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25Re: Tengwar

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  • Michael Everson
    Apr 14, 2000
      Ar 20:01 +0100 2000-04-13, scríobh Robert Brady:

      >I'm not convinced about the idea of modes needing particular
      >font/rendering logic. Whilst I appreciate that this is done in order that
      >the underlying spelling is the same, this isn't really a useful property
      >to have : there are only a few Quenya and Sindarin sounds that share the
      >same character in their normal modes, and they are different languages, so
      >words and names will (in the general case) be spelt differently anyway...

      You would get Quenya regularly represented: N-E-Ld-E 'nelde',
      N-E-L-T-I-Ld-I 'neltildi' and S-I-L-M-A-R-I-L~-I-X-O-N 'SILMARILLION. But
      Sindarin would be incorrectly represented: N-L-E-D-E 'neled', NLEThLI
      'nelthil', and S-L-I-V-R-A-L~-I-X-I-R-O 'SILMARILLION'.

      >This would complicate writing a renderer, and make it impossible to
      >represent different modes in plaintext.

      Actually not. You just have to have smart fonts to get the ligatures (as
      you do for Arabic and Devanagari) and even if you didn't you would still
      get a legible text (with the tehtar simply showing as nonspacing:

      Quenya N´LD´ 'nelde', N´LT·Ld· 'neltildi'
      Sindarin N´L´D 'neled', N´LTh·L 'nelThil'

      Yes, we'll have to have good fonts, but we would need those ANYWAY in order
      to get the nonspacing tehtar to combine correctly over their consonants.

      And the alternative would be expensive inputting software to meet Sindarin
      or English expectations. This is what you'd have to do to meet the user's
      "underlying spelling" expectations, which they probably want to use on
      inputting because it is lots easier.

      >apart from that...
      > xx2D (short carrier) is mentioned in Appendix E :
      > "When there was no consonant present in the required position, the
      > /tehta/ was placed above the 'short carrier', of which a common form
      > was like an undotted i."

      Oops, that's an error in the names list. xx2D isn't the short charrier, it
      is halla. The short carrier is xx2E. So I don't have the attestation for
      halla yet.

      > xx70 - xx7D come from a manuscript that I think was published in /Vinyar
      > Tengwar/. Perhaps someone else knows which issue.
      >I see no obvious (or subtle) errors.

      Apparently it was Quettar 13 and 14, but I do not have these. (I need them.)

      Michael Everson ** Everson Gunn Teoranta ** http://www.egt.ie
      15 Port Chaeimhghein Íochtarach; Baile Átha Cliath 2; Éire/Ireland
      Vox +353 1 478 2597 ** Fax +353 1 478 2597 ** Mob +353 86 807 9169
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