- May 15, 2003xeeniseit scripsit:
> > Then I shouldn't ignore them either. The appendices say somethinginteresting on hyarmen: That in the beginning it was a weaker variant
of harma. How is this to be understood? Does this mean that the
palatal fricative hy is to be considered a variant of the velar one?
Etymologically? I can't judge on that, as I don't know about Quenya
etymology. Phonetically? This would seem strange to me, but maybe
possible, but I'd like to have more evidence on it.
John Cowan responsit:
> Consider the alternation in German and other languages between [x]and [C], the velar and palatal fricatives. Near front vowels, as
in "ich", one gets the palatal fricative; near back vowels, as
in "ach", one gets the velar fricative.
Well known to me. And 3rd Age Quenya shows the same alternation with
original ch between vowel and t (tehtar as "te-hy-tar", ohtar as "o-
ch-tar"). But even though in that way, an original ch has become hy,
there's also an original hy which -as far as I can see- has nothing
to do with original ch. At least, both sounds occur in the same
surroundings (e.g. at the beginning of a word before a: hyarmen,
charma). But it depends (almost) entirely on the context whether you
have German /x/ or /C/, and the same happens with Quenya vowel `+ ht:
it depends on the preceding vowel.
> In origin, hyarmen represented [hj].This makes things even trickier! Even though I believe that by means
of coarticulation, of connected speech (nobody pronounces isolate
sounds), there's only a very short way from [hj] to [C]. But I have
no idea how I can put together the ideas of hyarmen originally
representing [hj] and being derived from charma as a weaker variant.
But suppose that hyarmen originally represented /h/: Then its being a
weaker variant of /ch/ wouldn't be problematic any longer. - But then
there'd be a mess with the word 'original'. What is the most original
tengwar mode? In internal history it must be Feanors mode, but we
don't know it; in external history I suspect it's the English mode.
And the h-ch stuff in an English mode makes more sense to me than the
hy-ch stuff of Quenya!???
Why is there more logic in the English mode than in the Quenya mode
or in the mode of Beleriand?
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