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Resignation Cheat and Client Server

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  • mok_at_killerbeesoftware <mok@killerbees
    In a few days I will try to write down what my development philosophy on this project will be and post it on my site, but yes, anything that changes game play
    Message 1 of 5 , Dec 30, 2002
      In a few days I will try to write down what my development
      philosophy on this project will be and post it on my site, but yes,
      anything that changes game play itself will NOT be in the "Ancient
      Edition", so from a game play perspective, the "Ancient Edition"
      should feel like the version 3.11b or 3.12, though it will be
      version 3.5x or so.

      Game play changes (which will be carefully selected and tested) will
      be included as options in the "Enhanced Edition". In other words,
      you can always go back to your 'Ancient Ways' if you feel necessary.
      I remember when ED first came out, I was concerned about
      the 'Advanced Game'. But pretty soon forgot about the 'Basic' game
      once the balance and fun of the advanced game was revealed. Still,
      it was comforting to know the Basic game was there when I bought it.

      Regardless of what gets added, the emphasis will be on keeping it
      simple. However, I hope to give you room to play, with editors that
      will let you experiment. This, added with time, may allow the game
      to evolve in ways we currently cannot envision today.

      The resignation bug is a concern of the 'Ancient Editon' and WILL be
      addressed there. My thinking on it at the moment is that whenever
      you resign in a PBEM game, you will have to send that game to your
      opponent(s) before you can examine their position. So if you are in
      a six player game, the game will pass to your five opponents,
      notifying them of your resignation, before you can see the game. I
      have not completely thought the logistics out when the game comes
      back to you, to allow the 5 player game to continue, but
      essentially, it's like one more turn for the player
      resigning...whatever happens needs be a simple, clean solution that
      fits within the existing code base to fix the problem that has
      plagued ED for about eight years.

      I would also like to allow a type of 'Civil Disorder', where the
      computer takes over your role upon request. I was in some 6 player
      games where certain opponent's chances were hopeless, but they were
      forced to keep playing or throw the game out of balance. This would
      aleviate that problem to an extent. No promises on that till I
      analyze the code.

      Speaking of bugs, there was an interesting comment in my forum about
      the Neutral Cities Reveals Capture bug. It has been essentially
      suggested that squashing this bug would change game play. I am
      interested in other's thoughts on that one....

      Client-Server, if implemented in the Enhanced Edition, would
      hopefully prove to provide added security, keeping either player
      from really having the game, as well as possibly facilitating play.
      I'm not really ready to comment more on it, because there are many
      different approaches to this. I have recieved several requests to
      use "The Zone" for facilitation, and implementing that would change
      the role of a dedicated server.

      I appreciate the comments. Please keep 'em coming. There is no rush
      though. It will be several months before the Ancient Edition is
      ready, and then much more time before the Enhanced arrives.

      --Mark
    • Steven Woodcock
      I think this so-called resignation bug is really kind of amusing. If I ve ever played against an opponent who s used it then my hat s off to you, since I
      Message 2 of 5 , Dec 30, 2002
        I think this so-called "resignation bug" is really kind of amusing. If
        I've ever played against an opponent who's used it then my hat's off to you,
        since I never had a clue.

        Baldwin and Rakowsky have always been a bit surprised the PBEM is even
        considered *viable*, for what it's worth. When I showed Mark the huge base
        of players that were doing tourneys and whatnot he was astounded--it seems
        he thinks the game is FAR too slow for a viable PBEM option and they only
        put it in because it was fairly easy.

        Oh well. It's a good feature to get rid of if there are folks out there
        abusing it.


        =============================
        Steven Woodcock
        From the High, Snowy Mountains of Colorado

        'Let us speak courteously, deal fairly, and keep ourselves armed and
        ready.' - Teddy Roosevelt, 1903

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: <mok@...>
        To: <empire-deluxe@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Monday, December 30, 2002 8:12 PM
        Subject: [empire-deluxe] Resignation Cheat and Client Server

        <snip>

        >
        > The resignation bug is a concern of the 'Ancient Editon' and WILL be
        > addressed there. My thinking on it at the moment is that whenever
        > you resign in a PBEM game, you will have to send that game to your
        > opponent(s) before you can examine their position. So if you are in
        > a six player game, the game will pass to your five opponents,
        > notifying them of your resignation, before you can see the game. I
        > have not completely thought the logistics out when the game comes
        > back to you, to allow the 5 player game to continue, but
        > essentially, it's like one more turn for the player
        > resigning...whatever happens needs be a simple, clean solution that
        > fits within the existing code base to fix the problem that has
        > plagued ED for about eight years.

