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  • Veiluve Ardaheru Minak
    Again Daniel you have been of much help for my studies. One more thing, I need some more clarification on ngoldo. Ngoldo is used with words of wisdom correct?
    Message 1 of 6 , Apr 8, 2003
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      Again Daniel you have been of much help for my studies.
      One more thing, I need some more clarification on ngoldo. Ngoldo is
      used with words of wisdom correct?
      Now what exactly consitutes a word of wisdow? Is it any word that
      describes something that can be taught, or that gives a better
      understanding?
      I.E. Tengwar:(f.y.i. I try to use a mode of sindarin but not
      beleriand the tehtar make it look more "elvish" lol)
      1. tinco,ngolodo(tehta e),wilya,ore(tehta a)
      2. tinco,ngalme(tehta e),wilya,ore(tehta a)
      3. tinco, numen(tehta e),ungwe(over-tilde),ore(tehta a)
      I figure they are all correct from one's view of writing but for the
      final my question returns back to ng(w)alme, would this be an
      exception where it could replace the ngw? Yes, yes I know in the
      third age it had turned to ng but, by perhaps answering my own
      question, I would go with the first regardless. Just do to the fact
      that by learing tengwar you are in fact receiving knowledge...
      Yes you all will learn that I sometimes just need an approval even
      though I have assumed it already. Again thank you all for your
      patience, I in the last three months have picked up tengwar as a
      hobby.
      -Ve
    • Gildor Inglorion
      teithant Veiluve Ardaheru Minak ... hm.. words that derive from e stem with initial NG-... the words for wisdom, derived from stem NGOL are a good example
      Message 2 of 6 , Apr 8, 2003
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        teithant Veiluve Ardaheru Minak

        > One more thing, I need some more clarification on
        > ngoldo. Ngoldo is
        > used with words of wisdom correct?
        > Now what exactly consitutes a word of wisdow? Is it
        > any word that
        > describes something that can be taught, or that
        > gives a better
        > understanding?

        hm.. words that derive from e stem with initial NG-...
        the words for wisdom, derived from stem NGOL are a
        good example (ngolime, ngole, ngolwen etc), that
        doesnt mean that Noldo must be used about 'any' word
        having to do with knowledge!

        there are also other words that need Ngoldo because
        they are derived from a stem with initial NG-, not
        having anything to do with wisdom

        generally... Ngoldo is only used for initial ng-

        > I.E. Tengwar:(f.y.i. I try to use a mode of sindarin
        > but not
        > beleriand the tehtar make it look more "elvish" lol)
        > 1. tinco,ngolodo(tehta e),wilya,ore(tehta a)
        > 2. tinco,ngalme(tehta e),wilya,ore(tehta a)
        > 3. tinco, numen(tehta e),ungwe(over-tilde),ore(tehta
        > a)

        ah, you confused Quenya with Sindarin spelling: the
        tehtar go over the PRECEDING tengwa, not the FOLLOWING
        tengwa...

        the correct way to spell this word is tinco(e), ungwe
        (a), ore

        ngwalme is used only initially, like Ngoldo, and you
        dont need Numen and over-tilde, because the whole
        cluster -ngw- is written with Ungwe alone!

        > I figure they are all correct from one's view of
        > writing but for the
        > final my question returns back to ng(w)alme, would
        > this be an
        > exception where it could replace the ngw? Yes, yes I
        > know in the
        > third age it had turned to ng but, by perhaps
        > answering my own
        > question, I would go with the first regardless. Just

        ngwalme became nwalme in 3rd Age, like Ngoldo became
        Noldo.. it didnt become Ngalme!

        > do to the fact
        > that by learing tengwar you are in fact receiving
        > knowledge...

        hopefully!!

