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Re: Who is to blame ?

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  • prometheus_973
    Hello Harrison and All, I really think that Gail Twitchell should be blamed as well as Paul, Darwin, and Klemp! Gail inspired and encouraged Paul to start
    Message 1 of 10 , Aug 11, 2009
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      Hello Harrison and All,
      I really think that Gail Twitchell should
      be blamed as well as Paul, Darwin, and
      Klemp!

      Gail inspired and encouraged Paul to
      start Eckankar. She was his secretary
      and coconspirator, and gave talks promoting
      him and his scam. She was not as innocent
      as she appeared... if anything she was
      as much to blame as Paul.

      Then, Gail helped Darwin to get seated
      in Paul's place in order to continue the
      fraud after Paul died. She had set her sights
      on Darwin (not vice versa) and he helped
      her to continue her vitamin business and,
      eventually, paid her $500,000 for Paul's
      EK copyrights.

      However, Klemp is the worst of all as he
      took/takes the (false) and altered Eastern
      teachings of a Ruhani Satsang sect (Eckankar)
      for 28 years in a more "Christian" direction.
      Then again, Klemp was a Lutheran seminary
      student and graduate so he's going with
      what he "knows" best. But, HK's holier than
      thou attitude Should Not be tolerated, any
      longer, by EK H.I.s! Klemp can never be
      forgiven (and certainly should not be followed)
      even if he did, by some miracle, confess
      his sins!


      Prometheus


      Harrison wrote:

      This is a sad, sad argument that does
      not hold water. When you are fooled into
      something because you are told it is real,
      then is it really your fault completely? No.
      Blaming the victim is an easy out. Too
      many eckists have very low self esteem.
      They are quick to accept that they are
      responsible for all their ills. This gives
      con artists like klemp and twitchell a quick
      road into your wallet, your mind and your
      life.

      And, of your "experiences," there are more
      viable explanations as to what these actually
      are than the stupid, ill-conceived, idiotic,
      ignorant explanations that eckankar comes
      up with.

      In short: Is klemp to blame? Damn right
      he is. He's as guilty as any other liar and
      con artist. He's a criminal, pure and simple,
      taking money on false pretenses, pretending
      to be something he is not and selling you
      manure while telling you it's gold. You can
      blame yourself, but I'm done beating myself
      up and accepting the role as victim. I suppose
      you'd also say that the victim of domestic
      abuse is guilty because she got married one
      day to the abuser who posed as a really nice
      guy.

      Okay, then, enjoy your delusions.


      nimmy wrote:

      "I choose to follow eckankar. Since GOD
      is universal than the teachings about
      GOD are probably plagiarized from everyone
      over the ages that follow GOD."


      P- However, Eckankar teaches that this
      "Universal God" is the KAL (Satan, Devil).


      nimny:
      "So who the hell cares? Since I choose to
      follow this path , it is my responsibility to
      know what I am doing."


      P- Actually, Eckankar is a "religion" and
      not a "path." Klemp titled it "Eckankar,
      RELIGION of the Light & Sound of God"
      and NOT "Eckankar, PATH of the Light
      & Sound of God." I wonder why he uses
      the term "God" instead of 'SUGMAD?"
      Is HK embarrassed to use Sugmad vs
      God, or is he trying to trick newcomers?
      And, if HK was really honest he'd let his
      followers know that Eckankar is a sect
      of Ruhani Satsang and that Kirpal Singh
      was Paul's real master from 1955-1965!


      ninny:
      "So do I see the experiences as I had
      as a student, chela, with eckanker,
      are false because I followed a cult,
      I am not sure that is the point. Are
      the experiences I had only based on
      my involvement with a cult ? It is all
      because I was brainwashed?"


      P- I had experiences prior to Eckankar,
      during Eckankar, and even more a better
      ones AFTER Eckankar. Thus, it wasn't
      Eckankar! However, most Eckists don't
      have much experience with dreams, the
      phenomenal, prophecy, inner healings,
      visitations, Soul travel etc. prior to EK,
      thus, Eckankar gets the credit when chelas
      alter their thoughts, and focus upon these
      subjects.


      ninny: "Maybe I am as brainwashed
      as the "founders" of Eckanker."


