Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Enochian Bornless Ritual

Expand Messages
  • jen
    Looks interesting and I like Ben Rowe though I feel the Golden Dawn material is deficient in some ways, I ll take some time to look through it. I would really
    Message 1 of 22 , Nov 2, 2008
    View Source
    • 0 Attachment
      Looks interesting and I like Ben Rowe though I feel the Golden Dawn
      material is deficient in some ways, I'll take some time to look
      through it. I would really like to see some original work out there
      that is not Golden Dawn based, especially in the hepatarchial parts of
      the system which Mathers neglected entirely.
    • chris@karinoyo.com
      ... Do you have Peterson s transcription/translation of the Quinti ( John Dee s Five Books of Mystery )? WILL / LOVE - CP
      Message 2 of 22 , Nov 2, 2008
      View Source
      • 0 Attachment
        > Looks interesting and I like Ben Rowe though I feel the Golden Dawn
        > material is deficient in some ways, I'll take some time to look
        > through it. I would really like to see some original work out there
        > that is not Golden Dawn based, especially in the hepatarchial parts of
        > the system which Mathers neglected entirely.

        Do you have Peterson's transcription/translation of the 'Quinti' ("John
        Dee's Five Books of Mystery")?

        WILL / LOVE

        - CP
      • Jenny Sargent
        Oh yea!!! Peterson is one of the greatest scholars we have. I also have his edition of 6th and 7th book of moses and I ve ordered the Lemegeton but God alone
        Message 3 of 22 , Nov 2, 2008
        View Source
        • 0 Attachment
          Oh yea!!! Peterson is one of the greatest scholars we have. I also have his edition of 6th and 7th book of moses and I've ordered the Lemegeton but God alone knows when that will make its way across the border. I work pretty much exclusively from that and other classical material. I do like reading Rowe because he actually put quite a lot of original material in but my practice is totally different I found that Mather's made a lot of mistakes when he put the system together and quite a bit of material was omited.

          Going back to the language I think that because of the nature of spirits in general ( nonphysical needs completely different from human) that their commication would not reflect the common components of human language. Human need is basically the same regardless of culture. If angels are creative and destructive in nature then I suspect its mathmatically based. Until we figure out the basis for it I would be somewhat reluctant to do translating based on human linguistics which is what the Bornless ritual on the list is all about. Now I'm not the one who has the ability to decode this. I'm not skilled in cryptography.  I'm just pointing out we're dealing with a different species here and we cannot make assumptions like that.

          One of the things that I'm studying experimentally is intentionally working a different systems with the Enochian spirits. In the early part of Dee's work this is undoubtedly what he was having to do until all the equiptment was disclosed. So I'm not just studying the classical systems but trying to determine at least from my point of view in working which ones are most compatable with Enchian spirits and which ones aren't and how things appear when different systems are applied to communicate with those spirits.

          --- On Sun, 11/2/08, chris@... <chris@...> wrote:
          From: chris@... <chris@...>
          Subject: Re: [enochian] Re: Enochian Bornless Ritual
          To: enochian@yahoogroups.com
          Received: Sunday, November 2, 2008, 8:35 AM













          > Looks interesting and I like Ben Rowe though I feel the Golden Dawn

          > material is deficient in some ways, I'll take some time to look

          > through it. I would really like to see some original work out there

          > that is not Golden Dawn based, especially in the hepatarchial parts of

          > the system which Mathers neglected entirely.



          Do you have Peterson's transcription/ translation of the 'Quinti' ("John

          Dee's Five Books of Mystery")?



          WILL / LOVE



          - CP



























          __________________________________________________________________
          Ask a question on any topic and get answers from real people. Go to Yahoo! Answers and share what you know at http://ca.answers.yahoo.com

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • sazodeha Gohed
          For those of you who practice or are in the process of practicing, invoking, summoning and dealing with Angels. Do you think, or in your experience, that
          Message 4 of 22 , Nov 2, 2008
          View Source
          • 0 Attachment
            For those of you who practice or are in the process of practicing, invoking, summoning and dealing with Angels. Do you think, or in your experience, that Angels respond better when one is celibate as opposed to when you are not? This of course excludes any other type of entity, I am talking strictly Angels. Also, what is your opinion to not being celibate in marriage or outside of marriage Would not being celibate be considered sanctified within the bounds of marriage as opposed to outside of marriage?

