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Re: WinRT - this is not a help request!

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  • mljones1947
    Please: None of this is directed at you personally, Peter. My development activities have tapered off significantly over the last few years, so I had never
    Message 1 of 13 , Sep 19, 2011
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      Please: None of this is directed at you personally, Peter.

      My development activities have tapered off significantly over the last few years, so I had never heard of WinRT. I took the time to research it, and as I understand it, it is an object-oriented replacement for Win32 for Windows 8. However, the key, at least according to the items that I read, is that applications written to Win32 will continue to work. Some new features will not be available, which might or might not be useful to the application or its users.

      I have two observations. One is just a rant: When I was more active in development, I was SO tired of Microsoft changing the "state of the art" technology, particularly for the UI. I know that WinRT will have some benefits, particularly for "sandboxing" applications, but how much can they expect from developers of existing software?

      Which leads to my second observation: It seems to me that Sangil Kim would have to do a major re-write of Edit Plus to use WinRT, which would require major debugging, which would impact him and all of his users. I paid him $30 years ago and have benefited from his efforts to improve Edit Plus ever since. He'd have to be crazy not to require a separate license for a WinRT version, and I'd have to be crazy to give up a stable Win32 version.

      --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com, Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@...> wrote:
      >
      > Hi!
      >
      > I have been reading much about Windows 8 and in particular WinRT. This has
      > led me to contemplate how this might effect the few software titles that I
      > absolutely rely upon.
      >
      > Given that EditPlus is very high on this short list it seems that a WinRT
      > compliant EditPlus would be really neat.
      >
      > Just the musings of a long-time and loyal user [?]
      >
      > Regards,
      > Peter
      > --
      > There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to conduct,
      > or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the introduction
      > of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
    • John Smith
      Or of course, he could rewrite for OSX. Which i and i know a lot of others have moved over too. And of course which i would willingly pay another 30$ for.
      Message 2 of 13 , Sep 19, 2011
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        Or of course, he could rewrite for OSX.
        Which i and i know a lot of others have moved over too.
        And of course which i would willingly pay another 30$ for.


        >
        >
        > Please: None of this is directed at you personally, Peter.
        >
        > My development activities have tapered off significantly over the last
        > few years, so I had never heard of WinRT. I took the time to research
        > it, and as I understand it, it is an object-oriented replacement for
        > Win32 for Windows 8. However, the key, at least according to the items
        > that I read, is that applications written to Win32 will continue to
        > work. Some new features will not be available, which might or might
        > not be useful to the application or its users.
        >
        > I have two observations. One is just a rant: When I was more active in
        > development, I was SO tired of Microsoft changing the "state of the
        > art" technology, particularly for the UI. I know that WinRT will have
        > some benefits, particularly for "sandboxing" applications, but how
        > much can they expect from developers of existing software?
        >
        > Which leads to my second observation: It seems to me that Sangil Kim
        > would have to do a major re-write of Edit Plus to use WinRT, which
        > would require major debugging, which would impact him and all of his
        > users. I paid him $30 years ago and have benefited from his efforts to
        > improve Edit Plus ever since. He'd have to be crazy not to require a
        > separate license for a WinRT version, and I'd have to be crazy to give
        > up a stable Win32 version.
        >
        > --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com <mailto:editplus%40yahoogroups.com>,
        > Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@...> wrote:
        > >
        > > Hi!
        > >
        > > I have been reading much about Windows 8 and in particular WinRT.
        > This has
        > > led me to contemplate how this might effect the few software titles
        > that I
        > > absolutely rely upon.
        > >
        > > Given that EditPlus is very high on this short list it seems that a
        > WinRT
        > > compliant EditPlus would be really neat.
        > >
        > > Just the musings of a long-time and loyal user [?]
        > >
        > > Regards,
        > > Peter
        > > --
        > > There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to
        > conduct,
        > > or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the
        > introduction
        > > of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6
        > >
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        >
        >
      • Peter Anderson
        mljones, No offense taken, I understand your views. I too have despaired at Microsoft s efforts over the years, I even tried Linux for a while. However, with
        Message 3 of 13 , Sep 19, 2011
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          mljones,

          No offense taken, I understand your views. I too have despaired at
          Microsoft's efforts over the years, I even tried Linux for a while. However,
          with Windows 7 and now with Windows 8 they really are getting their act
          together.

