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Re: "iu" and "ui" alternative spellings [was: Chin. Mode: No "-io", but "-io-"]

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  • j_mach_wust
    ... I m not so sure about that considering the three tehtar words *lüan and lü . And then, there s another problem: The omission of the e-tehta leads to
    Message 1 of 33 , Mar 4, 2006
      Hisilome wrote:
      > [Well, I'm impressed with what you two came up with! Certainly
      > _very_ economical in its use of diacritics.

      I'm not so sure about that considering the three tehtar words '*lüan'
      and 'lü'. And then, there's another problem: The omission of the
      e-tehta leads to some ambigue spellings. For example, 'liao' might be
      read as 'lie ao'. Hm, that ambiguity might be solved by always using a
      carrier in the transcriptions of 'ai ao ei ou' -- and of course, it
      would disappear if every word had a tone diacritic (which isn't the
      case, is it?, or at least not in the proposed mode). Maybe the
      obligatory carrier is the best solution.

      I've uploaded another table with /a/ analyzed as velar glide -- as in
      Pulleyblank's analysis pointed out by Melroch in #5193 -- and
      expressed by the gasdil or by a vertical stroke below (taken to be
      identical to a gasdil). That's certainly a remarkably strange
      analysis, resulting in Chinese having only one phonemic vowel, but it
      seems to work. That table also includes the above mentioned
      improvement of using a short carrier (as syllable onset sign) in 'ai
      ao ei ou'. I've changed the default consonant letter from lambe to
      númen since lambe is kind of an exceptional letter, taking tehtar
      below inside its bow, and I have found no lambe version of the
      vertical stroke below. There are again a pdf version and an rtf
      version to be found in the same directory.

      http://trizeps.ch/~choni/public/chinese_tengwar_without_a.png

      That version without any vowel tehtar really leaves the space above
      the tengwar to be used for tone signs. I imagine that normal ómatehtar
      signs might be used as tone signs, for instance the acute, grave,
      circumflex and caron tehtar. Like this, that Chinese mode can even be
      typed with existing tengwar fonts.

      However, there's the problem of the combination of the two dots above
      with another tehta (combination of modified left curl with another
      teha above is attested). Perhaps it might be more practical to place
      the two dots below the letters in all cases, even in combination with
      the vertical stroke (the dots may be placed on either side of it) and
      with the single dot (resulting in three dots below), in order to avoid
      a combination of the two dots above with another tehta above, --
      especially in the case of words of the kind consonant + üan and
      consonant + ü, because these already have two tehtar above even
      without any tone tehta.

      ---------------------------
      j. 'mach' wust
      http://machhezan.tripod.com
      ---------------------------
    • Melroch 'Aestan
      ... Mandarin was a typo for Cantonese here. Sorry. -- /BP 8^) -- Benct Philip Jonsson -- melroch at melroch dot se
      Message 33 of 33 , Mar 19, 2006
        hisilome skrev:

        >
        >>Duh, with six or seven tonemes Mandarin even stretches Roman to
        >>its limits!
        >
        >
        > [ Well, I'm no experts on linguistics (obviously!), so I may
        > misunderstand you here--but if "tonemes" are identical to tones,
        > standard Mandarin has four or five, and as far as I know some
        > subdialects of Mandarin have as little as three. Why six or seven? ]

        "Mandarin" was a typo for "Cantonese" here. Sorry.
        --

        /BP 8^)>
        --
        Benct Philip Jonsson -- melroch at melroch dot se
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