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Taliska

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  • falmarendur
    Aiya Mr Hostetter, I ve read that you have some kind of grammar about Taliska, and that you re going to publish it in a future, and I d like to know when.
    Message 1 of 7 , Apr 23, 2004
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      Aiya Mr Hostetter,
      I've read that you have some kind of grammar about Taliska, and that
      you're going to publish it in a future, and I'd like to know when.
      Thanks!
      (I didn't mean to make an offense to anyone)
    • Carl F. Hostetter
      It s true that my colleagues and I are in possession of a photocopy of Tolkien s extensive historical grammar of Taliska, and it is certainly our intention to
      Message 2 of 7 , Apr 23, 2004
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        It's true that my colleagues and I are in possession of a photocopy of
        Tolkien's extensive historical grammar of Taliska, and it is certainly
        our intention to publish it one day, in the course of the chronological
        presentation of Tolkien's linguistic writings. But there are other
        materials that precede it, and that need to be published first in order
        for Taliska to be fully presented in its proper context.

        Carl


        On Apr 23, 2004, at 8:45 PM, falmarendur wrote:

        > Aiya Mr Hostetter,
        > I've read that you have some kind of grammar about Taliska, and that
        > you're going to publish it in a future, and I'd like to know when.



        --
        =============================================
        Carl F. Hostetter Aelfwine@... http://www.elvish.org

        ho bios brachys, he de techne makre.
        Ars longa, vita brevis.
        The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne.
        "I wish life was not so short," he thought. "Languages take such
        a time, and so do all the things one wants to know about."
      • jonathan_avidan
        We also have word of two other languages from Taliska s internal and external period, namely Mork (with a slash across the _o_ which my PC refuses to
        Message 3 of 7 , Apr 23, 2004
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          We also have word of two other languages from Taliska's internal and
          external period, namely Mork (with a slash across the _o_ which my
          PC refuses to implement) and Hvendi. Are they historically related?
          They are supposed to belong, if I'm not mistaken, to the three
          houses of Men and are supposed to be slightly modelled,
          phonaesthetically, after Gothic, Old English and Old Norse. Now,
          Taliska's name and the few words in it (see the article on the
          tongues of Men on Ardalambion) imply that it's the Gothic one.
          _Hvendi_ holds the cluster _hv_, common in Norse languages (< kw-)
          so that may imply it's the Nordic-style language. However, the word
          _mork_ itself (with the slashed _o_) contradicts Old English
          phonology. Bizarre.

          Jonathan Avidan
          IsraE.L.F.

          Carl F. Hostetter <Aelfwine@e...> wrote:
          > It's true that my colleagues and I are in possession of a
          photocopy of
          > Tolkien's extensive historical grammar of Taliska, and it is
          certainly
          > our intention to publish it one day, in the course of the
          chronological
          > presentation of Tolkien's linguistic writings. But there are other
          > materials that precede it, and that need to be published first in
          order
          > for Taliska to be fully presented in its proper context.
          >
          > Carl
        • Carl F. Hostetter
          Yes, Hvendi exists, and is related to (and, in the chronology of Tolkien s linguistic invention, contemporary with) Taliska. Mork (with or without a slash,
          Message 4 of 7 , Apr 23, 2004
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            Yes, Hvendi exists, and is related to (and, in the chronology of
            Tolkien's linguistic invention, contemporary with) Taliska. "Mork"
            (with or without a slash, umlaut, or silent q), however, exists only in
            the fevered imagination of Lisa Star -- as with many of her rantings.


            --
            =============================================
            Carl F. Hostetter Aelfwine@... http://www.elvish.org

            ho bios brachys, he de techne makre.
            Ars longa, vita brevis.
            The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne.
            "I wish life was not so short," he thought. "Languages take such
            a time, and so do all the things one wants to know about."
          • jonathan_avidan
            Well that explains a great deal :) Taliska and Hvendi, two related Germanic-based works of art by Tolkien - it will be, I think, very profitable to learn of
            Message 5 of 7 , Apr 24, 2004
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              Well that explains a great deal :) Taliska and Hvendi, two related
              Germanic-based works of art by Tolkien - it will be, I think, very
              profitable to learn of how Tolkien perceived their relation.
              However, I think it more important to have the context set out
              properly, as Carl mentioned.

              Carl F. Hostetter <Aelfwine@e...> wrote:
              "Mork" (with or without a slash, umlaut, or silent q), however,
              exists only in
              the fevered imagination of Lisa Star -- as with many of her rantings.
            • falmarendur
              And is it possible, if copyright permits it, to know how it looks like, any word or phrase?
              Message 6 of 7 , Apr 25, 2004
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                And is it possible, if copyright permits it, to know how it looks
                like, any word or phrase?
              • jonathan_avidan
                Well, Taliska, by name, testimony and few samples is slightly (or heavily?) Gothic based. In WJ:238, 270, 309 we find _hal_ head, chief , _halbar_
                Message 7 of 7 , Apr 26, 2004
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                  Well, Taliska, by name, testimony and few samples is slightly (or
                  heavily?) Gothic based. In WJ:238, 270, 309 we find _hal_ "head,
                  chief", _halbar_ "chieftain", _hal(a)_ "watch, guard",
                  _halad_ "warden", _haldad_ "watchdog" and _bor_ "stone". In the
                  Silmarillion, chp. 17, it is said that Beor's people (the speakers
                  of Taliska) called him _Nóm_, "wisdom" and his people _Nómin_, "the
                  wise". Helge concludes this might be the plural ending seen in
                  various tongues of various stages by Tolkien, like Doriathrin,
                  Ilkorin, Gnomish (btw, in Hebrew is beautifully called _Lilanith_
                  which actually resembles the language itself!) and Rohirric (Helge
                  mentioned only Dor. and Rohirric). However, this seems to be a
                  simple adjectival ending by gloss and context. People are not
                  called "wisdoms", yet "wise" can be used as a noun.

                  Happy Israeli Independance Day!
                  Khag shameakh,
                  Jonathan Avidan.

                  "falmarendur" <falmarendur@y...> wrote:
                  > And is it possible, if copyright permits it, to know how it looks
                  > like, any word or phrase?
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