          One of the things that WinRT is supposed to do is bring single folder
          installs for applications - I take that to mean that the use of the Registry
          and the AppData folders for application configuration is dead (or at least
          on the way out). I have played with PC-BSD and it operates like this - its a
          real god-sent feature.

          On Windows 8; the use of HTML5 and JavaScript for the main UI is another
          very good step forward.

          My original post was more of a muse over what might happen. If Sangil wanted
          to charge for a WinRT version of EditPlus, I would gladly pay.

          Regards,
          Peter

          On 19 September 2011 23:53, mljones1947 <mljones1947@...> wrote:

          > **
          >
          >
          > Please: None of this is directed at you personally, Peter.
          >
          > My development activities have tapered off significantly over the last few
          > years, so I had never heard of WinRT. I took the time to research it, and as
          > I understand it, it is an object-oriented replacement for Win32 for Windows
          > 8. However, the key, at least according to the items that I read, is that
          > applications written to Win32 will continue to work. Some new features will
          > not be available, which might or might not be useful to the application or
          > its users.
          >
          > I have two observations. One is just a rant: When I was more active in
          > development, I was SO tired of Microsoft changing the "state of the art"
          > technology, particularly for the UI. I know that WinRT will have some
          > benefits, particularly for "sandboxing" applications, but how much can they
          > expect from developers of existing software?
          >
          > Which leads to my second observation: It seems to me that Sangil Kim would
          > have to do a major re-write of Edit Plus to use WinRT, which would require
          > major debugging, which would impact him and all of his users. I paid him $30
          > years ago and have benefited from his efforts to improve Edit Plus ever
          > since. He'd have to be crazy not to require a separate license for a WinRT
          > version, and I'd have to be crazy to give up a stable Win32 version.
          >
          >
          > --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com, Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@...>
          > wrote:
          > >
          > > Hi!
          > >
          > > I have been reading much about Windows 8 and in particular WinRT. This
          > has
          > > led me to contemplate how this might effect the few software titles that
          > I
          > > absolutely rely upon.
          > >
          > > Given that EditPlus is very high on this short list it seems that a WinRT
          > > compliant EditPlus would be really neat.
          > >
          > > Just the musings of a long-time and loyal user [?]
          > >
          > > Regards,
          > > Peter
          > > --
          > > There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to
          > conduct,
          > > or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the
          > introduction
          > > of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6
          > >
          > >
          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          > >
          >
          >
          >



          --
          There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to conduct,
          or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the introduction
          of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • mljones1947
          Again, nothing personal. Just my pathologically logical mind at work. Yes, I d pay for a separate license for OSX if I used OSX, but let s face it: The
          Message 4 of 13 , Sep 20, 2011
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            Again, nothing personal. Just my "pathologically logical" mind at work.

            Yes, I'd pay for a separate license for OSX if I used OSX, but let's face it: The market for Windows tools still dwarfs the market for OSX tools. You obviously know what editors are available for OSX, while I don't, but I have to wonder: Aren't there any OSX editors as good as Edit Plus available? If there aren't, why not? Market size? If there are, why haven't Edit Plus users made the switch?

