Re: A Elbereth
- Well, it's been nice chatting with you gentlemen. Guess I've got some
homework to do. When I come back some of my newbie smell will be
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "j_mach_wust" <j_mach_wust@y...> wrote:
> Pretty much so. Go for the page of Måns Björkman, Amanye Tenceli:
> The tengwar guides by Per Lindberg are also a very good source:
> Very good information on some often neglected tengwar texts (the
> English full writing modes that make up a more important part than any
> Middle Earth language texts among Tolkien's tengwar texts) is to be
> found at Ronald Kyrmse's site:
> That's about it well, don't forget the Mellonath Daeron Index of
> tengwar specimina I've already mentioned:
> j. 'mach' wust
- --- In email@example.com, "i_degilbor"
> Here is Tolkien's calligraphic tengwar rendering of 'A Elbereth':Oh, thank you, thank you, Danny!
> The tehtar and punctuation marks are higher than they should be.
> That's how they appeared in the original edition of 'The Road Goes
> Ever On'.
> Cuio mae, Danny.
BTW, I drooled embarrassingly over your web pages of elvish
calligraphy. I can never hope to be that good, but it's exactly the
sort of thing I'm picturing in my mind for the A Elbereth manuscript,
esp andries_adarnin.jpg. That look with enough space between lines to
add neumes. Aaaaghhghhh like Homer Simpson over a carmel baloney
sandwich. Or better, like Sam G over a pot of stewed coneys WITH
> combinations. For example, Per Lindberg recommendsSince you are talking with the 'General USe' tehtar
> placing a line
> above 17 for the double n of Ennorath, while the
> shows 17 with a line
mode, I think that Lindberg is correct here. The line
underneath AFAIK is used in cases other than nasals
> underneath. Tolkien seems to leave open the optionThis applies to Mode of Beleriand
> of using 21 and 22
> for n and m, but I've never seen it done in
> practice. I kind of like
> that, and tried it for a while.
> The most "authentic" approach would depend on whatyes, if you like to have some 'fan fiction' backstory
> era and location
> the manuscript is supposed to be from, right? Let's
behind your manuscript, as many like to do in
> assume it wasi have the impression that many, or most, consider the
> made at Imladris, middle Third Age, since we don't
> know whether the
> Hall of Fire version of /A Elbereth/ is much older
> than that (do we?).
> Am I right that it would use the so called mode of
> Gondor, with tehta
> vowels? Any other pointers?
Sindarin tehtar modes to be invented by Men. If that's
correct, the only authentic ELvish Sindarin mode
known, is the Beleriandic one.
It's a complicated subject, and there have been some
recent publishing concerning the 'General Use'. I'd
like to hear other opinions about this.
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- --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, Palatinus <elfiness@y...> wrote:
> > combinations. For example, Per Lindberg recommends
> > placing a line
> > above 17 for the double n of Ennorath, while the
> > page
> > http://www.geocities.com/therealteng/guide.html
> > shows 17 with a line
> Since you are talking with the 'General USe' tehtar
> mode, I think that Lindberg is correct here. The line
> underneath AFAIK is used in cases other than nasals
> > underneath. Tolkien seems to leave open the option
> > of using 21 and 22
> > for n and m, but I've never seen it done in
> > practice. I kind of like
> > that, and tried it for a while.
> This applies to Mode of Beleriand
Thanks, Palatinus. After studying the version of /A Elbereth/ that
Danny sent (http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/elfscript/message/5057),
made by Tolkien himself in the mode used at Imladris, I'm delighted to
find that it exhibits some of the tendencies I was already developing,
aside from the major difference of not using tehtar. The left swoop
under "g", the left curl at the top of "th" and "f", the ways adjacent
letters are sometimes connected, that sort of thing. I'm a little
disappointed at having to go with writing out vowels but I'm getting
used to it. I may have to embellish my melody to keep it from looking
too sparse above all those characters! :-)
David "Daeron" Finnamore
- Viktor Epp wrote:
> This is in fact supported by the text itself: In RGEO:70 (and back cover)the subtitle of the poem is given as "Aerlinn in edhil o Imladris"
(translated by Helge Fauskanger as *"Hymn of the Elves of Rivendell").
Yes, it must be either "hymn" (aer-linn = holy-song) OR "sea-song", if
_aer_ here represents _aear_.
- --- In email@example.com, "Helge K. Fauskanger"
> Viktor Epp wrote:
> > This is in fact supported by the text itself: In RGEO:70 (and back
> the subtitle of the poem is given as "Aerlinn in edhil o Imladris"Well, it's not a sea-song, so it must be a holy song. The sea is
> (translated by Helge Fauskanger as *"Hymn of the Elves of Rivendell").
> Yes, it must be either "hymn" (aer-linn = holy-song) OR "sea-song", if
> _aer_ here represents _aear_.
> - HKF
mentioned, but only geographically. A longer version of it was sung
by Gildor's folk while walking at night under the trees and stars,
which are also mentioned in the text. Too bad it's only given in
English there. Formally, it's quite clearly a hymn, in the historical
meaning of the term: a song of praise.
David "Daeron" Finnamore