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Re: [eurotrams-egroup] Fwd: [busesnortheast] Quaylink

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  • Simon P. Smiler
    Oh I say, that is some smoke! Very impressive - for all the wrong reasons. These are diesel burners... below is info which I ve copied from my website. John,
    Message 1 of 5 , Apr 9 2:22 PM
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      Oh I say, that is some smoke! Very impressive - for all the wrong reasons.
       
      These are diesel burners... below is info which I've copied from my website.
       
      John, although this is a trams list I am pleased you brought this to our attention.
       
      Thank you.
       
      Simon
       
      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
       
       

      Hybrid Buses In Britain.

      In Britain the city of Newcastle-Upon-Tyne has a small fleet of hybrid buses which have been sourced from New Zealand. Introduced in 2005, there are 10 of these innovatively styled vehicles and they are dedicated to the high profile QuayLink services linking the waterfront with other parts of Newcastle and Gateshead. Costing £200,000 each, these are 'series' type hybrid buses which use an (approximately) 25kW gas turbine to charge solid gel, water-cooled batteries. In addition the batteries are also charged overnight. Each bus seats 30 passengers plus there is space for a wheelchair and 20-30 standing passengers.

      The genesis of these buses was a partnership of Christchurch City Council, local bus company Redbus and New Zealand bus builder Designline, with the aim of creating an electric bus that would help reduce air and noise pollution in Christchurch. With batteries not being a viable option for a full day's service so hybrid technology was chosen as an alternative option which would at least partially meet their aspirations. Since 1998 these buses have been operating a high frequency inner-city centre shuttle service that is free to ride, has proven to be very popular and has even been credited as creating a positive image for buses that has spread fleetwide.

      In Christchurch the buses are powered by a LPG fuelled gas turbine whilst (for convenience) the British versions burn diesel fuel. An advantage of gas turbines is that they can burn pretty well anything liquid or gaseous, and this they do extremely cleanly - without needing catalysts or particle traps or special fuel additives, etc. They are also reputed to be very quiet with minimal vibration, so that it can often require keen powers of observation to determine whether they are running, and need very little maintenance. Unfortunately on the day these buses were sampled and photographed they had their passenger compartment heaters switched on - and as these use very noisy fans it was not possible to sample just how quiet or smooth their gas turbine engines really are. A disadvantage of gas turbines is that especially for smaller automotive sizes they are much less fuel efficient than diesels at full load and in any size, large or small, gas turbines have simply appalling part load efficiencies. These reasons help explain why their use (for surface transport) remains relatively rare.

      In addition to the innovative visual styling and innovative propulsion technology is a remote monitoring system which allows an engineer sitting at the office desk to interrogate the buses' on-board computers, monitor performance, carry out diagnostic checks, etc. A similar remote monitoring facility has also been fitted to the buses in Newcastle-Upon-Tyne.

      There is a story circulating relating to an occasion when one the Newcastle buses was being trialled in Carlisle. Apparently one day the engine refused to start up and not being sure of how to resolve this the bus garage people telephoned New Zealand for support. The solution suggested by the Designline technician was to connect a laptop computer and mobile telephone to the buses' electronics so that an attempt could be made to start the engine remotely (ie: from 11,000 miles / 17700km away!). This having been successful the ensuing 'thankyous' included the technician in New Zealand pointing out that whilst he was happy to be able to help it would be better if 'next time' the support call was made at a time other than 2.45am (local time)!

      -------Original Message-------
       
      Date: 09/04/2008 20:56:28
      Subject: Re: [eurotrams-egroup] Fwd: [busesnortheast] Quaylink
       
      I should have add that I have seen this a couple of
      times before. Anyone know how good these buses
      actually are.
       
