http://tinyurl.com/ybugoqo
      --
      Steven S. Lough, Pres.
      Seattle EV Association
      6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
      Seattle, WA 98115-7230
      Day: 206 524 1351
      Cell: 206 850 8535
      e-mail: stevenslough@...
      web: http://www.seattleeva.org



      ------------------------------

      Message: 24
      Date: Sun, 01 Nov 2009 13:38:42 -0500
      From: Lee Hart <leeahart@...>
      Subject: Re: [EVDL] Distance per single charge records
      To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@...>
      Message-ID: <4AEDD5B2.4090502@...>
      Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

      Lee Hart wrote:
      >>> Who *needs* a car that goes 600+ miles without stopping? Who
      >>> would even want to *pay* for it?

      Willie McKemie wrote:
      > For highway driving we use a TDI Golf. San Antonio 160 miles round
      > trip. Dallas Ft Worth 200 miles one way. Houston 160 miles. Texarkana
      > 350 miles. Those are all places we go once or twice a year...
      > Bottom line from my perspective: A 200-400 mile range IS desirable
      > and would be used.

      Your situation is representative of many people. They make these long
      trips a few times a year. They might drive 100 or 200 miles at a time;
      but then stop for a break (lunch, bathroom, or just to stretch their
      legs). This is an opportunity to recharge the car as well as yourself.

      My point was that virtually no one drives 600 miles without stopping.
      It's senseless to design a car to do it, especially if there is a high
      cost to do so.

      People *want* everything. They want a car as fast as a Ferrari, with the
      size of an SUV, that gets 100 mpg, and is as reliable as a Toyota. But
      they won't *pay* for such a vehicle.

      So while you could cram enough superbatteries into an EV to go 600 miles
      on a charge, the cost would be phenomenal. No one would pay for such a
      vehicle. It's only useful for marketing stunts.
      --
      Lee A. Hart | Ring the bells that still can ring
      814 8th Ave N | Forget the perfect offering
      Sart
      (Message over 64 KB, truncated)
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