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Re: [Error Coin Information Exchange] how off-center

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  • Robert Wilharm
    Kevin On cents the image needs to run off the coin and that is about 7%. The percentage of others i am not sure of but the image has to be running off the
    Message 1 of 10 , Jun 29, 2005
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      Kevin
      On cents the image needs to run off the coin and that is about 7%. The
      percentage of others i am not sure of but the image has to be running off
      the coin.

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Kevin L. Stewart" <Grimaldon@...>
      To: "Error Coins" <errorcoininformationexchange@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 4:52 PM
      Subject: [Error Coin Information Exchange] how off-center


      > I've noticed a few dimes a bit off-center and it brought up a question.
      > How for off-center does a coin have to be before it's worth holding on
      > to? If there is some difference between recent issues and past ones
      > I'd like to hear rules of thumb for each. (I'm looking at US coins.)
      >
      > Kevin
      >
      >
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    • Robert Wilharm
      If the image in not off the coin it is normally a misaligned die or a Broad struck. Robert ... From: Robert Wilharm To:
      Message 2 of 10 , Jun 29, 2005
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        If the image in not off the coin it is normally a misaligned die or a Broad
        struck.
        Robert
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Robert Wilharm" <robert.wilharm@...>
        To: <errorcoininformationexchange@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 4:55 PM
        Subject: Re: [Error Coin Information Exchange] how off-center


        > Kevin
        > On cents the image needs to run off the coin and that is about 7%. The
        > percentage of others i am not sure of but the image has to be running off
        > the coin.
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: "Kevin L. Stewart" <Grimaldon@...>
        > To: "Error Coins" <errorcoininformationexchange@yahoogroups.com>
        > Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 4:52 PM
        > Subject: [Error Coin Information Exchange] how off-center
        >
        >
        >> I've noticed a few dimes a bit off-center and it brought up a question.
        >> How for off-center does a coin have to be before it's worth holding on
        >> to? If there is some difference between recent issues and past ones
        >> I'd like to hear rules of thumb for each. (I'm looking at US coins.)
        >>
        >> Kevin
        >>
        >>
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      • Kevin L. Stewart
        Robert, Do you mean the design elements off the coin or the field too? Kevin ... __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and
        Message 3 of 10 , Jun 29, 2005
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          Robert,

          Do you mean the design elements off the coin or the field too?

          Kevin


          --- Robert Wilharm <robert.wilharm@...> wrote:

          > Kevin
          > On cents the image needs to run off the coin and that is about 7%.
          > The
          > percentage of others i am not sure of but the image has to be running
          > off
          > the coin.
          >



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        • Robert Wilharm
          Kevin Yes the design element. With a Mis aligned the opposite side is usually centered is it not? both sides need to be the same for an off center. Robert ...
          Message 4 of 10 , Jun 29, 2005
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            Kevin
            Yes the design element. With a Mis aligned the opposite side is usually
            centered is it not? both sides need to be the same for an off center.
            Robert
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "Kevin L. Stewart" <Grimaldon@...>
            To: <errorcoininformationexchange@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 5:09 PM
            Subject: Re: [Error Coin Information Exchange] how off-center


            > Robert,
            >
            > Do you mean the design elements off the coin or the field too?
            >
            > Kevin
            >
            >
            > --- Robert Wilharm <robert.wilharm@...> wrote:
            >
            >> Kevin
            >> On cents the image needs to run off the coin and that is about 7%.
            >> The
            >> percentage of others i am not sure of but the image has to be running
            >> off
            >> the coin.
            >>
            >
            >
            >
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          • Mike Diamond
            Robert is correct. An off-center strike is caused by a planchet misfeed that leaves the planchet, well, off-center. By contrast, a misaligned die error is
            Message 5 of 10 , Jun 29, 2005
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              Robert is correct. An off-center strike is caused by a planchet
              misfeed that leaves the planchet, well, off-center. By contrast, a
              misaligned die error is caused by a die that is off-center.

              Some of the design has to be cut off to be an off-center strike.
              Otherwise it's an uncentered broadstrike.

              --- In errorcoininformationexchange@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Wilharm"
              <robert.wilharm@v...> wrote:
              > Kevin
              > Yes the design element. With a Mis aligned the opposite side is
              usually
              > centered is it not? both sides need to be the same for an off center.
            • Kevin L. Stewart
              Thanks. That leads to two follow-on questions. Does the same rule of thumb apply to misaligned dies worth holding onto? And what causes misaligned dies on
              Message 6 of 10 , Jun 29, 2005
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                Thanks. That leads to two follow-on questions.

