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  • Sharon
    Welcome, Queen! You ve probably noticed there s not much activity here anymore. I m sure everyone s like me, just happily enjoying life out of ekult and not
    Message 1 of 7 , Jun 27, 2008
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      Welcome, Queen!

      You've probably noticed there's not much activity here anymore. I'm
      sure everyone's like me, just happily enjoying life out of ekult and
      not that interested anymore. I think I've said/typed just about
      everything I can think of, multiple times. And I'm sure other
      previously prolific posters feel the same.

      Not sure about everyone else, but I know I'm certainly
      not "searching" anymore. I'm quite content *not* "knowing" and just
      lightly speculating on an infinite number of interesting
      possibilities.

      Anyway, while I'm here, someone sent me this link recently:
      http://www.underground-railroad.biz/psychicenergytransfer.html

      I think the bit at the end about parasitic "masters" is *so* true,
      I've come to believe most definitely that ekult's true nature is
      dark and evil, like a big nasty astral beast sucking the genuine
      energies from its befogged members, and giving back the illusion of
      inflow of "Spirit".

      And, right down below is an excerpt from Peter McWilliams' "Life
      102: What To Do When Your Guru Sues You". This passage does an
      excellent job of telling what ekult & all those other groups do.

      Gotta go, have a great day, everyone!!

      Hugs,

      Sharon

      From Peter McWilliams' "Life 102, What to do when your guru sues you"

      As I previously mentioned, one is encouraged to fall asleep while
      listening to John-Roger's seminars. One is also encouraged to play a
      seminar tape at bedtime while going to sleep. All of this allows for
      more successful "soul travel"--and, of course, more successful
      subliminal programming.

      John-Roger is well aware of this: "While your conscious mind is at
      rest,
      during the sleep state;" he writes in the MSIA Handbook for
      Ministers of
      Light, "it will not question or block the spiritual action." The
      conscious mind "will not question or block" John-Roger's
      programming,
      either.

      When one is consciously listening to his seminar, one is encouraged
      to
      "ignore" all the things that "don't apply to you" and look only for
      the
      "minute or two" during an hour-long seminar that is the message "the
      Traveler specifically has for you." All the other information
      was "for
      somebody else," and should be disregarded. Disregarded, perhaps--but
      the
      information enters the subconscious nonetheless.

      And then there are spiritual exercises. Everyone is
      encouraged--strongly--to do two hours each day of spiritual
      exercises
      (or "s.e.'s"). For two hours, with your eyes closed, you think about
      guess what? Yes: John-Roger. He suggests that you "mock up" his
      image in
      your mind. He suggests that you visualize purple light: the color of
      the
      Traveler. The only time it's okay to open your eyes is to gaze
      lovingly
      at a photograph or painting of him. You can also "chant the sacred
      names
      of God"--gods who are all, you are continually reminded, far
      inferior to
      John-Roger. You can also play meditation tapes, which feature
      John-Roger's voice telling you, essentially, that you should feel
      absolutely terrific because, after all, you were clever enough and
      fortunate enough to discover John-Roger.

      Seminars, combined with Discourses, the worshipful way in which
      John-Roger is treated by believers, the rumors of miracle heaof
      miracle
      healings (the far longer list of failed healings is never
      mentioned),
      John-Roger's demonstrations of his psychic powers (usually
      information
      he gathered surreptitiously combined with a crystal-ball-gazer's
      knack
      of throwing out generalities until the person being "read" awe-fully
      supplies the specific information)--all goes in, seminar after
      seminar,
      Discourse after Discourse, retreat after retreat, year after year.
      (Workshops such as Insight or MSIA retreats can shorten the
      programming
      time c

      At a certain instant, it all comes together. It does not gel or
      harden;
      it crystallizes--one moment it's not together, the next moment it
      is.
      One moment John-Roger is an occasionally interesting guy. The next
      minute he's God. Because it's been planted in your subconscious, the
      realization: "John-Roger is IT!" seems to come from within you. It
      is
      your realization. You had this breakthrough. "Nobody put me up to
      this;
      I discovered it on my own."


      The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie deliberate,
      contrived, and dishonest but the myth persistent, persuasive, and
      unrealistic.
      JOHN F. KENNEDY




      Eureka! All problems are solved. From maternity through senility to
      eternity, J-R is there and will help you--personally--every step of
      the
      way.Footsteps in the Sand, in which the disciple looks back on his
      life
      and notices that when times were easy, there were two pair of
      footsteps
      in the sand and when times were difficult, there was only one pair
      of
      footsteps in the sand. "Why, during the hard parts of my life, did
      you
      desert me?" the seeker asks his master. "I did not desert you," the
      master answers, "Those were the times I carried you." With stories
      such
      as this, John-Roger moves from programming to seduction.> "The
      Mystical
      Traveler will play all the roles in your life" John-Roger proclaims
      in a
      meditation. John-Roger was there at our conception, our birth when
      he
      "pushed us into the body," never leaves us (it is our lack of
      perception, not his lack of presence that causes us to be unaware of
      him), and will be there to "take you from the body" at the moment of
      your death. Conception to crematorium--what service.