            I wanted to bring this to those who may have experienced one way or another before I bring this question before any Angel.

            * As a side note I typically am celibate while in practice so it has not been an issue for me up to now, but I wonder should I slip will it effect my results.

            Thank You for your consideration and replies.
            ~ZWSazodehaWZ~ http://enochiantemple.org

















            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Jenny Sargent
            I ve not run into any requirements to that effect so far in reading Dee. My husband and I tend to work energetically together even if we re on the same
            Message 5 of 22 , Nov 2, 2008
            View Source
            • 0 Attachment
              I've not run into any requirements to that effect so far in reading Dee. My husband and I tend to work energetically together even if we're on the same projects we're still sharing resources, so keeping a healthy active  relationship going is important to that. I guess it would depend on how you interact with your spouse. Try it both ways.

              --- On Sun, 11/2/08, sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@...> wrote:
              From: sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@...>
              Subject: [enochian] Enochian, Angels and Celibacy...
              To: enochian@yahoogroups.com
              Received: Sunday, November 2, 2008, 11:23 AM













              For those of you who practice or are in the process of practicing, invoking, summoning and dealing with Angels. Do you think, or in your experience, that Angels respond better when one is celibate as opposed to when you are not? This of course excludes any other type of entity, I am talking strictly Angels. Also, what is your opinion to not being celibate in marriage or outside of marriage Would not being celibate be considered sanctified within the bounds of marriage as opposed to outside of marriage?



              I wanted to bring this to those who may have experienced one way or another before I bring this question before any Angel.



              * As a side note I typically am celibate while in practice so it has not been an issue for me up to now, but I wonder should I slip will it effect my results.



              Thank You for your consideration and replies.

              ~ZWSazodehaWZ~ http://enochiantemp le.org



















              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



























              __________________________________________________________________
              Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now at
              http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com.

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • yeti
              On behalf of all the magickal men on the forum; women, please do not believe the superstition that celibacy can sanctify anything. The best way for an
              Message 6 of 22 , Nov 2, 2008
              View Source
              • 0 Attachment
                On behalf of all the magickal men on the forum; women, please do not
                believe the superstition that celibacy can sanctify anything.

                The best way for an individual or a magickal couple to focus the will
                [as a thelemite] is to concentrate on the Stele of Revealing, more
                specifically Nuit; during orgasm.

                ...and to all the magickal women on the forum; I promise to think of
                something else during sex, should we ever do the do ;)

                Love is the law, love under will.

                anointed1
              • deanhild@att.net
                ... Our primate mating rituals and mores are the sort of thing the angels usually seem annoyed to be expected to have an opinion on, so I wouldn t worry about
                Message 7 of 22 , Nov 2, 2008
                View Source
                • 0 Attachment
                  -------------- Original message from sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@...>: --------------
                  >For those of you who practice or are in the process of practicing, invoking, summoning and dealing with >Angels. Do you think, or in your experience, that Angels respond better when one is celibate as opposed >to when you are not? This of course excludes any other type of entity, I am talking strictly Angels. Also, >what is your opinion to not being celibate in marriage or outside of marriage Would not being celibate be >considered sanctified within the bounds of marriage as opposed to outside of marriage?

                  Our primate mating rituals and mores are the sort of thing the angels usually seem annoyed to be expected to have an opinion on, so I wouldn't worry about them having a moral reaction. Enochian energies often seem to resonate with sexual energy, so a change in your sexual habits might open up some directions in your practice, though whether those directions are ones you want to go in is another question.
                  -Dean