                Does the same rule of thumb apply to misaligned dies worth holding
                onto?

                And what causes misaligned dies on both obv and rev in opposite
                directions? (In this case to 3 o'clock on the obv and about 3 o'clock
                on the rev.) [Note, it's only a minor misalignment by your standard
                below, but I'm ever curious.]

                Kevin


                --- Robert Wilharm <robert.wilharm@...> wrote:

                > Kevin
                > Yes the design element. With a Mis aligned the opposite side is
                > usually
                > centered is it not? both sides need to be the same for an off center.
                > Robert
                >



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              • Mike Diamond
                ... Sort of. The bigger the misalignment, the more valuable it is. Misalignments up to 40% are known. ... o clock ... Either die can be misaligned.
                Message 7 of 10 , Jun 29, 2005
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                  --- In errorcoininformationexchange@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin L.
                  Stewart" <Grimaldon@y...> wrote:

                  > Thanks. That leads to two follow-on questions.
                  >
                  > Does the same rule of thumb apply to misaligned dies worth holding
                  > onto?

                  Sort of. The bigger the misalignment, the more valuable it is.
                  Misalignments up to 40% are known.
                  >
                  > And what causes misaligned dies on both obv and rev in opposite
                  > directions? (In this case to 3 o'clock on the obv and about 3
                  o'clock
                  > on the rev.) [Note, it's only a minor misalignment by your standard
                  > below, but I'm ever curious.]

                  Either die can be misaligned. Misalignments of the anvil die are
                  limited by the collar, and so are usually quite minor. There are a
                  few exceptions when, say, the collar breaks apart or the collar
                  itself becomes misaligned. I've written about both circumstances in
                  Errorscope.

                  The hammer die is not constrained by the collar, so its lateral
                  movement has fewer limitations.

                  Obverse and reverse dies are independent of each other, and there is
                  no reason they should become misaligned in the same direction.

                  As to why and how dies become misaligned, that's not particularly
                  well understood. A die can become loose in its recess, or the entire
                  die carriage can shift laterally. Misalignments can develop
                  gradually or abruptly. Some seem to be caused by collisions, such as
                  between hammer die and collar. Some are apparently caused by lateral
                  forces exerted on the die neck when a coin is sheared between the
                  hammer die and a collar frozen in the "up" position.
                  >
                • Kevin L. Stewart
                  I ve noticed a lot of dimes that are slightly misaligned (no rim on one side). Is there a reason there would be more misaligned dimes? Or is it just an
                  Message 8 of 10 , Jun 30, 2005
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                    I've noticed a lot of dimes that are slightly misaligned (no rim on one
                    side). Is there a reason there would be more misaligned dimes? Or is
                    it just an illusion?

                    Kevin


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                  • Mike Diamond
                    I would agree that minor misalignments seem to be more common on dimes. I don t know why, though. ... one
                    Message 9 of 10 , Jun 30, 2005
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                      I would agree that minor misalignments seem to be more common on
                      dimes. I don't know why, though.

                      --- In errorcoininformationexchange@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin L. Stewart"
                      <Grimaldon@y...> wrote:
                      > I've noticed a lot of dimes that are slightly misaligned (no rim on
                      one
                      > side). Is there a reason there would be more misaligned dimes? Or is
                      > it just an illusion?
                    • bull102797@YAHOO.COM
                      Maybe it is just an optical illusion, it is just more noticeable in a small coin. Just a guess. ... __________________________________________________ Do You
                      Message 10 of 10 , Jun 30, 2005
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                        Maybe it is just an optical illusion, it is just more
                        noticeable in a small coin. Just a guess.

                        --- Mike Diamond <mdia1@...> wrote:

                        > I would agree that minor misalignments seem to be
                        > more common on
                        > dimes. I don't know why, though.
                        >
                        > --- In errorcoininformationexchange@yahoogroups.com,
                        > "Kevin L. Stewart"
                        > <Grimaldon@y...> wrote:
                        > > I've noticed a lot of dimes that are slightly
                        > misaligned (no rim on
                        > one
                        > > side). Is there a reason there would be more
                        > misaligned dimes? Or is
                        > > it just an illusion?
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >


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