      P- Does that mean you're as dishonest too?


      ninny: "Paul started a mailing list , not
      because he was worried about people
      finding GOD but because he could make
      money from people seeking GOD."


      P- I agree!


      ninny: "Maybe. He showed in all his
      plagiarist glory how people were seeking
      GOD, and streamlined the whole process
      into a new religion, Eckankar."


      P- Twit only "streamlined" Ruhani Satsang
      (for the Western mindset) by eliminating
      chastity (the virtue for lust) and the Vegan
      lifestyle.


      ninny: "My point is that no one was forced
      into Eckankar, no one was held against
      their will to stay in Eckankar, and even
      though Eckankar is a cult, it did have
      a reason that people followed it, and
      it was not a living Eck master it was
      about GOD . Not sure about any of you,
      I was looking for GOD when I found
      Eckankar."


      P- I agree that people weren't forced
      to join, but they lied about or omitted
      telling us about soooooo many things
      including what would happen to us if
      we changed our minds after the second
      initiation... Astral hells!

      Klemp made, what seemed at the time,
      some necessary changes with how the
      org was run. Darwin had the local areas
      screwed up. However, HK was about
      20 years too late with his H.I. Leadership
      book.... so much for being a "Modern
      Prophet!" And, Klemp never followed-up
      on his own advice.

      Klemp has taken advantage of his "Mahanta"
      title and the power and delusion that goes
      with it.... go to the "inner!" Also, look at all
      of the volunteering (service) that one has
      to do in order to get promoted, and how
      much emphasis is put on becoming a H.I.
      and maintaining a current annual membership
      ($$$) or else one loses those outer and inner
      initiations. I can see why the LEM believes
      in "no free lunch" but why should that affect
      the Mahanta and "inner initiations?" Why would/
      should a Higher Initiate lose "inner initiations"
      when an "outer" donation fee isn't paid? There
      are more Catch-22s with Klemp's Eckankar
      as he remains in power and becomes more
      "Christian" like with his delusions! For most
      Eckists "it's as above, so below" with their
      delusions.
    • al_radzik
      ... Not sure about any of you , I was looking for GOD when I found Eckankar. ... Eckankar is a lie factory designed to deceive gullible God seekers such as
      Message 2 of 10 , Aug 18, 2009
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        --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "nimmy45440" <c.2nd@...> wrote:
        >
        Not sure about any of you , I was looking for GOD when I found Eckankar.
        >
        Eckankar is a lie factory designed to deceive gullible God seekers such as yourself into believing it is a religion above ALL religions. It claims to have existed since the beginning of time however there is not one shred of historical evidence of Eckankar or its past masters before 1965. It has been sufficiently debunked several years ago and its current followers are just a dwindling and drooling cadre of cosmic zombies.

        Alf
      • harrisonferrel
        I love Alf s imagery. No matter how you look at this thing, Eckankar is a stupid hoax perpetuated by mindless, dull and senseless characters. Yes, Alf, it was
        Message 3 of 10 , Aug 19, 2009
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          I love Alf's imagery.

          No matter how you look at this thing, Eckankar is a stupid hoax perpetuated by mindless, dull and senseless characters. Yes, Alf, it was debunked. Those of us who are long out of this group still shake our heads and wonder what kind of thick-headed person would hold onto lies, or worse, ignore them.



          --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, al_radzik <no_reply@...> wrote:
          >
          > --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "nimmy45440" <c.2nd@> wrote:
          > >
          > Not sure about any of you , I was looking for GOD when I found Eckankar.
          > >
          > Eckankar is a lie factory designed to deceive gullible God seekers such as yourself into believing it is a religion above ALL religions. It claims to have existed since the beginning of time however there is not one shred of historical evidence of Eckankar or its past masters before 1965. It has been sufficiently debunked several years ago and its current followers are just a dwindling and drooling cadre of cosmic zombies.
          >
          > Alf
          >
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