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • David Carpathia
                  This is why I love Dean - he can just take all the nonsense out of a subject and kick-stuff a whole mess of righteousness right the hell into it. annoyed
                  Message 8 of 22 , Nov 2, 2008
                  View Source
                  • 0 Attachment
                    This is why I love Dean - he can just take all the nonsense out of a subject and kick-stuff a whole mess of righteousness right the hell into it.
                    "annoyed to be expected to have an opinion on." ahahhaha - word
                    Personally I think it's just us - some of us can get so twisted up by the sexual aspect of life that sometimes it's just better to put it on the backburner while some things are going down.
                    Some experiences that duquette describes in Enochian Vision Magick have extremely sexual connotations and I guess one could at least draw the conclusion that they dont at least consider it some filthy primal act and dont mind so much when you got it on the brain.
                    I'm finally in a place to do some magick and I'm thinking of invoking the 2nd call and scrying the astral scene.
                    much love to you all and congrats to gohed for getting his blog up - its mad interesting - i may be finding a clearing in the path and i`think of you all more than is probably appropriate.
                     
                    love will
                     
                     - David

                    --- On Sun, 11/2/08, deanhild@... <deanhild@...> wrote:

                    From: deanhild@... <deanhild@...>
                    Subject: Re: [enochian] Enochian, Angels and Celibacy...
                    To: enochian@yahoogroups.com
                    Date: Sunday, November 2, 2008, 11:24 PM






                    ------------ -- Original message from sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@yahoo. com>: ------------ --
                    >For those of you who practice or are in the process of practicing, invoking, summoning and dealing with >Angels. Do you think, or in your experience, that Angels respond better when one is celibate as opposed >to when you are not? This of course excludes any other type of entity, I am talking strictly Angels. Also, >what is your opinion to not being celibate in marriage or outside of marriage Would not being celibate be >considered sanctified within the bounds of marriage as opposed to outside of marriage?

                    Our primate mating rituals and mores are the sort of thing the angels usually seem annoyed to be expected to have an opinion on, so I wouldn't worry about them having a moral reaction. Enochian energies often seem to resonate with sexual energy, so a change in your sexual habits might open up some directions in your practice, though whether those directions are ones you want to go in is another question.
                    -Dean

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


















                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • david karess
                    ease your mind it makes no difference if celibate or not the purity of your intention is what defines what you will encounter the ritual saz ir refering to is
                    Message 9 of 22 , Nov 3, 2008
                    View Source
                    • 0 Attachment
                      ease your mind it makes no difference if celibate or not the purity of your intention is what defines what you will encounter the ritual saz ir refering to is an old wiccan one where abstaine for 30 days the control orgasm norm 5 times no leakege allowed the on the 6th allow orgasm it is The Union of the Souls ceremony takesfours from start to finish

                      --- On Sun, 11/2/08, Jenny Sargent <jennyksargent@...> wrote:

                      From: Jenny Sargent <jennyksargent@...>
                      Subject: Re: [enochian] Enochian, Angels and Celibacy...
                      To: enochian@yahoogroups.com
                      Date: Sunday, November 2, 2008, 8:23 PM






                      I've not run into any requirements to that effect so far in reading Dee. My husband and I tend to work energetically together even if we're on the same projects we're still sharing resources, so keeping a healthy active  relationship going is important to that. I guess it would depend on how you interact with your spouse. Try it both ways.

                      --- On Sun, 11/2/08, sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@yahoo. com> wrote:
                      From: sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@yahoo. com>
                      Subject: [enochian] Enochian, Angels and Celibacy...
                      To: enochian@yahoogroup s.com
                      Received: Sunday, November 2, 2008, 11:23 AM

                      For those of you who practice or are in the process of practicing, invoking, summoning and dealing with Angels. Do you think, or in your experience, that Angels respond better when one is celibate as opposed to when you are not? This of course excludes any other type of entity, I am talking strictly Angels. Also, what is your opinion to not being celibate in marriage or outside of marriage Would not being celibate be considered sanctified within the bounds of marriage as opposed to outside of marriage?

                      I wanted to bring this to those who may have experienced one way or another before I bring this question before any Angel.

                      * As a side note I typically am celibate while in practice so it has not been an issue for me up to now, but I wonder should I slip will it effect my results.

                      Thank You for your consideration and replies.

                      ~ZWSazodehaWZ~ http://enochiantemp le.org













                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]











                      ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
                      Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now at
                      http://ca.toolbar. yahoo.com.