            --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com, John Smith <john@...> wrote:
            >
            > Or of course, he could rewrite for OSX.
            > Which i and i know a lot of others have moved over too.
            > And of course which i would willingly pay another 30$ for.
            >
            >
            > >
            > >
            > > Please: None of this is directed at you personally, Peter.
            > >
            > > My development activities have tapered off significantly over the last
            > > few years, so I had never heard of WinRT. I took the time to research
            > > it, and as I understand it, it is an object-oriented replacement for
            > > Win32 for Windows 8. However, the key, at least according to the items
            > > that I read, is that applications written to Win32 will continue to
            > > work. Some new features will not be available, which might or might
            > > not be useful to the application or its users.
            > >
            > > I have two observations. One is just a rant: When I was more active in
            > > development, I was SO tired of Microsoft changing the "state of the
            > > art" technology, particularly for the UI. I know that WinRT will have
            > > some benefits, particularly for "sandboxing" applications, but how
            > > much can they expect from developers of existing software?
            > >
            > > Which leads to my second observation: It seems to me that Sangil Kim
            > > would have to do a major re-write of Edit Plus to use WinRT, which
            > > would require major debugging, which would impact him and all of his
            > > users. I paid him $30 years ago and have benefited from his efforts to
            > > improve Edit Plus ever since. He'd have to be crazy not to require a
            > > separate license for a WinRT version, and I'd have to be crazy to give
            > > up a stable Win32 version.
            > >
            > > --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com <mailto:editplus%40yahoogroups.com>,
            > > Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Hi!
            > > >
            > > > I have been reading much about Windows 8 and in particular WinRT.
            > > This has
            > > > led me to contemplate how this might effect the few software titles
            > > that I
            > > > absolutely rely upon.
            > > >
            > > > Given that EditPlus is very high on this short list it seems that a
            > > WinRT
            > > > compliant EditPlus would be really neat.
            > > >
            > > > Just the musings of a long-time and loyal user [?]
            > > >
            > > > Regards,
            > > > Peter
            > > > --
            > > > There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to
            > > conduct,
            > > > or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the
            > > introduction
            > > > of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > > >
            > >
            > >
            >
          • mljones1947
            I missed the no registry, single folder configuration feature of WinRT when I scanned for information about it. I agree that would be wonderful. The 1947 in
            Message 5 of 13 , Sep 20, 2011
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              I missed the no registry, single folder configuration feature of WinRT when I scanned for information about it. I agree that would be wonderful.

              The "1947" in my user ID is the year I was born. (You do the math.) I was around for the conversion from DOS to Windows and the birth of HTML and JavaScript. I used to think that you could never use HTML and JavaScript to make as rich a UI as other technologies, but I'm amazed at the functionality of Web applications today. And I certainly understand the portability advantage. So, I was wrong.

              I sure hope that better development and debugging tools are available for the current versions of HTML and JavaScript than when I was slogging through them. By the way, as much as I love Edit Plus, I don't think that it would be what I would expect for really heavy UI development.