      And that's how it works. From that point on, you're hooked. It would
      take a great deal of counterprogramming to unhook you. But that's
      not
      likely to happen. Now that you know that John-Roger is God, and you
      know
      you came to this conclusion on your own, then you willingly take
      part--even seek--more intense, more extreme, more devotional
      programming.

      Just to make sure that no counterprogramming accidentally sneaks in,
      one
      is encouraged to leave behind non-believing friends, husbands,
      wives,
      children, parents, bosses, employees, and anyone else. You are
      encouraged to "chant the names of God"--or chant the name J-R or
      John-Roger--no matter what else you're doing. The exploration of
      other
      groups or practices is severely frowned upon. Recreational
      activities
      such as reading books or watching television are considered
      frivolous.
      "Don't turn on the TVs until you've done your two hours of s.e.'s"
      is a
      common message. As one Devoted to the Light, one should be doing
      significant things: listening to seminar tapes, reading Discourses,
      s.e.'s, and service. And whom does one serve? The Traveler, of
      course.
      How does one serve the Traveler? Either volunteer for one of
      John-Roger's organizations, or go out and make some money and donate
      it
      to one of John-Roger's organizations.


      One should always be wary of someone who promises that their love
      will
      last longer than a weekend.
      QUENTIN CRISP




      All achievements, successes, and personal gains in a devotee's life
      are
      to be attributed to John-Roger. People who took credit for anything
      personally were accused of egocentricity, materialism, and pride.
      The
      teachings of the Movement are clear: the bad in your life is your
      fault,
      the good in your life is John-Roger's gift.

      Over time, most of your friends are Movement friends; your romantic
      relationships are with Movement people (or people who show a strong
      leaning toward the Movement); much of your business is done with
      people
      in the Movement and; beyond your basic needs, all your money is
      spent on
      Movement activities.

      -------------------------------------------------







      As I previously mentioned, one is encouraged to fall asleep while
      listening to John-Roger's seminars. One is also encouraged to play a
      seminar tape at bedtime while going to sleep. All of this allows for
      more successful "soul travel"--and, of course, more successful
      subliminal programming.

      John-Roger is well aware of this: "While your conscious mind is at
      rest,
      during the sleep state;" he writes in the MSIA Handbook for
      Ministers of
      Light, "it will not question or block the spiritual action." The
      conscious mind "will not question or block" John-Roger's
      programming,
      either.

      When one is consciously listening to his seminar, one is encouraged
      to
      "ignore" all the things that "don't apply to you" and look only for
      the
      "minute or two" during an hour-long seminar that is the message "the
      Traveler specifically has for you." All the other information
      was "for
      somebody else," and should be disregarded. Disregarded, perhaps--but
      the
      information enters the subconscious nonetheless.

      And then there are spiritual exercises. Everyone is
      encouraged--strongly--to do two hours each day of spiritual
      exercises
      (or "s.e.'s"). For two hours, with your eyes closed, you think about
      guess what? Yes: John-Roger. He suggests that you "mock up" his
      image in
      your mind. He suggests that you visualize purple light: the color of
      the
      Traveler. The only time it's okay to open your eyes is to gaze
      lovingly
      at a photograph or painting of him. You can also "chant the sacred
      names
      of God"--gods who are all, you are continually reminded, far
      inferior to
      John-Roger. You can also play meditation tapes, which feature
      John-Roger's voice telling you, essentially, that you should feel
      absolutely terrific because, after all, you were clever enough and
      fortunate enough to discover John-Roger.

      Seminars, combined with Discourses, the worshipful way in which
      John-Roger is treated by believers, the rumors of miracle heaof
      miracle
      healings (the far longer list of failed healings is never
      mentioned),
      John-Roger's demonstrations of his psychic powers (usually
      information
      he gathered surreptitiously combined with a crystal-ball-gazer's
      knack
      of throwing out generalities until the person being "read" awe-fully
      supplies the specific information)--all goes in, seminar after
      seminar,
      Discourse after Discourse, retreat after retreat, year after year.
      (Workshops such as Insight or MSIA retreats can shorten the
      programming
      time c

      At a certain instant, it all comes together. It does not gel or
      harden;
      it crystallizes--one moment it's not together, the next moment it
      is.
      One moment John-Roger is an occasionally interesting guy. The next
      minute he's God. Because it's been planted in your subconscious, the
      realization: "John-Roger is IT!" seems to come from within you. It
      is
      your realization. You had this breakthrough. "Nobody put me up to
      this;
      I discovered it on my own."


      The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie deliberate,
      contrived, and dishonest but the myth persistent, persuasive, and
      unrealistic.
      JOHN F. KENNEDY




      Eureka! All problems are solved. From maternity through senility to
      eternity, J-R is there and will help you--personally--every step of
      the
      way.Footsteps in the Sand, in which the disciple looks back on his
      life
      and notices that when times were easy, there were two pair of
      footsteps
      in the sand and when times were difficult, there was only one pair
      of
      footsteps in the sand. "Why, during the hard parts of my life, did
      you
      desert me?" the seeker asks his master. "I did not desert you," the
      master answers, "Those were the times I carried you." With stories
      such
      as this, John-Roger moves from programming to seduction.> "The
      Mystical
      Traveler will play all the roles in your life" John-Roger proclaims
      in a
      meditation. John-Roger was there at our conception, our birth when
      he
      "pushed us into the body," never leaves us (it is our lack of
      perception, not his lack of presence that causes us to be unaware of
      him), and will be there to "take you from the body" at the moment of
      your death. Conception to crematorium--what service.