        <snip>
      • Arnold Larson
        One simple security fix that might be worth adding for tournaments would be to have a game type that the program would only save via ftp. The tournament
        Message 3 of 5 , Dec 31, 2002
          One 'simple' security fix that might be worth adding for tournaments would
          be to have a game type that the program would only save via ftp. The
          tournament director would have to provide a secure ftp site. It would fix
          the 'resignation' cheat. A down-side is that programs crash, connections
          die, ..., so it would be necessary to be able to start again if that
          happened. Thus, not every restart is a cheater.

          Arne



          >From: "mok_at_killerbeesoftware <mok@...>"
          ><mok@...>
          >Reply-To: empire-deluxe@yahoogroups.com
          >To: empire-deluxe@yahoogroups.com
          >Subject: [empire-deluxe] Resignation Cheat and Client Server
          >Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 03:12:59 -0000
          >
          >In a few days I will try to write down what my development
          >philosophy on this project will be and post it on my site, but yes,
          >anything that changes game play itself will NOT be in the "Ancient
          >Edition", so from a game play perspective, the "Ancient Edition"
          >should feel like the version 3.11b or 3.12, though it will be
          >version 3.5x or so.
          >
          >Game play changes (which will be carefully selected and tested) will
          >be included as options in the "Enhanced Edition". In other words,
          >you can always go back to your 'Ancient Ways' if you feel necessary.
          >I remember when ED first came out, I was concerned about
          >the 'Advanced Game'. But pretty soon forgot about the 'Basic' game
          >once the balance and fun of the advanced game was revealed. Still,
          >it was comforting to know the Basic game was there when I bought it.
          >
          >Regardless of what gets added, the emphasis will be on keeping it
          >simple. However, I hope to give you room to play, with editors that
          >will let you experiment. This, added with time, may allow the game
          >to evolve in ways we currently cannot envision today.
          >
          >The resignation bug is a concern of the 'Ancient Editon' and WILL be
          >addressed there. My thinking on it at the moment is that whenever
          >you resign in a PBEM game, you will have to send that game to your
          >opponent(s) before you can examine their position. So if you are in
          >a six player game, the game will pass to your five opponents,
          >notifying them of your resignation, before you can see the game. I
          >have not completely thought the logistics out when the game comes
          >back to you, to allow the 5 player game to continue, but
          >essentially, it's like one more turn for the player
          >resigning...whatever happens needs be a simple, clean solution that
          >fits within the existing code base to fix the problem that has
          >plagued ED for about eight years.
          >
          >I would also like to allow a type of 'Civil Disorder', where the
          >computer takes over your role upon request. I was in some 6 player
          >games where certain opponent's chances were hopeless, but they were
          >forced to keep playing or throw the game out of balance. This would
          >aleviate that problem to an extent. No promises on that till I
          >analyze the code.
          >
          >Speaking of bugs, there was an interesting comment in my forum about
          >the Neutral Cities Reveals Capture bug. It has been essentially
          >suggested that squashing this bug would change game play. I am
          >interested in other's thoughts on that one....
          >
          >Client-Server, if implemented in the Enhanced Edition, would
          >hopefully prove to provide added security, keeping either player
          >from really having the game, as well as possibly facilitating play.
          >I'm not really ready to comment more on it, because there are many
          >different approaches to this. I have recieved several requests to
          >use "The Zone" for facilitation, and implementing that would change
          >the role of a dedicated server.
          >
          >I appreciate the comments. Please keep 'em coming. There is no rush
          >though. It will be several months before the Ancient Edition is
          >ready, and then much more time before the Enhanced arrives.
          >
          >--Mark
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


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        • rtyo348985@aol.com
          I have never heard of this bug either. When you resign, does it go into your player history?
          Message 4 of 5 , Jan 1, 2003
            I have never heard of this bug either. When you resign, does it go into your player history?
          • Steven Woodcock
            I would think so, but you can always back up your player history and restore it if you re into those things. There are also some third-party utilities through
            Message 5 of 5 , Jan 2, 2003
                  I would think so, but you can always back  up your player history and restore it if you're into those things. There are also some third-party utilities through which you can view or modify your player stats.
               

              =============================
              Steven Woodcock
              From the High, Snowy Mountains of Colorado
               
              'Let us speak courteously, deal fairly, and keep ourselves armed and ready.' - Teddy Roosevelt, 1903
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Thursday, January 02, 2003 12:15 AM
              Subject: Re: [empire-deluxe] Resignation Cheat and Client Server

              I have never heard of this bug either. When you resign, does it go into your player history?
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