              --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com, Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@...> wrote:
              >
              > mljones,
              >
              > No offense taken, I understand your views. I too have despaired at
              > Microsoft's efforts over the years, I even tried Linux for a while. However,
              > with Windows 7 and now with Windows 8 they really are getting their act
              > together.
              >
              > One of the things that WinRT is supposed to do is bring single folder
              > installs for applications - I take that to mean that the use of the Registry
              > and the AppData folders for application configuration is dead (or at least
              > on the way out). I have played with PC-BSD and it operates like this - its a
              > real god-sent feature.
              >
              > On Windows 8; the use of HTML5 and JavaScript for the main UI is another
              > very good step forward.
              >
              > My original post was more of a muse over what might happen. If Sangil wanted
              > to charge for a WinRT version of EditPlus, I would gladly pay.
              >
              > Regards,
              > Peter
              >
              > On 19 September 2011 23:53, mljones1947 <mljones1947@...> wrote:
              >
              > > **
              > >
              > >
              > > Please: None of this is directed at you personally, Peter.
              > >
              > > My development activities have tapered off significantly over the last few
              > > years, so I had never heard of WinRT. I took the time to research it, and as
              > > I understand it, it is an object-oriented replacement for Win32 for Windows
              > > 8. However, the key, at least according to the items that I read, is that
              > > applications written to Win32 will continue to work. Some new features will
              > > not be available, which might or might not be useful to the application or
              > > its users.
              > >
              > > I have two observations. One is just a rant: When I was more active in
              > > development, I was SO tired of Microsoft changing the "state of the art"
              > > technology, particularly for the UI. I know that WinRT will have some
              > > benefits, particularly for "sandboxing" applications, but how much can they
              > > expect from developers of existing software?
              > >
              > > Which leads to my second observation: It seems to me that Sangil Kim would
              > > have to do a major re-write of Edit Plus to use WinRT, which would require
              > > major debugging, which would impact him and all of his users. I paid him $30
              > > years ago and have benefited from his efforts to improve Edit Plus ever
              > > since. He'd have to be crazy not to require a separate license for a WinRT
              > > version, and I'd have to be crazy to give up a stable Win32 version.
              > >
              > >
              > > --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com, Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@>
              > > wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Hi!
              > > >
              > > > I have been reading much about Windows 8 and in particular WinRT. This
              > > has
              > > > led me to contemplate how this might effect the few software titles that
              > > I
              > > > absolutely rely upon.
              > > >
              > > > Given that EditPlus is very high on this short list it seems that a WinRT
              > > > compliant EditPlus would be really neat.
              > > >
              > > > Just the musings of a long-time and loyal user [?]
              > > >
              > > > Regards,
              > > > Peter
              > > > --
              > > > There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to
              > > conduct,
              > > > or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the
              > > introduction
              > > > of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              > --
              > There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to conduct,
              > or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the introduction
              > of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • Peter Jarosak
              If EditPlus were re-written to be HTML 5 and JavaScript, it would become OS independent as long as those standards are supported. There was a recent article
              Message 6 of 13 , Sep 20, 2011
              • 0 Attachment
                If EditPlus were re-written to be HTML 5 and JavaScript, it would become OS independent as long as those standards are supported.

                There was a recent article that I can't seem to find right now that allowed networking from a client side web app and there's been successful ports of Linux into JavaScript. Combining the two technologies together, there doesn't seem to be any limits of what could be done.

                Peter


                On Sep 20, 2011, at 10:50 AM, "mljones1947" <mljones1947@...> wrote:

                >
                >
                > I missed the no registry, single folder configuration feature of WinRT when I scanned for information about it. I agree that would be wonderful.
                >