      And that's how it works. From that point on, you're hooked. It would
      take a great deal of counterprogramming to unhook you. But that's
      not
      likely to happen. Now that you know that John-Roger is God, and you
      know
      you came to this conclusion on your own, then you willingly take
      part--even seek--more intense, more extreme, more devotional
      programming.

      Just to make sure that no counterprogramming accidentally sneaks in,
      one
      is encouraged to leave behind non-believing friends, husbands,
      wives,
      children, parents, bosses, employees, and anyone else. You are
      encouraged to "chant the names of God"--or chant the name J-R or
      John-Roger--no matter what else you're doing. The exploration of
      other
      groups or practices is severely frowned upon. Recreational
      activities
      such as reading books or watching television are considered
      frivolous.
      "Don't turn on the TVs until you've done your two hours of s.e.'s"
      is a
      common message. As one Devoted to the Light, one should be doing
      significant things: listening to seminar tapes, reading Discourses,
      s.e.'s, and service. And whom does one serve? The Traveler, of
      course.
      How does one serve the Traveler? Either volunteer for one of
      John-Roger's organizations, or go out and make some money and donate
      it
      to one of John-Roger's organizations.


      One should always be wary of someone who promises that their love
      will
      last longer than a weekend.
      QUENTIN CRISP




      All achievements, successes, and personal gains in a devotee's life
      are
      to be attributed to John-Roger. People who took credit for anything
      personally were accused of egocentricity, materialism, and pride.
      The
      teachings of the Movement are clear: the bad in your life is your
      fault,
      the good in your life is John-Roger's gift.

      Over time, most of your friends are Movement friends; your romantic
      relationships are with Movement people (or people who show a strong
      leaning toward the Movement); much of your business is done with
      people
      in the Movement and; beyond your basic needs, all your money is
      spent on
      Movement activities.








      --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "queenrendek"
      <queenrendek@...> wrote:
      >
      > Hi,
      > I was a member of Eckankar for quite a few years in the 70's and
      80's
      > when Darwin was there and after. It was a long time ago but it
      still
      > comes to mind. I believe I joined because I had friends who were
      > members and was searching all my life for a so called "path". I
      went
      > to classes when they had a center in Eagle Rock. The Lavaneri's
      were
      > very active there and I attended meetings that they lead. I even
      set
      > up a little seminar in my own town. I also went to several out of
      town
      > seminars with friends to Las Vegas, Sacramento, Phoenix and
      others.
      > I wanted to belong because I was always searching for a "path" and
      I
      > had friends who were Eckists and they were very convincing. The
      whole
      > experience was not bad really, but I never really "embraced" it,
      > although I think I wanted to.
      >
      > This list appeals to me because I am still "searching" for
      something
      > and maybe I could get further insights from the discussions.
      >
      > Thanks
      > queenrendek
      >
    • Tritum
      hello all. I just created an Eckankar ning group. eckankar.ning.com I could use some help getting it filled with content. (Note from Sharon: I added this
      Message 2 of 7 , Jul 7, 2008
      • 0 Attachment
        hello all. I just created an Eckankar ning group.

        eckankar.ning.com

        I could use some help getting it filled with content.


        (Note from Sharon: I added this comment before "approving" this new member's post, and popped over to upload the video where hopefully many people will see it!! <gg>)