        ____________________________________________________________
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      • Veiluve Ardaheru Minak
        One or the other, come on, I get from one that ngwalme turned to ngalme and from you I get nwalme, which is correct!? I ll just go by Dan Smith... So would the
        Message 3 of 6 , Apr 8, 2003
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          One or the other, come on, I get from one that ngwalme turned to
          ngalme and from you I get nwalme, which is correct!? I'll just go by
          Dan Smith... So would the correct word since I prefer sindarin be
          TEITHO? Also please remember a good many of us are new at this and
          talking down to us is very disheartening due to the fact I myself
          view the many who can answer my questions as authorities and
          knowledgeable.
          Also again Gildor you have my many thanks...
          -Ve


          --- In elfscript@yahoogroups.com, Gildor Inglorion <elfiness@y...>
          wrote:
          > teithant Veiluve Ardaheru Minak
          >
          > > One more thing, I need some more clarification on
          > > ngoldo. Ngoldo is
          > > used with words of wisdom correct?
          > > Now what exactly consitutes a word of wisdow? Is it
          > > any word that
          > > describes something that can be taught, or that
          > > gives a better
          > > understanding?
          >
          > hm.. words that derive from e stem with initial NG-...
          > the words for wisdom, derived from stem NGOL are a
          > good example (ngolime, ngole, ngolwen etc), that
          > doesnt mean that Noldo must be used about 'any' word
          > having to do with knowledge!
          >
          > there are also other words that need Ngoldo because
          > they are derived from a stem with initial NG-, not
          > having anything to do with wisdom
          >
          > generally... Ngoldo is only used for initial ng-
          >
          > > I.E. Tengwar:(f.y.i. I try to use a mode of sindarin
          > > but not
          > > beleriand the tehtar make it look more "elvish" lol)
          > > 1. tinco,ngolodo(tehta e),wilya,ore(tehta a)
          > > 2. tinco,ngalme(tehta e),wilya,ore(tehta a)
          > > 3. tinco, numen(tehta e),ungwe(over-tilde),ore(tehta
          > > a)
          >
          > ah, you confused Quenya with Sindarin spelling: the
          > tehtar go over the PRECEDING tengwa, not the FOLLOWING
          > tengwa...
          >
          > the correct way to spell this word is tinco(e), ungwe
          > (a), ore
          >
          > ngwalme is used only initially, like Ngoldo, and you
          > dont need Numen and over-tilde, because the whole
          > cluster -ngw- is written with Ungwe alone!
          >
          > > I figure they are all correct from one's view of
          > > writing but for the
          > > final my question returns back to ng(w)alme, would
          > > this be an
          > > exception where it could replace the ngw? Yes, yes I
          > > know in the
          > > third age it had turned to ng but, by perhaps
          > > answering my own
          > > question, I would go with the first regardless. Just
          >
          > ngwalme became nwalme in 3rd Age, like Ngoldo became
          > Noldo.. it didnt become Ngalme!
          >
          > > do to the fact
          > > that by learing tengwar you are in fact receiving
          > > knowledge...
          >
          > hopefully!!
          >
          > ____________________________________________________________
          > Do You Yahoo!?
          > ÁðïêôÞóôå ôç äùñåÜí @... äéåýèõíóç óáò óôï http://www.otenet.gr
        • Veiluve Ardaheru Minak
          One or the other, come on, I get from one that ngwalme turned to ngalme and from you I get nwalme, which is correct!? I ll just go by Dan Smith... So would the
          Message 4 of 6 , Apr 8, 2003
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            One or the other, come on, I get from one that ngwalme turned to
            ngalme and from you I get nwalme, which is correct!? I'll just go by
            Dan Smith... So would the correct word since I prefer sindarin be
            TEITHO? Also please remember a good many of us are new at this and
            talking down to us is very disheartening due to the fact I myself
            view the many who can answer my questions as authorities and
            knowledgeable.
            Also again Gildor you have my many thanks...
            -Ve