       
      John
       
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    • David Stevenson
      It s not smoke it s water vapour which will quickly condense into water and spray all and sundry. It seems to be an issue with the water cooling of the
      Message 2 of 5 , Apr 9 10:13 PM
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        It's not smoke it's water vapour which will quickly condense into
        water and spray all and sundry. It seems to be an issue with the
        water cooling of the batteries. I believe the same thing happens with
        the Citaro fuel cell buses in London.
        On 9 Apr 2008, at 22:22, Simon P. Smiler wrote:
        >
        > Oh I say, that is some smoke! Very impressive - for all the wrong
        > reasons.
        >
        > These are diesel burners... below is info which I've copied from my
        > website.
        >
        > John, although this is a trams list I am pleased you brought this
        > to our attention.
        >
        > Thank you.
        >
        > Simon
        >
        > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
        > --------
        >
        > Hybrid Buses In Britain.
        > In Britain the city of Newcastle-Upon-Tyne has a small fleet of
        > hybrid buses which have been sourced from New Zealand. Introduced
        > in 2005, there are 10 of these innovatively styled vehicles and
        > they are dedicated to the high profile QuayLinkservices linking the
        > waterfront with other parts of Newcastle and Gateshead. Costing
        > £200,000 each, these are 'series' type hybrid buses which use an
        > (approximately) 25kW gas turbine to charge solid gel, water-cooled
        > batteries. In addition the batteries are also charged overnight.
        > Each bus seats 30 passengers plus there is space for a wheelchair
        > and 20-30 standing passengers.
        >
        > The genesis of these buses was a partnership of Christchurch City
        > Council, local bus company Redbus and New Zealand bus builder
        > Designline, with the aim of creating an electric bus that would
        > help reduce air and noise pollution in Christchurch. With batteries
        > not being a viable option for a full day's service so hybrid
        > technology was chosen as an alternative option which would at least
        > partially meet their aspirations. Since 1998 these buses have been
        > operating a high frequency inner-city centre shuttle service that
        > is free to ride, has proven to be very popular and has even been
        > credited as creating a positive image for buses that has spread
        > fleetwide.
        >
        > In Christchurch the buses are powered by a LPG fuelled gas turbine
        > whilst (for convenience) the British versions burn diesel fuel. An
        > advantage of gas turbines is that they can burn pretty well
        > anything liquid or gaseous, and this they do extremely cleanly -
        > without needing catalysts or particle traps or special fuel
        > additives, etc. They are also reputed to be very quiet with minimal
        > vibration, so that it can often require keen powers of observation
        > to determine whether they are running, and need very little
        > maintenance. Unfortunately on the day these buses were sampled and
        > photographed they had their passenger compartment heaters switched
        > on - and as these use very noisy fans it was not possible to sample
        > just how quiet or smooth their gas turbine engines really are. A
        > disadvantage of gas turbines is that especially for smaller
        > automotive sizes they are much less fuel efficient than diesels at
        > full load and in any size, large or small, gas turbines have simply
        > appalling part load efficiencies. These reasons help explain why
        > their use (for surface transport) remains relatively rare.
        >
        > In addition to the innovative visual styling and innovative
        > propulsion technology is a remote monitoring system which allows an
        > engineer sitting at the office desk to interrogate the buses' on-
        > board computers, monitor performance, carry out diagnostic checks,
        > etc. A similar remote monitoring facility has also been fitted to
        > the buses in Newcastle-Upon-Tyne.
        >
        > There is a story circulating relating to an occasion when one the
        > Newcastle buses was being trialled in Carlisle. Apparently one day
        > the engine refused to start up and not being sure of how to resolve
        > this the bus garage people telephoned New Zealand for support. The
        > solution suggested by the Designline technician was to connect a
        > laptop computer and mobile telephone to the buses' electronics so
        > that an attempt could be made to start the engine remotely (ie:
        > from 11,000 miles / 17700km away!). This having been successful the
        > ensuing 'thankyous' included the technician in New Zealand pointing
        > out that whilst he was happy to be able to help it would be better
        > if 'next time' the support call was made at a time other than
        > 2.45am (local time)!
        >
        > -------Original Message-------
        >
        > From: john carlson
        > Date: 09/04/2008 20:56:28
        > To: eurotrams@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: Re: [eurotrams-egroup] Fwd: [busesnortheast] Quaylink
        >
        > I should have add that I have seen this a couple of
        > times before. Anyone know how good these buses
        > actually are.
        >
        >
        > John
        >
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        > when posting images or large files.
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        >

        David Stevenson
        bodensee@...
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