Re: help needed.. please? :)
- Carl wrote:
> I still disagree. _deri_ 'stop, halt', certainly has none of thedesired meaning, which is "to continue to be" something (my vigor, my
joy, my pain).
Already then. I was thinking of it and have to admit you're right.
> After all, if presented next week with someone wanting totranslate "You stop my heart", would you not then suggest the same
Hmmm, assuming you wouldn't let it go through this list unnoticed ...
> What "arguing"? How is it "arguing" to point out that the word yousuggest does not have the desired meaning?
This had no negative meaning. I might have rather written "guessing"
or something less ambiguous. Or nothing.
> My only "DIRECT" advice is to not use _deri_,OK.
So let's try to help poor Idril. What about something like:
_Le hebithon vi guur niin, le i 'orf niin, i 'lass niin, i naeg niin._
"You I will keep in my heart, you - my vigor, my joy, my pain."
- knowing that the pronominal ending is not sure. I don't have VT:44
so I haven't read the analysis so I can't say anything about accuracy
One little question in the end: were we of any help to Idril? I guess
not. And that doesn't please me.
- On Dec 2, 2003, at 4:06 AM, Calwen Rudh wrote:
> One little question in the end: were we of any help to Idril? I guessI think it is quite a bit of help -- whether the person being so helped
> not. And that doesn't please me.
realizes it or not -- to show what the actual nature of Tolkien's
languages is, and how language in general actually works, and the
pitfalls of attempting to "speak" a poorly-attested language.
After all, if none of these things concern "Idril", if all she really
wants it to have something pretty-looking permanently etched into her
skin, then why not just transliterate the English phrase into Tengwar?
Carl F. Hostetter Aelfwine@... http://www.elvish.org
ho bios brachys, he de techne makre.
Ars longa, vita brevis.
The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne.
"I wish life was not so short," he thought. "Languages take such
a time, and so do all the things one wants to know about."
- --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, Carl F. Hostetter <Aelfwine@e...>
> After all, if none of these things concern "Idril", if all shereally
> wants it to have something pretty-looking permanently etched intoher
> skin, then why not just transliterate the English phrase intoTengwar?
Well this was in my mind too. To be honest I don't much understand
people who want to get an English (or other language) sentence in
Sindarin tattood in Tengwar without knowing a piece of Sindarin
itself. I wouldn't e.g. get a tattoo of wind in Svahili transcribed
in Japanese signs although Svahili seems very exotic to me and I like
the look of Japanese signs. But it doesn't mean I don'T want to help.
It is their choice.
Ok, Idril, so why don'T you get your sentence in English in Tengwar
when we can't give you a good translation into Sindarin? :o)
- Carl F. Hostetter wote:
> My only "DIRECT" advice is to not use _deri_, since it clearly does nothave the desired meaning (in fact, has pretty much the opposite of the
desired meaning in this case). Offhand, I can't think of a verb that does
have the desired meaning -- again, "to continue to be" (something) -- so
unless someone can suggest such a verb, I would otherwise advise you either
Some kind of paraphrase is the obvious solution here. If we assume that
_le_ can function as subject "you", then "you remain" (etc.) can be
rendered as _le him_, literally "you [are] continually" or "you're still
[my pleasure, my pain or whatever]". See the entry KHIM in the Etymologies
for the adverb _him_.