                > The "1947" in my user ID is the year I was born. (You do the math.) I was around for the conversion from DOS to Windows and the birth of HTML and JavaScript. I used to think that you could never use HTML and JavaScript to make as rich a UI as other technologies, but I'm amazed at the functionality of Web applications today. And I certainly understand the portability advantage. So, I was wrong.
                >
                > I sure hope that better development and debugging tools are available for the current versions of HTML and JavaScript than when I was slogging through them. By the way, as much as I love Edit Plus, I don't think that it would be what I would expect for really heavy UI development.
                >
                > --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com, Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@...> wrote:
                > >
                > > mljones,
                > >
                > > No offense taken, I understand your views. I too have despaired at
                > > Microsoft's efforts over the years, I even tried Linux for a while. However,
                > > with Windows 7 and now with Windows 8 they really are getting their act
                > > together.
                > >
                > > One of the things that WinRT is supposed to do is bring single folder
                > > installs for applications - I take that to mean that the use of the Registry
                > > and the AppData folders for application configuration is dead (or at least
                > > on the way out). I have played with PC-BSD and it operates like this - its a
                > > real god-sent feature.
                > >
                > > On Windows 8; the use of HTML5 and JavaScript for the main UI is another
                > > very good step forward.
                > >
                > > My original post was more of a muse over what might happen. If Sangil wanted
                > > to charge for a WinRT version of EditPlus, I would gladly pay.
                > >
                > > Regards,
                > > Peter
                > >
                > > On 19 September 2011 23:53, mljones1947 <mljones1947@...> wrote:
                > >
                > > > **
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > Please: None of this is directed at you personally, Peter.
                > > >
                > > > My development activities have tapered off significantly over the last few
                > > > years, so I had never heard of WinRT. I took the time to research it, and as
                > > > I understand it, it is an object-oriented replacement for Win32 for Windows
                > > > 8. However, the key, at least according to the items that I read, is that
                > > > applications written to Win32 will continue to work. Some new features will
                > > > not be available, which might or might not be useful to the application or
                > > > its users.
                > > >
                > > > I have two observations. One is just a rant: When I was more active in
                > > > development, I was SO tired of Microsoft changing the "state of the art"
                > > > technology, particularly for the UI. I know that WinRT will have some
                > > > benefits, particularly for "sandboxing" applications, but how much can they
                > > > expect from developers of existing software?
                > > >
                > > > Which leads to my second observation: It seems to me that Sangil Kim would
                > > > have to do a major re-write of Edit Plus to use WinRT, which would require
                > > > major debugging, which would impact him and all of his users. I paid him $30
                > > > years ago and have benefited from his efforts to improve Edit Plus ever
                > > > since. He'd have to be crazy not to require a separate license for a WinRT
                > > > version, and I'd have to be crazy to give up a stable Win32 version.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com, Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@>
                > > > wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > Hi!
                > > > >
                > > > > I have been reading much about Windows 8 and in particular WinRT. This
                > > > has
                > > > > led me to contemplate how this might effect the few software titles that
                > > > I
                > > > > absolutely rely upon.
                > > > >
                > > > > Given that EditPlus is very high on this short list it seems that a WinRT
                > > > > compliant EditPlus would be really neat.
                > > > >
                > > > > Just the musings of a long-time and loyal user [?]
                > > > >
                > > > > Regards,
                > > > > Peter
                > > > > --
                > > > > There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to
                > > > conduct,
                > > > > or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the
                > > > introduction
                > > > > of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > --
                > > There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to conduct,
                > > or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the introduction
                > > of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6
                > >
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > >
                >
                >