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


















                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • david karess
                      set record straight sister MOSES actualy wrote ^6 books the torah only has first 5 there are 2books of the law wrote for a stable tribe not nomadic the
                      Message 10 of 22 , Nov 3, 2008
                      View Source
                      • 0 Attachment
                        set record straight sister MOSES actualy wrote ^6 books the torah only has first 5 there are 2books of the law wrote for a stable tribe not nomadic the disputed 7th was actually written by joshua who fought at jerico fame read the books of numbers  and leviticus see what I mean the internal angels of triangle add up to 60 this gives you  positions for 6pointed star or seal of solomon remember the angles when working enochian study long be 100% certain before attemp ok always here if you need me

                        --- On Sun, 11/2/08, Jenny Sargent <jennyksargent@...> wrote:

                        From: Jenny Sargent <jennyksargent@...>
                        Subject: Re: [enochian] Re: Enochian Bornless Ritual
                        To: enochian@yahoogroups.com
                        Date: Sunday, November 2, 2008, 3:49 PM






                        Oh yea!!! Peterson is one of the greatest scholars we have. I also have his edition of 6th and 7th book of moses and I've ordered the Lemegeton but God alone knows when that will make its way across the border. I work pretty much exclusively from that and other classical material. I do like reading Rowe because he actually put quite a lot of original material in but my practice is totally different I found that Mather's made a lot of mistakes when he put the system together and quite a bit of material was omited.

                        Going back to the language I think that because of the nature of spirits in general ( nonphysical needs completely different from human) that their commication would not reflect the common components of human language. Human need is basically the same regardless of culture. If angels are creative and destructive in nature then I suspect its mathmatically based. Until we figure out the basis for it I would be somewhat reluctant to do translating based on human linguistics which is what the Bornless ritual on the list is all about. Now I'm not the one who has the ability to decode this. I'm not skilled in cryptography.  I'm just pointing out we're dealing with a different species here and we cannot make assumptions like that.

                        One of the things that I'm studying experimentally is intentionally working a different systems with the Enochian spirits. In the early part of Dee's work this is undoubtedly what he was having to do until all the equiptment was disclosed. So I'm not just studying the classical systems but trying to determine at least from my point of view in working which ones are most compatable with Enchian spirits and which ones aren't and how things appear when different systems are applied to communicate with those spirits.

                        --- On Sun, 11/2/08, chris@karinoyo. com <chris@karinoyo. com> wrote:
                        From: chris@karinoyo. com <chris@karinoyo. com>
                        Subject: Re: [enochian] Re: Enochian Bornless Ritual
                        To: enochian@yahoogroup s.com
                        Received: Sunday, November 2, 2008, 8:35 AM

                        > Looks interesting and I like Ben Rowe though I feel the Golden Dawn

                        > material is deficient in some ways, I'll take some time to look

                        > through it. I would really like to see some original work out there

                        > that is not Golden Dawn based, especially in the hepatarchial parts of

                        > the system which Mathers neglected entirely.

                        Do you have Peterson's transcription/ translation of the 'Quinti' ("John

                        Dee's Five Books of Mystery")?

                        WILL / LOVE

                        - CP











                        ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
                        Ask a question on any topic and get answers from real people. Go to Yahoo! Answers and share what you know at http://ca.answers yahoo.com

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


















                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Kevin Zabbo
                        So far as I know, there is no rule on celibacy with the Enochian entities.   Kevin What if the Babe of the Abyss grows up to be a problem teen? ... From:
                        Message 11 of 22 , Nov 3, 2008
                        View Source
                        • 0 Attachment
                          So far as I know, there is no rule on celibacy with the Enochian entities.
                           
                          Kevin

                          What if the Babe of the Abyss grows up to be a problem teen?

                          --- On Sun, 11/2/08, sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@...> wrote:

                          From: sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@...>
                          Subject: [enochian] Enochian, Angels and Celibacy...
                          To: enochian@yahoogroups.com
                          Date: Sunday, November 2, 2008, 10:23 AM







                          For those of you who practice or are in the process of practicing, invoking, summoning and dealing with Angels. Do you think, or in your experience, that Angels respond better when one is celibate as opposed to when you are not? This of course excludes any other type of entity, I am talking strictly Angels. Also, what is your opinion to not being celibate in marriage or outside of marriage Would not being celibate be considered sanctified within the bounds of marriage as opposed to outside of marriage?