        --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "Sharon" <brighttigress@...> wrote:
        >
        > Welcome, Queen!
        >
        > You've probably noticed there's not much activity here anymore. I'm
        > sure everyone's like me, just happily enjoying life out of ekult and
        > not that interested anymore. I think I've said/typed just about
        > everything I can think of, multiple times. And I'm sure other
        > previously prolific posters feel the same.
        >
        > Not sure about everyone else, but I know I'm certainly
        > not "searching" anymore. I'm quite content *not* "knowing" and just
        > lightly speculating on an infinite number of interesting
        > possibilities.
        >
        > Anyway, while I'm here, someone sent me this link recently:
        > http://www.underground-railroad.biz/psychicenergytransfer.html
        >
        > I think the bit at the end about parasitic "masters" is *so* true,
        > I've come to believe most definitely that ekult's true nature is
        > dark and evil, like a big nasty astral beast sucking the genuine
        > energies from its befogged members, and giving back the illusion of
        > inflow of "Spirit".
        >
        > And, right down below is an excerpt from Peter McWilliams' "Life
        > 102: What To Do When Your Guru Sues You". This passage does an
        > excellent job of telling what ekult & all those other groups do.
        >
        > Gotta go, have a great day, everyone!!
        >
        > Hugs,
        >
        > Sharon
        >
        > From Peter McWilliams' "Life 102, What to do when your guru sues you"
        >
        > As I previously mentioned, one is encouraged to fall asleep while
        > listening to John-Roger's seminars. One is also encouraged to play a
        > seminar tape at bedtime while going to sleep. All of this allows for
        > more successful "soul travel"--and, of course, more successful
        > subliminal programming.
        >
        > John-Roger is well aware of this: "While your conscious mind is at
        > rest,
        > during the sleep state;" he writes in the MSIA Handbook for
        > Ministers of
        > Light, "it will not question or block the spiritual action." The
        > conscious mind "will not question or block" John-Roger's
        > programming,
        > either.
        >
        > When one is consciously listening to his seminar, one is encouraged
        > to
        > "ignore" all the things that "don't apply to you" and look only for
        > the
        > "minute or two" during an hour-long seminar that is the message "the
        > Traveler specifically has for you." All the other information
        > was "for
        > somebody else," and should be disregarded. Disregarded, perhaps--but
        > the
        > information enters the subconscious nonetheless.
        >
        > And then there are spiritual exercises. Everyone is
        > encouraged--strongly--to do two hours each day of spiritual
        > exercises
        > (or "s.e.'s"). For two hours, with your eyes closed, you think about
        > guess what? Yes: John-Roger. He suggests that you "mock up" his
        > image in
        > your mind. He suggests that you visualize purple light: the color of
        > the
        > Traveler. The only time it's okay to open your eyes is to gaze
        > lovingly
        > at a photograph or painting of him. You can also "chant the sacred
        > names
        > of God"--gods who are all, you are continually reminded, far
        > inferior to
        > John-Roger. You can also play meditation tapes, which feature
        > John-Roger's voice telling you, essentially, that you should feel
        > absolutely terrific because, after all, you were clever enough and
        > fortunate enough to discover John-Roger.
        >
        > Seminars, combined with Discourses, the worshipful way in which
        > John-Roger is treated by believers, the rumors of miracle heaof
        > miracle
        > healings (the far longer list of failed healings is never
        > mentioned),
        > John-Roger's demonstrations of his psychic powers (usually
        > information
        > he gathered surreptitiously combined with a crystal-ball-gazer's
        > knack
        > of throwing out generalities until the person being "read" awe-fully
        > supplies the specific information)--all goes in, seminar after
        > seminar,
        > Discourse after Discourse, retreat after retreat, year after year.
        > (Workshops such as Insight or MSIA retreats can shorten the
        > programming
        > time c
        >
        > At a certain instant, it all comes together. It does not gel or
        > harden;
        > it crystallizes--one moment it's not together, the next moment it
        > is.
        > One moment John-Roger is an occasionally interesting guy. The next
        > minute he's God. Because it's been planted in your subconscious, the
        > realization: "John-Roger is IT!" seems to come from within you. It
        > is
        > your realization. You had this breakthrough. "Nobody put me up to
        > this;
        > I discovered it on my own."
        >
        >
        > The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie deliberate,
        > contrived, and dishonest but the myth persistent, persuasive, and
        > unrealistic.
        > JOHN F. KENNEDY
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Eureka! All problems are solved. From maternity through senility to
        > eternity, J-R is there and will help you--personally--every step of
        > the
        > way.Footsteps in the Sand, in which the disciple looks back on his
        > life
        > and notices that when times were easy, there were two pair of
        > footsteps
        > in the sand and when times were difficult, there was only one pair
        > of
        > footsteps in the sand. "Why, during the hard parts of my life, did
        > you
        > desert me?" the seeker asks his master. "I did not desert you," the
        > master answers, "Those were the times I carried you." With stories
        > such
        > as this, John-Roger moves from programming to seduction.> "The
        > Mystical
        > Traveler will play all the roles in your life" John-Roger proclaims
        > in a
        > meditation. John-Roger was there at our conception, our birth when
        > he
        > "pushed us into the body," never leaves us (it is our lack of
        > perception, not his lack of presence that causes us to be unaware of
        > him), and will be there to "take you from the body" at the moment of
        > your death. Conception to crematorium--what service.
        >
        > And that's how it works. From that point on, you're hooked. It would
        > take a great deal of counterprogramming to unhook you. But that's
        > not
        > likely to happen. Now that you know that John-Roger is God, and you
        > know
        > you came to this conclusion on your own, then you willingly take
        > part--even seek--more intense, more extreme, more devotional
        > programming.
        >
        > Just to make sure that no counterprogramming accidentally sneaks in,
        > one
        > is encouraged to leave behind non-believing friends, husbands,
        > wives,
        > children, parents, bosses, employees, and anyone else. You are
        > encouraged to "chant the names of God"--or chant the name J-R or
        > John-Roger--no matter what else you're doing. The exploration of
        > other
        > groups or practices is severely frowned upon. Recreational
        > activities
        > such as reading books or watching television are considered
        > frivolous.
        > "Don't turn on the TVs until you've done your two hours of s.e.'s"
        > is a
        > common message. As one Devoted to the Light, one should be doing
        > significant things: listening to seminar tapes, reading Discourses,
        > s.e.'s, and service. And whom does one serve? The Traveler, of
        > course.
        > How does one serve the Traveler? Either volunteer for one of
        > John-Roger's organizations, or go out and make some money and donate
        > it
        > to one of John-Roger's organizations.
        >
        >
        > One should always be wary of someone who promises that their love
        > will
        > last longer than a weekend.
        > QUENTIN CRISP
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > All achievements, successes, and personal gains in a devotee's life
        > are
        > to be attributed to John-Roger. People who took credit for anything
        > personally were accused of egocentricity, materialism, and pride.
        > The
        > teachings of the Movement are clear: the bad in your life is your
        > fault,
        > the good in your life is John-Roger's gift.
        >
        > Over time, most of your friends are Movement friends; your romantic
        > relationships are with Movement people (or people who show a strong
        > leaning toward the Movement); much of your business is done with
        > people
        > in the Movement and; beyond your basic needs, all your money is
        > spent on
        > Movement activities.
        >
        > -------------------------------------------------