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • DZ-Jay
                I seriously hope that doesn t happen. -- Sent remotely from my iPod; so igmore teh typpos, and don t hold your breath for a response. ... [Non-text portions of
                Message 7 of 13 , Sep 20, 2011
                • 0 Attachment
                  I seriously hope that doesn't happen.

                  --
                  Sent remotely from my iPod; so igmore teh typpos, and don't hold your breath for a response.


                  On Sep 20, 2011, at 13:40, Peter Jarosak <pjarosak@...> wrote:

                  > If EditPlus were re-written to be HTML 5 and JavaScript, it would become OS independent as long as those standards are supported.
                  >
                  > There was a recent article that I can't seem to find right now that allowed networking from a client side web app and there's been successful ports of Linux into JavaScript. Combining the two technologies together, there doesn't seem to be any limits of what could be done.
                  >
                  > Peter
                  >
                  > On Sep 20, 2011, at 10:50 AM, "mljones1947" <mljones1947@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > I missed the no registry, single folder configuration feature of WinRT when I scanned for information about it. I agree that would be wonderful.
                  > >
                  > > The "1947" in my user ID is the year I was born. (You do the math.) I was around for the conversion from DOS to Windows and the birth of HTML and JavaScript. I used to think that you could never use HTML and JavaScript to make as rich a UI as other technologies, but I'm amazed at the functionality of Web applications today. And I certainly understand the portability advantage. So, I was wrong.
                  > >
                  > > I sure hope that better development and debugging tools are available for the current versions of HTML and JavaScript than when I was slogging through them. By the way, as much as I love Edit Plus, I don't think that it would be what I would expect for really heavy UI development.
                  > >
                  > > --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com, Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@...> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > mljones,
                  > > >
                  > > > No offense taken, I understand your views. I too have despaired at
                  > > > Microsoft's efforts over the years, I even tried Linux for a while. However,
                  > > > with Windows 7 and now with Windows 8 they really are getting their act
                  > > > together.
                  > > >
                  > > > One of the things that WinRT is supposed to do is bring single folder
                  > > > installs for applications - I take that to mean that the use of the Registry
                  > > > and the AppData folders for application configuration is dead (or at least
                  > > > on the way out). I have played with PC-BSD and it operates like this - its a
                  > > > real god-sent feature.
                  > > >
                  > > > On Windows 8; the use of HTML5 and JavaScript for the main UI is another
                  > > > very good step forward.
                  > > >
                  > > > My original post was more of a muse over what might happen. If Sangil wanted
                  > > > to charge for a WinRT version of EditPlus, I would gladly pay.
                  > > >
                  > > > Regards,
                  > > > Peter
                  > > >
                  > > > On 19 September 2011 23:53, mljones1947 <mljones1947@...> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > > **
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Please: None of this is directed at you personally, Peter.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > My development activities have tapered off significantly over the last few
                  > > > > years, so I had never heard of WinRT. I took the time to research it, and as
                  > > > > I understand it, it is an object-oriented replacement for Win32 for Windows
                  > > > > 8. However, the key, at least according to the items that I read, is that
                  > > > > applications written to Win32 will continue to work. Some new features will
                  > > > > not be available, which might or might not be useful to the application or
                  > > > > its users.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > I have two observations. One is just a rant: When I was more active in
                  > > > > development, I was SO tired of Microsoft changing the "state of the art"
                  > > > > technology, particularly for the UI. I know that WinRT will have some
                  > > > > benefits, particularly for "sandboxing" applications, but how much can they
                  > > > > expect from developers of existing software?
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Which leads to my second observation: It seems to me that Sangil Kim would
                  > > > > have to do a major re-write of Edit Plus to use WinRT, which would require
                  > > > > major debugging, which would impact him and all of his users. I paid him $30
                  > > > > years ago and have benefited from his efforts to improve Edit Plus ever
                  > > > > since. He'd have to be crazy not to require a separate license for a WinRT
                  > > > > version, and I'd have to be crazy to give up a stable Win32 version.
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > --- In editplus@yahoogroups.com, Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@>
                  > > > > wrote:
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Hi!
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > I have been reading much about Windows 8 and in particular WinRT. This
                  > > > > has
                  > > > > > led me to contemplate how this might effect the few software titles that
                  > > > > I
                  > > > > > absolutely rely upon.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Given that EditPlus is very high on this short list it seems that a WinRT
                  > > > > > compliant EditPlus would be really neat.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Just the musings of a long-time and loyal user [?]
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Regards,
                  > > > > > Peter
                  > > > > > --
                  > > > > > There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to
                  > > > > conduct,
                  > > > > > or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the
                  > > > > introduction
                  > > > > > of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  > > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > --
                  > > > There is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to conduct,
                  > > > or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the introduction
                  > > > of a new order of things -- Niccolo Machiavelli, *The Prince*, ch. 6
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Peter Anderson
                  Peter, Its my understanding that its mainly the UI bits that are written in HTML5 and javaScript. Though there is no reason why it could not be more of an
                  Message 8 of 13 , Sep 20, 2011
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                    Peter,

                    Its my understanding that its mainly the UI bits that are written in HTML5
                    and javaScript. Though there is no reason why it could not be more of an
                    application.

                    My original interest in WinRT was its ability to circumvent the use of the
                    registry and the AppData directories. It is a concept similar to PC-BSD's
                    PBI application installer where each application is stored in its own
                    directory. Where there are dependencies on specific shared libraries then
                    those libraries are installed with the application. Some say this is
                    wasteful of hard disk space but in this age of multi-terabyte drives that's
                    an argument that no longer has any validity.

                    Windows 8 also brings the "Metro" user interface, it will be interesting to
                    see how many non-Microsoft applications pick up on this feature - only the
                    progressive ones I will bet. As an EditPlus "fan boy" (Yuk! what an awful
                    thing to say!) I would hope my editor of choice is in the progressive camp.