                          I wanted to bring this to those who may have experienced one way or another before I bring this question before any Angel.

                          * As a side note I typically am celibate while in practice so it has not been an issue for me up to now, but I wonder should I slip will it effect my results.

                          Thank You for your consideration and replies.
                          ~ZWSazodehaWZ~ http://enochiantemp le.org









                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


















                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Kevin Zabbo
                          If you have the *.pdf file with the TR in it, you can copy and paste it and possibly get the text that way.   If not, break out the old Underwood and start
                          Message 12 of 22 , Nov 3, 2008
                          View Source
                          • 0 Attachment
                            If you have the *.pdf file with the TR in it, you can copy and paste it and possibly get the text that way.
                             
                            If not, break out the old Underwood and start pecking away at the keys until it's done, or use a word processor and printer like everyone else.
                             
                            Kevin

                            What if the Babe of the Abyss grows up to be a problem teen?

                            --- On Fri, 10/31/08, sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@...> wrote:

                            From: sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@...>
                            Subject: [enochian] Tabula Recensa
                            To: enochian@yahoogroups.com
                            Date: Friday, October 31, 2008, 12:54 PM






                            Would anyone have or know where I can find a typed out list of the Angels of the Tabula Recensa in either word or txt format? I would rather not have to type them out if it already exist.

                            Thank you

                            ~ZWSazodehaWZ~ http://enochiantemp le.org
                             









                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


















                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Christian Velin
                            ... I have not noticed any differences at all, but your magic will suffer greatly if the sex distracts from your spiritual life, like any other disturbance.
                            Message 13 of 22 , Nov 3, 2008
                            View Source
                            • 0 Attachment
                              sazodeha Gohed wrote:
                              > For those of you who practice or are in the process of practicing, invoking, summoning and dealing with Angels. Do you think, or in your experience, that Angels respond better when one is celibate as opposed to when you are not? This of course excludes any other type of entity, I am talking strictly Angels. Also, what is your opinion to not being celibate in marriage or outside of marriage Would not being celibate be considered sanctified within the bounds of marriage as opposed to outside of marriage?
                              >
                              > I wanted to bring this to those who may have experienced one way or another before I bring this question before any Angel.
                              >
                              > * As a side note I typically am celibate while in practice so it has not been an issue for me up to now, but I wonder should I slip will it effect my results.
                              >
                              >
                              I have not noticed any differences at all, but your magic will suffer
                              greatly if the sex distracts from your spiritual life, like any other
                              disturbance.

                              /Christian
                            • Jenny Sargent
                               I might add there is a controversial story out there about Dee and Kelly being asked to switch wives. Now I m going into conjecture and as I said its
                              Message 14 of 22 , Nov 4, 2008
                              View Source
                              • 0 Attachment
                                 I might add there is a controversial story out there about Dee and Kelly being asked to switch wives. Now I'm going into conjecture and as I said its controversial.

                                One possibility is that this united Dee and Kelly in a sexual way which may have been a precedent for further work. No further work occured that we are aware of though. Kelly left at this point I believe or shortly thereafter.

                                Many say it was a move on Kelly's part to have Dee's wife or some kind of indirect homosexual act. It might have been but who knows.

                                My husband and I " discuss" this controversy at times. He is rather in favor of the first. I should say this since he's the expert.



















                                __________________________________________________________________
                                Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now at
                                http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com

                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • sazodeha Gohed
                                ... Thank you all for your responses. When I read this it resonated with me, I couldn t agree more. Thank you all again for helping me clear that up in my
                                Message 15 of 22 , Nov 4, 2008
                                View Source
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  >I have not noticed any differences at all, but your magic will suffer

                                  >greatly if the sex distracts from your spiritual life, like any other

                                  >disturbance.

                                  Thank you all for your responses. When I read this it resonated with me, I couldn't agree more. Thank you all again for helping me clear that up in my mind.

