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Re: Hyarmen & yanta

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  • j_mach_wust
    ... ... What do you mean by a capital tengwa? Capital letters are a strange peculiarity of the modern Latin alphabet whereby the actual number of letters is
    Message 1 of 6 , Dec 24, 2005
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      David J. Finnamore wrote:
      >
      > Is there any difference between a hyarmen and a capital yanta? I'm
      > having a hard time distinguishing them in my own writing, except by
      > context, of course.
      ...

      What do you mean by a "capital" tengwa? Capital letters are a strange
      peculiarity of the modern Latin alphabet whereby the actual number of
      letters is really doubled since each letter exists in two different
      forms. Though this has been copied in a few alphabets heavily
      influenced by modern Latin (modern Cyrillic and modern Greek), it does
      not exist in tengwar.

      It is attested that certain tengwar may be written bigger, but that's
      not capital letters, that's just the same letters of an increased size.

      Looking at DTS 21, it seems not to be important in that mode to
      distinguish between hyarmen and yanta of increased size. It would be
      very difficult to read "h" instead of "e", I guess.

      ---------------------------
      j. 'mach' wust
      http://machhezan.tripod.com
      ---------------------------
    • Palatinus
      ... hm?? Tengwar don t have capital versions. Only bigger versions, with some extra ornaments. ___________________________________________________________
      Message 2 of 6 , Dec 24, 2005
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        > Is there any difference between a hyarmen and a
        > capital yanta? I'm

        hm?? Tengwar don't have capital versions. Only bigger
        versions, with some extra ornaments.






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      • David J. Finnamore
        ... Yes, you re right, of course, I don t mean capital in the sense of a different character like a and A, just a larger version, like c and C. If
        Message 3 of 6 , Dec 24, 2005
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          --- In elfscript@yahoogroups.com, "j_mach_wust" <j_mach_wust@y...> wrote:
          >
          > David J. Finnamore wrote:
          > >
          > > Is there any difference between a hyarmen and a capital yanta? I'm
          > > having a hard time distinguishing them in my own writing, except by
          > > context, of course.
          > ...
          >
          > What do you mean by a "capital" tengwa? Capital letters are a strange
          > peculiarity of the modern Latin alphabet whereby the actual number of
          > letters is really doubled since each letter exists in two different
          > forms. Though this has been copied in a few alphabets heavily
          > influenced by modern Latin (modern Cyrillic and modern Greek), it does
          > not exist in tengwar.
          >
          > It is attested that certain tengwar may be written bigger, but that's
          > not capital letters, that's just the same letters of an increased size.
          >
          > Looking at DTS 21, it seems not to be important in that mode to
          > distinguish between hyarmen and yanta of increased size. It would be
          > very difficult to read "h" instead of "e", I guess.
          >
          > ---------------------------
          > j. 'mach' wust
          > http://machhezan.tripod.com
          > ---------------------------
          >


          Yes, you're right, of course, I don't mean "capital" in the sense of a
          different character like a and A, just a larger version, like c and C.
          If "capitalized" is technically incorrect, what can we say instead,
          "magnified"? For now, I'll use that, since I can't think of anything
          better straight away. Tolkien seems to have routinely magnified the
          first letters of sentences, and sometimes the first letters of proper
          names, as well. To my eyes, hyarmen looks like simply a magnified
          yanta, or at least a tall yanta. So, when a sentence or name begins
          with yanta, it looks the same as if it were a hyarma. At least it did
          at first. I've begun starting the right arm further up on the stem
          for magnified yantas. Yantai. Yantim. Whatever the plural form
          would be. :-)

          Thanks,

          David "Daeron" Finnamore
          www.elvenminstrel.com

          Yanti, yantí, yantä, ...
        • David J. Finnamore
          ... Extra ornaments sounds fun. For grades 3 & 4, where the stem is already tall, magnifying the character gets kind of crazy, doesn t it? David Daeron
          Message 4 of 6 , Dec 24, 2005
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            --- In elfscript@yahoogroups.com, Palatinus <elfiness@y...> wrote:
            >
            > > Is there any difference between a hyarmen and a
            > > capital yanta? I'm
            >
            > hm?? Tengwar don't have capital versions. Only bigger
            > versions, with some extra ornaments.

            Extra ornaments sounds fun.

            For grades 3 & 4, where the stem is already tall, magnifying the
            character gets kind of crazy, doesn't it?

            David "Daeron" Finnamore
            www.elvenminstrel.com
          • David J. Finnamore
            ... Took me a little bit to figure out the ref to DTS 21. Yes, context makes it abundantly clear there. I m writing out every Sindarin text I can find in the
            Message 5 of 6 , Dec 24, 2005
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              --- In elfscript@yahoogroups.com, "j_mach_wust" <j_mach_wust@y...> wrote:

              > Looking at DTS 21, it seems not to be important in that mode to
              > distinguish between hyarmen and yanta of increased size. It would be
              > very difficult to read "h" instead of "e", I guess.
              >

              Took me a little bit to figure out the ref to DTS 21. Yes, context
              makes it abundantly clear there. I'm writing out every Sindarin text
              I can find in the mode of Beleriand for practice.

              David "Daeron" Finnamore
              the elf who knew too little [lore]
              www.elvenminstrel.com
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