Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.
 

Translation verification for a name...

Expand Messages
  • SfStarfire
    Hello, I ve been referred to this group for a validation of an English name I d like to see rendered in Tengwar. I ve got 2 versions on a website; one that I
    Message 1 of 10 , Dec 21, 2001
      Hello,

      I've been referred to this group for a validation of an English name
      I'd like to see rendered in Tengwar. I've got 2 versions on a
      website; one that I picked and chose from a grid, which I'm assuming
      is bunch. The other I generated using the Tengwar Scribe. I've been
      a fan of the novels for years, read about the languages but as a
      linguist I'm pretty bad; hence the call for help.

      The name is: randy
      The URL is: http://communities.msn.com/starfirect/rr.msnw?
      action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=83

      There's 6 words on the page. The first 2 rows should all be Randy in
      both Tengwar Quenya and Script. The 2 on the left are my own mess
      and the 2 on the right are what the Scribe think it would be; TengWeb
      agreed. The 3rd row is an attempt at "starfire". The last row is
      again "randy" but using Erebor Runes.

      Thanks in advance for you combined knowledge!
      Sf
    • Gildor Inglorion
      teithant SfStarfire ... * transcription, not translation :) i agree with the result of Tengscribe... however for starshine you should have used Roomen for r,
      Message 2 of 10 , Dec 22, 2001

        teithant SfStarfire

        > Thanks in advance for you combined knowledge!

        * transcription, not translation :)

        i agree with the result of Tengscribe... however for starshine you should have used Roomen for r, Calma with extended stems for sh and Nuumen for n... your tehtar are good...

        for the Cirth, I think you should use I instead of long E at the end



        Do You Yahoo!?
        Αποκτήστε την δωρεάν σας @... διεύθυνση στο Yahoo! Mail.
      • SfStarfire
        Thank ya, Gildor! So the transcription is correct; I appreciate the proofing on that. I wanted to make sure that the word itself was correct before doing
        Message 3 of 10 , Dec 22, 2001
          Thank ya, Gildor!

          So the transcription is correct; I appreciate the proofing on that.
          I wanted to make sure that the word itself was correct before doing
          anything permenant with it, and with my obvious lack of knowledge I
          had no way to know for certain.

          Funny that the 3rd line came back around as Starshine; it went into
          the Scribe as Starfire. I figure there that Quenya has words to
          match both star and fire seperatedly, but I let the Scribe do the
          work for me; figured it would be close.

          For the Cirth runes, I actually came close to doing the rune for EE,
          but in looking at some of the writings of the Cirth on the web, it
          looked like either would work. I looked for similar sounding words
          on the "first" pages of LotR that a number of web sites paid
          attention to. I'm just happen that I was at least partially
          close... Cirth looks like it lends itself more to English; given the
          presumed anglo-saxon roots of the language, it makes sense.

          Thanks again!
          Sf

          --- In elfscript@y..., Gildor Inglorion <elfiness@y...> wrote:
          >
          > teithant SfStarfire
          >
          > > Thanks in advance for you combined knowledge!
          >
          > * transcription, not translation :)
          >
          > i agree with the result of Tengscribe... however for starshine you
          should have used Roomen for r, Calma with extended stems for sh and
          Nuumen for n... your tehtar are good...
          >
          > for the Cirth, I think you should use I instead of long E at the
          end
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ---------------------------------
          > Do You Yahoo!?
          > ÁðïêôÞóôå ôçí äùñåÜí óáò@... äéåýèõíóç óôï Yahoo! Mail.
        • uialdil
          Teithant Gildor Inglorion: * transcription, not translation :)Yup! i agree with the result of Tengscribe... however for starshine you should= have
          Message 4 of 10 , Dec 22, 2001
            Teithant Gildor Inglorion:
            > * transcription, not translation :)

            >Yup!

            > i agree with the result of Tengscribe... however for starshine you should=
            have used Roomen for r, Calma with extended stems for sh and Nuumen for n..=
            . your tehtar are good...

            Check it again...it DOES say 'starFIRE', NOT 'starSHINE'. And óre is correc=
            t, not rómen since it represents a pre-consonantal 'r' rather than the prev=
            ocalic 'r' denoted by 'rómen'.

            > for the Cirth, I think you should use I instead of long E at the end

            True, since 'i' and 'y' represent the same sound in English. As far as that=
            goes, iota and ypsilon represent the same sound in Greek as well (except, o=
            f course, in diphthongs!)

            Cuio mae, Danny.
          • Gildor Inglorion
            teithant SfStarfire ... * you are most welcome ... the Scribe as Starfire. I figure there that Quenya has words to match both star and fire seperatedly, but I
            Message 5 of 10 , Dec 22, 2001

              teithant SfStarfire

              > Thank ya, Gildor!

              * you are most welcome

              > Funny that the 3rd line came back around as Starshine; it went into

              the Scribe as Starfire.  I figure there that Quenya has words to
              match both star and fire seperatedly, but I let the Scribe do the
              work for me; figured it would be close.