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > As I previously mentioned, one is encouraged to fall asleep while
        > listening to John-Roger's seminars. One is also encouraged to play a
        > seminar tape at bedtime while going to sleep. All of this allows for
        > more successful "soul travel"--and, of course, more successful
        > subliminal programming.
        >
        > John-Roger is well aware of this: "While your conscious mind is at
        > rest,
        > during the sleep state;" he writes in the MSIA Handbook for
        > Ministers of
        > Light, "it will not question or block the spiritual action." The
        > conscious mind "will not question or block" John-Roger's
        > programming,
        > either.
        >
        > When one is consciously listening to his seminar, one is encouraged
        > to
        > "ignore" all the things that "don't apply to you" and look only for
        > the
        > "minute or two" during an hour-long seminar that is the message "the
        > Traveler specifically has for you." All the other information
        > was "for
        > somebody else," and should be disregarded. Disregarded, perhaps--but
        > the
        > information enters the subconscious nonetheless.
        >
        > And then there are spiritual exercises. Everyone is
        > encouraged--strongly--to do two hours each day of spiritual
        > exercises
        > (or "s.e.'s"). For two hours, with your eyes closed, you think about
        > guess what? Yes: John-Roger. He suggests that you "mock up" his
        > image in
        > your mind. He suggests that you visualize purple light: the color of
        > the
        > Traveler. The only time it's okay to open your eyes is to gaze
        > lovingly
        > at a photograph or painting of him. You can also "chant the sacred
        > names
        > of God"--gods who are all, you are continually reminded, far
        > inferior to
        > John-Roger. You can also play meditation tapes, which feature
        > John-Roger's voice telling you, essentially, that you should feel
        > absolutely terrific because, after all, you were clever enough and
        > fortunate enough to discover John-Roger.
        >
        > Seminars, combined with Discourses, the worshipful way in which
        > John-Roger is treated by believers, the rumors of miracle heaof
        > miracle
        > healings (the far longer list of failed healings is never
        > mentioned),
        > John-Roger's demonstrations of his psychic powers (usually
        > information
        > he gathered surreptitiously combined with a crystal-ball-gazer's
        > knack
        > of throwing out generalities until the person being "read" awe-fully
        > supplies the specific information)--all goes in, seminar after
        > seminar,
        > Discourse after Discourse, retreat after retreat, year after year.
        > (Workshops such as Insight or MSIA retreats can shorten the
        > programming
        > time c
        >
        > At a certain instant, it all comes together. It does not gel or
        > harden;
        > it crystallizes--one moment it's not together, the next moment it
        > is.
        > One moment John-Roger is an occasionally interesting guy. The next
        > minute he's God. Because it's been planted in your subconscious, the
        > realization: "John-Roger is IT!" seems to come from within you. It
        > is
        > your realization. You had this breakthrough. "Nobody put me up to
        > this;
        > I discovered it on my own."
        >
        >
        > The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie deliberate,
        > contrived, and dishonest but the myth persistent, persuasive, and
        > unrealistic.
        > JOHN F. KENNEDY
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Eureka! All problems are solved. From maternity through senility to
        > eternity, J-R is there and will help you--personally--every step of
        > the
        > way.Footsteps in the Sand, in which the disciple looks back on his
        > life
        > and notices that when times were easy, there were two pair of
        > footsteps
        > in the sand and when times were difficult, there was only one pair
        > of
        > footsteps in the sand. "Why, during the hard parts of my life, did
        > you
        > desert me?" the seeker asks his master. "I did not desert you," the
        > master answers, "Those were the times I carried you." With stories
        > such
        > as this, John-Roger moves from programming to seduction.> "The
        > Mystical
        > Traveler will play all the roles in your life" John-Roger proclaims
        > in a
        > meditation. John-Roger was there at our conception, our birth when
        > he
        > "pushed us into the body," never leaves us (it is our lack of
        > perception, not his lack of presence that causes us to be unaware of
        > him), and will be there to "take you from the body" at the moment of
        > your death. Conception to crematorium--what service.
        >
        > And that's how it works. From that point on, you're hooked. It would
        > take a great deal of counterprogramming to unhook you. But that's
        > not
        > likely to happen. Now that you know that John-Roger is God, and you
        > know
        > you came to this conclusion on your own, then you willingly take
        > part--even seek--more intense, more extreme, more devotional
        > programming.
        >
        > Just to make sure that no counterprogramming accidentally sneaks in,
        > one
        > is encouraged to leave behind non-believing friends, husbands,
        > wives,
        > children, parents, bosses, employees, and anyone else. You are
        > encouraged to "chant the names of God"--or chant the name J-R or
        > John-Roger--no matter what else you're doing. The exploration of
        > other
        > groups or practices is severely frowned upon. Recreational
        > activities
        > such as reading books or watching television are considered
        > frivolous.
        > "Don't turn on the TVs until you've done your two hours of s.e.'s"
        > is a
        > common message. As one Devoted to the Light, one should be doing
        > significant things: listening to seminar tapes, reading Discourses,
        > s.e.'s, and service. And whom does one serve? The Traveler, of
        > course.
        > How does one serve the Traveler? Either volunteer for one of
        > John-Roger's organizations, or go out and make some money and donate
        > it
        > to one of John-Roger's organizations.
        >
        >
        > One should always be wary of someone who promises that their love
        > will
        > last longer than a weekend.
        > QUENTIN CRISP
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > All achievements, successes, and personal gains in a devotee's life
        > are
        > to be attributed to John-Roger. People who took credit for anything
        > personally were accused of egocentricity, materialism, and pride.
        > The
        > teachings of the Movement are clear: the bad in your life is your
        > fault,
        > the good in your life is John-Roger's gift.
        >
        > Over time, most of your friends are Movement friends; your romantic
        > relationships are with Movement people (or people who show a strong
        > leaning toward the Movement); much of your business is done with
        > people
        > in the Movement and; beyond your basic needs, all your money is
        > spent on
        > Movement activities.
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, "queenrendek"
        > <queenrendek@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Hi,
        > > I was a member of Eckankar for quite a few years in the 70's and
        > 80's
        > > when Darwin was there and after. It was a long time ago but it
        > still
        > > comes to mind. I believe I joined because I had friends who were
        > > members and was searching all my life for a so called "path". I
        > went
        > > to classes when they had a center in Eagle Rock. The Lavaneri's
        > were
        > > very active there and I attended meetings that they lead. I even
        > set
        > > up a little seminar in my own town. I also went to several out of
        > town
        > > seminars with friends to Las Vegas, Sacramento, Phoenix and
        > others.
        > > I wanted to belong because I was always searching for a "path" and
        > I
        > > had friends who were Eckists and they were very convincing. The
        > whole
        > > experience was not bad really, but I never really "embraced" it,
        > > although I think I wanted to.
        > >
        > > This list appeals to me because I am still "searching" for
        > something
        > > and maybe I could get further insights from the discussions.
        > >
        > > Thanks
        > > queenrendek
        > >
        >
      • 125
        Hi there queenrendek:   I haven t been replying to anyone just reading emails from this group for months, hoping like you that someone would  mention
        Message 3 of 7 , Jul 13, 2008
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          Hi there queenrendek:

           

          I haven't been replying to anyone just reading emails from this group for months, hoping like you that someone would  mention something that I could research and try to find some peace.  So far nothing helpful.  I mostly think alot by myself.  Do some hot yoga, this seems to help some, but I feel like there is more only I don't know how to find it.

           

           

          I loved Eckankar while I was in it, then it started to feel wrong?  I tried to stay and get the hang of it, but my old self took over and said get the hell out before you end up in a nut house.

           

           

           

          Here's what I have tried, I got saved - didn't know from what because I didn't feel like I needed saving, but I did it.  Then nothing... I quit church, got to despise it really, so much bs about love and such but I didn't feel anything.  Then they told me I couldn't join anyway because I had to believe 3 things and I didn't believe those 3 things even though I tried to I couldn't.

           

          Then life crashed down around me and I decided I'd try Eck for a while.  I loved it at first, I thought I could get some real answers about life.  I thought I did, then I realized they just wanted to train me into a higher soul to be of more help to other souls so I could move forward on "the path".  So much bs there too.  Man I tell you I can't find a thing?

           

          If you just need to write to someone maybe that will have to do.  I don't know.

           

          Oh I was an Eck member for about 4 years  in 2003 til 2007

           

          Hopelessly lost in VA

           

          R Sycamore

          --- On Tue, 6/24/08, queenrendek <queenrendek@...> wrote:

          From: queenrendek <queenrendek@...>
          Subject: [eckankartruth] Just joined this group.
          To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Tuesday, June 24, 2008, 2:20 PM

          Hi,
          I was a member of Eckankar for quite a few years in the 70's and 80's
          when Darwin was there and after. It was a long time ago but it still
          comes to mind. I believe I joined because I had friends who were
          members and was searching all my life for a so called "path". I went
          to classes when they had a center in Eagle Rock. The Lavaneri's were
          very active there and I attended meetings that they lead. I even set
          up a little seminar in my own town. I also went to several out of town
          seminars with friends to Las Vegas, Sacramento, Phoenix and others.
          I wanted to belong because I was always searching for a "path" and I
          had friends who were Eckists and they were very convincing. The whole
          experience was not bad really, but I never really "embraced" it,
          although I think I wanted to.

          This list appeals to me because I am still "searching" for something
          and maybe I could get further insights from the discussions.