                    Speaking of editors of choice; I can't help trying out new and old text
                    editors (though at the end of the day I still use EditPlus for "real" work).
                    One I have been playing with recently was Rapid PHP - it has a really nice
                    clip library feature which is more extensive and more efficient to use than
                    our ClipLibs. It stores the clips in an XML file and has substitution place
                    holders withing the clip so for example you can write one clip for say HTML
                    <H?> elements and the clip displays a dialog to let you choose the variant
                    of the heading you require. It also allows you to store clips in hierarchies
                    of folders so you don't end up with a very long line of clips down the side
                    of your screen (not such an issue on my 1920x1200 desktop monitor but a real
                    pain on my 1024x600 netbook's monitor). Rapid PHP has a whole lot of other
                    problems that make it inferior to our editor but the clip library feature IS
                    better.

                    Enough rambling.

                    Regards,
                    Peter Anderson

                    On 21 September 2011 03:40, Peter Jarosak <pjarosak@...> wrote:

                    > **
                    >
                    >
                    > If EditPlus were re-written to be HTML 5 and JavaScript, it would become OS
                    > independent as long as those standards are supported.
                    >
                    > There was a recent article that I can't seem to find right now that allowed
                    > networking from a client side web app and there's been successful ports of
                    > Linux into JavaScript. Combining the two technologies together, there
                    > doesn't seem to be any limits of what could be done.
                    >
                    > Peter
                    >


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Peter Jarosak
                    You re right that historically it s used for UI. With computers being what they are, the direction all the big companies are pushing for cloud and cool
                    Message 9 of 13 , Sep 20, 2011
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                      You're right that historically it's used for UI. With computers being what
                      they are, the direction all the big companies are pushing for cloud and cool
                      technologies like this, it'll only be a matter of time.

                      http://bellard.org/jslinux/ - Linux in JavaScript - Uses the clipboard for
                      interaction
                      http://nodejs.org/ - This allows for server side asynchronous events.

                      Now if I could get EditPlus to look like this, http://www.coderun.com/, I'd
                      be willing to pay a premium to have it all my environments and always
                      available on any computer that has Internet access.

                      I'm excited to see what other ideas come out of the cloud.

                      About the WinRT, it'll be nice that there's a Microsoft way to develop an
                      application that is all in one directory and will hopefully be usable from a
                      USB drive. I'm also hoping WinSXS design will improve. It's still terribly
                      confusing and misleading.

                      Peter

                      On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 6:48 PM, Peter Anderson <peterjohnanderson@...
                      > wrote:

                      > **
                      >
                      >
                      > Peter,
                      >
                      > Its my understanding that its mainly the UI bits that are written in HTML5
                      > and javaScript. Though there is no reason why it could not be more of an
                      > application.
                      >
                      > My original interest in WinRT was its ability to circumvent the use of the
                      > registry and the AppData directories. It is a concept similar to PC-BSD's
                      > PBI application installer where each application is stored in its own
                      > directory. Where there are dependencies on specific shared libraries then
                      > those libraries are installed with the application. Some say this is
                      > wasteful of hard disk space but in this age of multi-terabyte drives that's
                      > an argument that no longer has any validity.
                      >
                      > Windows 8 also brings the "Metro" user interface, it will be interesting to
                      > see how many non-Microsoft applications pick up on this feature - only the
                      > progressive ones I will bet. As an EditPlus "fan boy" (Yuk! what an awful
                      > thing to say!) I would hope my editor of choice is in the progressive camp.
                      >
                      > Speaking of editors of choice; I can't help trying out new and old text
                      > editors (though at the end of the day I still use EditPlus for "real"
                      > work).
                      > One I have been playing with recently was Rapid PHP - it has a really nice
                      > clip library feature which is more extensive and more efficient to use than
                      > our ClipLibs. It stores the clips in an XML file and has substitution place
                      > holders withing the clip so for example you can write one clip for say HTML
                      > <H?> elements and the clip displays a dialog to let you choose the variant
                      > of the heading you require. It also allows you to store clips in
                      > hierarchies
                      > of folders so you don't end up with a very long line of clips down the side
                      > of your screen (not such an issue on my 1920x1200 desktop monitor but a
                      > real
                      > pain on my 1024x600 netbook's monitor). Rapid PHP has a whole lot of other
                      > problems that make it inferior to our editor but the clip library feature
                      > IS
                      > better.
                      >
                      > Enough rambling.
                      >
                      > Regards,
                      > Peter Anderson
                      >
                      > On 21 September 2011 03:40, Peter Jarosak <pjarosak@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > > **
                      >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > If EditPlus were re-written to be HTML 5 and JavaScript, it would become
                      > OS
                      > > independent as long as those standards are supported.
                      > >
                      > > There was a recent article that I can't seem to find right now that
                      > allowed
                      > > networking from a client side web app and there's been successful ports
                      > of
                      > > Linux into JavaScript. Combining the two technologies together, there
                      > > doesn't seem to be any limits of what could be done.
                      > >
                      > > Peter
                      > >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      >
                      >