              * oh, it was indeed Starfire? I thought it was a wrong attempt for Starshine!! my apologies... then your word seems to be correct although he second _r_ should be Roomen instead of Oore

              > For the Cirth runes, I actually came close to doing the rune for EE,

              but in looking at some of the writings of the Cirth on the web, it
              looked like either would work.  I looked for similar sounding words
              on the "first" pages of LotR that a number of web sites paid
              attention to.  I'm just happen that I was at least partially
              close... Cirth looks like it lends itself more to English; given the
              presumed anglo-saxon roots of the language, it makes sense.

              * but i think [randi] would be more close to Randy than [rande:]... in Cirth long e is pronounced as.. er.. 'long e' and not as 'long i' in English "meet"



              Do You Yahoo!?
              Αποκτήστε την δωρεάν σας @... διεύθυνση στο Yahoo! Mail.
            • Gildor Inglorion
              teithant uialdil ... have used Roomen for r, Calma with extended stems for sh and Nuumen for n..= . your tehtar are good... ... t, not rómen since it
              Message 6 of 10 , Dec 22, 2001

                teithant uialdil

                > i agree with the result of Tengscribe... however for starshine you should=

                have used Roomen for r, Calma with extended stems for sh and Nuumen for n..=
                . your tehtar are good...

                > Check it again...it DOES say 'starFIRE', NOT 'starSHINE'. And σre is correc=
                t, not rσmen since it represents a pre-consonantal 'r' rather than the  prev=
                ocalic 'r' denoted by 'rσmen'.

                ** yup... i wrongly thought he intended to write 'starshine'.. still only the fist 'r' sould be Oore



                Do You Yahoo!?
                Αποκτήστε την δωρεάν σας @... διεύθυνση στο Yahoo! Mail.
              • DDanielA@webtv.net
                Teithant Gildor Inglorion: **yup... i wrongly thought he intended to write starshine ... still only the fist r sould be Oore I disagree. In the King s
                Message 7 of 10 , Dec 23, 2001
                  Teithant Gildor Inglorion:
                  **yup... i wrongly thought he
                  intended to write 'starshine'...
                  still only the fist 'r' sould be
                  Oore

                  I disagree. In the King's Letter (Version I) and the "Errantry"
                  calligraphy manuscripts, JRRT uses oore to represent 'r' before a final
                  silent 'e', not roomen. In other words, an 'e' that is silent in
                  standard British English is written as oore; 'fire' fits into this
                  category. [fai@] (where @ represents the schwa). See especially his
                  transliteration of 'Shire' in the King's Letter, Version I.

                  Cuio mae, Danny.
                • SfStarfire
                  ... Starshine!! my apologies... then your word seems to be correct although he second _r_ should be Roomen instead of Oore Roomen b/c it s pre-vowel? And does
                  Message 8 of 10 , Dec 23, 2001
                    > * oh, it was indeed Starfire? I thought it was a wrong attempt for
                    Starshine!! my apologies... then your word seems to be correct
                    although he second _r_ should be Roomen instead of Oore

                    Roomen b/c it's pre-vowel? And does that rule apply if it's
                    a "silent" vowel?

                    > * but i think [randi] would be more close to Randy than
                    [rande:]... in Cirth long e is pronounced as.. er.. 'long e' and not
                    as 'long i' in English "meet"

                    Ironically enough, I've spelled Randy as Randee for fun during the
                    80s... that whole MTV Redwoods thingy. Either works for me,
                    actually; I just wanted to make sure I had it mostly right!

                    Thanks again,
                    Sf
                  • Gildor Inglorion
                    teithant SfStarfire ... * well no... oore must be used here... I am not very good at tengwar-elvish orthography.. sorry for the inconvenience :( ... Do You
                    Message 9 of 10 , Dec 23, 2001

                      teithant SfStarfire

                      > Roomen b/c it's pre-vowel?  And does that rule apply if it's a "silent" vowel?

                      * well no... oore must be used here... I am not very good at tengwar-elvish orthography.. sorry for the inconvenience :(

                       



                      Do You Yahoo!?
                      Αποκτήστε την δωρεάν σας @... διεύθυνση στο Yahoo! Mail.
                    • SfStarfire
                      Hey, I m the TRUE novice here - didn t you see what my translation was before I found the Scribe? :) ... a silent vowel? ... tengwar-elvish orthography..
                      Message 10 of 10 , Dec 27, 2001
                        Hey, I'm the TRUE novice here - didn't you see what my translation
                        was before I found the Scribe? :)

                        --- In elfscript@y..., Gildor Inglorion <elfiness@y...> wrote:
                        >
                        > teithant SfStarfire
                        >
                        > > Roomen b/c it's pre-vowel? And does that rule apply if it's
                        a "silent" vowel?
                        >
                        > * well no... oore must be used here... I am not very good at
                        tengwar-elvish orthography.. sorry for the inconvenience :(
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ---------------------------------
                        > Do You Yahoo!?
                        > ÁðïêôÞóôå ôçí äùñåÜí óáò@... äéåýèõíóç óôï Yahoo! Mail.
                      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.