          Thanks
          queenrendek


        • Rennie Dudek
          Hello R, I related to some of your comments for sure.  I think we tend to envy those who say I have found it!   And we are still floating around thinking we
          Message 4 of 7 , Jul 13, 2008
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            Hello R,

            I related to some of your comments for sure.  I think we tend to envy those who say "I have found it!"  And we are still floating around thinking we missed the boat and don't understand how they "found it" and we can't.   (How's that for a metaphor?)  Anyway, 

            I don't know about you, but I think I was more "into" the Eck members that I knew than really embracing Eckankar.  I wanted to feel or believe or grasp it like they did.  By the way, "they" are still in it.  I email a couple of them still but we never talk about Eckankar. 

            I just never really "got it".  I could never do the "spiritual exercises" with any real results or eye opening events.  I actually still use the secret chant word or whatever they called it when you got your initiation.  It seems to center me during hard times.  I don't get it but it works. 

            I went to many seminars and found them non threatening, but to tell you the truth I really could never figure out what the heck Darwin or the current Eck master Harold were really talking about.  I lived it through my friends and tried very hard.  I also went to classes in my area and even set up a little seminar in my town  and read books.  I really wanted to get it but was fooling myself I think.  I was also very shy then and didn't speak up much in classes.  Now they probably couldn't shut me up.  My husband and family were very tolerant of the whole thing and so no harm in looking for something higher than myself.  At least that is what they told me. heh heh.  If you want to chat more about just let me know. Currently my "spiritual" life involves bonding with my cat and working with my plants in the yard and enjoying my family.  Maybe that is what it is about and the rest we can just leave to the Universe. 

             

            Queen 

             

             

            --- On Sun, 7/13/08, 125 <bkdclove4all@...> wrote:

            From: 125 <bkdclove4all@...>
            Subject: Re: [eckankartruth] Just joined this group.
            To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Sunday, July 13, 2008, 6:11 PM

            Hi there queenrendek:

             

            I haven't been replying to anyone just reading emails from this group for months, hoping like you that someone would  mention something that I could research and try to find some peace.  So far nothing helpful.  I mostly think alot by myself.  Do some hot yoga, this seems to help some, but I feel like there is more only I don't know how to find it.

             

             

            I loved Eckankar while I was in it, then it started to feel wrong?  I tried to stay and get the hang of it, but my old self took over and said get the hell out before you end up in a nut house.

             

             

             

            Here's what I have tried, I got saved - didn't know from what because I didn't feel like I needed saving, but I did it.  Then nothing... I quit church, got to despise it really, so much bs about love and such but I didn't feel anything.  Then they told me I couldn't join anyway because I had to believe 3 things and I didn't believe those 3 things even though I tried to I couldn't.

             

            Then life crashed down around me and I decided I'd try Eck for a while.  I loved it at first, I thought I could get some real answers about life.  I thought I did, then I realized they just wanted to train me into a higher soul to be of more help to other souls so I could move forward on "the path".  So much bs there too.  Man I tell you I can't find a thing?

             

            If you just need to write to someone maybe that will have to do.  I don't know.

             

            Oh I was an Eck member for about 4 years  in 2003 til 2007

             

            Hopelessly lost in VA

             

            R Sycamore

            --- On Tue, 6/24/08, queenrendek <queenrendek@ yahoo.com> wrote:

            From: queenrendek <queenrendek@ yahoo.com>
            Subject: [eckankartruth] Just joined this group.
            To: eckankartruth@ yahoogroups. com
            Date: Tuesday, June 24, 2008, 2:20 PM

            Hi,
            I was a member of Eckankar for quite a few years in the 70's and 80's
            when Darwin was there and after. It was a long time ago but it still
            comes to mind. I believe I joined because I had friends who were
            members and was searching all my life for a so called "path". I went
            to classes when they had a center in Eagle Rock. The Lavaneri's were
            very active there and I attended meetings that they lead. I even set
            up a little seminar in my own town. I also went to several out of town
            seminars with friends to Las Vegas, Sacramento, Phoenix and others.
            I wanted to belong because I was always searching for a "path" and I
            had friends who were Eckists and they were very convincing. The whole
            experience was not bad really, but I never really "embraced" it,
            although I think I wanted to.

            This list appeals to me because I am still "searching" for something
            and maybe I could get further insights from the discussions.

            Thanks
            queenrendek



          • whitefeatherliz
            ... working with my plants in the yard and enjoying my family.  Maybe that is what it is about and the rest we can just leave to the Universe.  ... Hi Queen
            Message 5 of 7 , Jul 16, 2008
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              --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, Rennie Dudek <queenrendek@...>
              wrote:
              >
              > Currently my "spiritual" life involves bonding with my cat and
              working with my plants in the yard and enjoying my family.  Maybe
              that is what it is about and the rest we can just leave to the
              Universe. 
              >  
              > Queen 
              >  


              Hi Queen and all,

              I snipped your post and left the "spiritually enlightened" part!
              LOL Because, the truth is, that is what spiritual enlightenment is!

              I was a e-cult member from age 12/13 joined with my entire family
              through our mother in the early 70s. Remained a member for a little
              over 30 yrs, and left 5 years ago... wow it's actually been 5 yrs!

              Just keep doing what you're doing and let the Universe take care of
              the rest! Enjoy your family, and everything else you have always
              wanted to try, do, experience.

              My husband and I recently rented "The bucket list", and loved it.
              Also, the movies theme song by John Mayer "Say" goes perfectly with
              the theme of the movie.