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Stitch
                      ... Rather interesting to see them moving back towards the way OS/2 was (which, btw, is at the heart of Windows versions going back to 3.1). Dave
                      Message 10 of 13 , Sep 21, 2011
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                        On Tuesday, September 20, 2011 at 10:56 PM you wrote:

                        > About the WinRT, it'll be nice that there's a Microsoft way to
                        > develop an application that is all in one directory and will
                        > hopefully be usable from a USB drive.

                        Rather interesting to see them moving back towards the way OS/2 was
                        (which, btw, is at the heart of Windows versions going back to 3.1).

                        Dave
                      • Brett Patterson
                        Just for giggles... http://www.geeksaresexy.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/windows.jpg -- Brett Patterson ... [Non-text portions of this message have been
                        Message 11 of 13 , Sep 21, 2011
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                          Just for giggles...

                          http://www.geeksaresexy.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/windows.jpg

                          --
                          Brett Patterson



                          On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 4:51 AM, Stitch <stitched@...> wrote:

                          > **
                          >
                          >
                          > On Tuesday, September 20, 2011 at 10:56 PM you wrote:
                          >
                          > > About the WinRT, it'll be nice that there's a Microsoft way to
                          > > develop an application that is all in one directory and will
                          > > hopefully be usable from a USB drive.
                          >
                          > Rather interesting to see them moving back towards the way OS/2 was
                          > (which, btw, is at the heart of Windows versions going back to 3.1).
                          >
                          > Dave
                          >
                          >
                          >


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • John Smith
                          And following up, on my previous point...... And most of my developer friends agree on that point. Last conference I went to, 80% of the attendees had Macs.
                          Message 12 of 13 , Sep 21, 2011
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                            And following up, on my previous point......

                            And most of my developer friends agree on that point. Last conference I
                            went to, 80% of the attendees had Macs. Half of those do Windows
                            development on them. I run Linux and Windows 7 in the background while
                            I work on the Mac. Doing that on a Windows machine makes it want to
                            roll up into a ball and cry like a baby. I can’t take changing your
                            diapers anymore.

                            Here's the rest of the article which i did not write but do agree with

                            http://www.lessonsoffailure.com/uncategorized/dear-microsoft/


                            >
                            >
                            > Just for giggles...
                            >
                            > http://www.geeksaresexy.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/windows.jpg
                            >
                            > --
                            > Brett Patterson
                            >
                            > On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 4:51 AM, Stitch <stitched@...
                            > <mailto:stitched%40mindspring.com>> wrote:
                            >
                            > > **
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > On Tuesday, September 20, 2011 at 10:56 PM you wrote:
                            > >
                            > > > About the WinRT, it'll be nice that there's a Microsoft way to
                            > > > develop an application that is all in one directory and will
                            > > > hopefully be usable from a USB drive.
                            > >
                            > > Rather interesting to see them moving back towards the way OS/2 was
                            > > (which, btw, is at the heart of Windows versions going back to 3.1).
                            > >
                            > > Dave
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >
                            >
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