            --- In elfscript@yahoogroups.com, Gildor Inglorion <elfiness@y...>
            wrote:
            > teithant Veiluve Ardaheru Minak
            >
            > > One more thing, I need some more clarification on
            > > ngoldo. Ngoldo is
            > > used with words of wisdom correct?
            > > Now what exactly consitutes a word of wisdow? Is it
            > > any word that
            > > describes something that can be taught, or that
            > > gives a better
            > > understanding?
            >
            > hm.. words that derive from e stem with initial NG-...
            > the words for wisdom, derived from stem NGOL are a
            > good example (ngolime, ngole, ngolwen etc), that
            > doesnt mean that Noldo must be used about 'any' word
            > having to do with knowledge!
            >
            > there are also other words that need Ngoldo because
            > they are derived from a stem with initial NG-, not
            > having anything to do with wisdom
            >
            > generally... Ngoldo is only used for initial ng-
            >
            > > I.E. Tengwar:(f.y.i. I try to use a mode of sindarin
            > > but not
            > > beleriand the tehtar make it look more "elvish" lol)
            > > 1. tinco,ngolodo(tehta e),wilya,ore(tehta a)
            > > 2. tinco,ngalme(tehta e),wilya,ore(tehta a)
            > > 3. tinco, numen(tehta e),ungwe(over-tilde),ore(tehta
            > > a)
            >
            > ah, you confused Quenya with Sindarin spelling: the
            > tehtar go over the PRECEDING tengwa, not the FOLLOWING
            > tengwa...
            >
            > the correct way to spell this word is tinco(e), ungwe
            > (a), ore
            >
            > ngwalme is used only initially, like Ngoldo, and you
            > dont need Numen and over-tilde, because the whole
            > cluster -ngw- is written with Ungwe alone!
            >
            > > I figure they are all correct from one's view of
            > > writing but for the
            > > final my question returns back to ng(w)alme, would
            > > this be an
            > > exception where it could replace the ngw? Yes, yes I
            > > know in the
            > > third age it had turned to ng but, by perhaps
            > > answering my own
            > > question, I would go with the first regardless. Just
            >
            > ngwalme became nwalme in 3rd Age, like Ngoldo became
            > Noldo.. it didnt become Ngalme!
            >
            > > do to the fact
            > > that by learing tengwar you are in fact receiving
            > > knowledge...
            >
            > hopefully!!
            >
            > ____________________________________________________________
            > Do You Yahoo!?
            > ÁðïêôÞóôå ôç äùñåÜí @... äéåýèõíóç óáò óôï http://www.otenet.gr
          • Gildor Inglorion
            teithant Veiluve Ardaheru Minak ... nwalme ... what for? teitho means write! (imperative) ____________________________________________________________ Do You
            Message 5 of 6 , Apr 8, 2003
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              teithant Veiluve Ardaheru Minak

              > One or the other, come on, I get from one that
              > ngwalme turned to
              > ngalme and from you I get nwalme, which is correct!?

              nwalme

              > I'll just go by
              > Dan Smith... So would the correct word since I
              > prefer sindarin be
              > TEITHO? Also please remember a good many of us are

              what for? teitho means 'write!' (imperative)

              ____________________________________________________________
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            • D. Daniel Andriës
              ... by ... I think it s a better idea to go by J. R. R. Tolkien himself. In Appendix E of LotR he specifically states the name of the tegwa to be nwalme,
              Message 6 of 6 , Apr 8, 2003
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                Teithant Ve:
                > One or the other, come on, I get from one that ngwalme turned to
                > ngalme and from you I get nwalme, which is correct!? I'll just go
                by
                > Dan Smith...

                I think it's a better idea to go by J. R. R. Tolkien himself. In
                Appendix E of LotR he specifically states the name of the tegwa to be
                nwalme, formerly ngwalme. BTW, in Quenya both noldo and nwalme can
                only occur initially as far as we know.

                So would the correct word since I prefer sindarin be
                > TEITHO?

                _têw_ = tengwa (singular)
                _tîw_ = tengwar (plural)

                > Also please remember a good many of us are new at this and
                > talking down to us is very disheartening due to the fact I myself
                > view the many who can answer my questions as authorities and
                > knowledgeable.

                We understand this and are not trying to talk down to you. We commend
                you for your interest in learning the Tengwar and want to make sure
                that you learn what is correct to the best of our understanding.

                Cuio mae, Danny.
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