                                  ~ZWSazodehaWZ~ http://enochiantemple.org 

















                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • marsyas555
                                  ... me, I couldn t agree more. Thank you all again for helping me clear that up in my mind. ... Hi, Sorry all for this late response to this thread. I thought
                                  Message 16 of 22 , Nov 5, 2008
                                  View Source
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    --- In enochian@yahoogroups.com, sazodeha Gohed <sazodeha@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > >I have not noticed any differences at all, but your magic will suffer
                                    >
                                    > >greatly if the sex distracts from your spiritual life, like any other
                                    >
                                    > >disturbance.
                                    >
                                    > Thank you all for your responses. When I read this it resonated with
                                    me, I couldn't agree more. Thank you all again for helping me clear
                                    that up in my mind.
                                    >
                                    > ~ZWSazodehaWZ~ http://enochiantemple.org 
                                    >

                                    Hi,

                                    Sorry all for this late response to this thread. I thought I would
                                    voice my point of view on this since no one else has come forward in
                                    favor of abstinence when dealing with magick.

                                    Personally I have absolutely noticed a significant difference in
                                    abstaining from sex but this is only one aspect of the general
                                    purification process which for me is basically the solomonic 9/10 day
                                    purification.

                                    I suppose to be specific to the original post of this thread I should
                                    say that in my enochian investigations so far I have not utilized the
                                    solomonic style purification but I think if I were to perform the 19
                                    day enochian ceremony I would employ the solomonic style purification
                                    guidelines for a period leading up to the working as well as
                                    throughout the working itself.

                                    I'm sure most of you are well aware of what the solomonic purification
                                    entails but for those that don't some of its aspects involve
                                    abstaining from sex (including masturbation imo), a vegetarian diet,
                                    abstaining from stimulants (like alcohol, drugs and even coffee imo)
                                    having as little social interaction with people as possible and
                                    depriving oneself of sensory input (including useing the internet, tv,
                                    music etc) and resigning oneself to frequent daily periods of
                                    prayer/meditation, reading scripture and ritual bathing.

                                    Personally I have applied this in high end magickal workings such as
                                    evocation and I have found for myself that it is extremely helpful and
                                    directly impacts the results as well as residual affects of the
                                    working throughout my mundane life.

                                    Basically what happens is an elevation of consciousness away from the
                                    gravitation of the nephesh, and the desires and instincts of our lower
                                    more animal self, towards the seat of the ruach and our higher self is
                                    achieved.

                                    A more higher spiritual vibration results in the aura which I have
                                    found readies me for the spiritual, astral and etheric nature of the
                                    work. Theoretically it follows that the entities on the spritual,
                                    astral and/or etheric planes will recognize this elevated vibration in
                                    the aura as well and will respond sympathetically.

                                    Also the sensory deprivation is important in focusing the mind on and
                                    condensing thought towards the nature of the work and its goal in the
                                    9 days leading up to the working. There becomes a heightened awareness
                                    and a sort of intoxicating affect as a result of depriving oneself of
                                    the various stimuli of our general everyday lives.

                                    In my experience the first few days are very difficult but then there
                                    is a transformation I feel and it becomes strangely euphoric. I become
                                    at home and most happy in ritual, prayer and meditation. Sex and
                                    masturbation become so far from my mind and not at all any desire.
                                    I've found even just taking a quick phone call from a friend to be
                                    unbalancing and it could take about an hour to regain the harmonious
                                    spiritual state of mind prior to the interruption.

                                    I just wanted to express my own point of view regarding not only
                                    abstinence from sex but other purification aspects in high end
                                    magickal work. I thought since no one else really made any case for
                                    its value that I would chime in to give a contrasting point of view.

                                    But as I say I haven't done any such preparations in my enochian work.
                                    With enochian I pretty much have done skrying and have basically
                                    followed the heirarchichal structure of names in dealing with whatever
                                    EE's I have as well as making use of various preliminary rituals of
                                    pentegram and/or hexegrams etc. I have had pretty good results for the
                                    most part I think. For me the EE's seem to be generally responsive and
                                    willing to work with me.

                                    But as I say, if I were to want to evoke an EE or do something high
                                    end as the 19 day ritual personally I would make use of purification
                                    and sensory deprivation.

                                    Respectfully,
                                    Marsyas
                                  Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.