              Go out and enjoy life, I did...
              Liz



              "Say" by John Mayer

              Take all of your wasted honor
              Every little past frustration
              Take all of your so-called problems,
              Better put 'em in quotations

              Say what you need to say [x8]

              Walking like a one man army
              Fighting with the shadows in your head
              Living out the same old moment
              Knowing you'd be better off instead,
              If you only could . . .

              Say what you need to say [x8]

              Have no fear for giving in
              Have no fear for giving over
              You'd better know that in the end
              Its better to say too much
              Then never say what you need to say again

              Even if your hands are shaking
              And your faith is broken
              Even as the eyes are closing
              Do it with a heart wide open

              Say what you need to say [x24]
            • Sharon
              ... Hi Everyone!! Sorry, I ve been neglecting ET as usual, I m happily elsewhere enjoying enlightenment ! Right now my 4-year-old grandson and I are
              Message 6 of 7 , Aug 5, 2008
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                > --- In eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com, Rennie Dudek <queenrendek@>
                > wrote:
                > >
                > > Currently my "spiritual" life involves bonding with my cat and
                > working with my plants in the yard and enjoying my family.  Maybe
                > that is what it is about and the rest we can just leave to the
                > Universe. 
                > >  
                > > Queen 
                > >  
                >
                >
                > Hi Queen and all,
                >
                > I snipped your post and left the "spiritually enlightened" part!
                > LOL Because, the truth is, that is what spiritual enlightenment is!
                > (posted by Liz "Whitefeather")


                Hi Everyone!!

                Sorry, I've been neglecting ET as usual, I'm happily elsewhere
                enjoying "enlightenment"! <gg> Right now my 4-year-old grandson and
                I are definitely on one of those "highest" planes - on top of
                the "retired" pop-up camper, which happens to be the only place in
                his yard that gets a lot of sunshine and is relatively safe from
                marauding deer (aka "Pennsylvania Rats"). So, we used the old
                kiddie/turtle pool (oldest grandson & wife reclaimed their turtles)
                to start a watermelon garden, and just yesterday found our first tiny
                melon, the size of a baby pea!!

                Anyway, I figured I might as well post something about a recent
                discussion topic, and I just tried to pop into "messages" in another
                window but I'm told the messages here are not available right now.
                (??????) So, I'll just go from memory here...

                Okay, I've totally forgotten the name you're using, person who's been
                posting that psychic vampirism stuff!! BTW, I just changed your
                settings so I don't have to pre-approve your posts, and also I'd like
                to remind everyone that all members can add links in the "links"
                section here, so would you add yours? I only posted it in a message
                here, which is much faster for me than adding links.

                Anyway, this is a sort of "controversial" subject, energy-stealing or
                whatever. And puh-leeze, this is "eckankartruth" not alien abduction
                or reptilian aliens or any other of that kind of thing, true or not!
                I refrain from having an opinion about stuff like that, although
                personally I'm totally hoping that those "good" aliens will reveal
                themselves on December 21, 2012, and wave their magic laser-beams and
                we'll all live happily ever after!!! <gg> I'd really love to meet
                an alien, as long as there's none of that anal-probe nonsense, in
                which case they can expect me to rip off their tentacles with my bare
                hands!!

                But, that energy-sucking stuff, well, it's something I sort of
                suspected on my own a long time ago. And it sort of goes along with
                my own personal experience as an eckist and an ex-eckist. It's
                probably something I posted about back on a.r.e. years back, but I do
                truly believe that somehow, ekult's "corporate entity consciousness"
                or whatever you call it somehow sucks the life out of at least a
                certain percentage of its members, if not all.

                It's sort of like the membership & book sales profit, only sort of
                not on the physical plane.

                Another thing I noticed when I got out and a lot of people started
                writing to me, it wasn't unusual for people who've had just about
                totally "normal" lives to start up with ekult and then all of a
                sudden, start experiencing "psychic attacks" of one kind of another -
                in fact, this happened to a "newbie" eckist I was rather close to,
                and they ended up falling for the cult's b.s. about how <rolling my
                eyes here> all the forces of the KAL will gang up and do whatever
                they can to prevent someone from getting all that spirichul stuff
                from the original and only true "source", they'd "hu" those darned
                pesky entities away and renew their membership, never even
                considering the possibility that those "attacks" originated from cult
                headquarters!!

                Anyway, for a lot of the "newbies" reading here, I've been "out" for
                ten years now, I started out as a true-blue eckie at
                alt.religion.eckankar, determined to "save" all those poor deluded
                Souls who'd betrayed the master, and help them to return and not have
                to spend eternity wandering in astral hell. And I've probably posted
                several equivalents of "War & Peace" since then, although I've really
                slacked off in recent years.

                I still get a lot of email. Even recently, I've received emails from
                people who tell me they're experiencing many different degrees
                of "psychic attack" originating from the cult and/or its HIs. Oh!!
                Just remembered something, back when I was still an eckie, there was
                an African eckie on one of the cult's email groups who was accusing
                some HIs of practicing black magic against him. I'm sure most of you
                know that privately, this is a big subject with eckies.

                Another interesting thing I learned, going way back, there was a
                group of eckists who got together regularly to sort of "zap" the
                cult's "enemies", and they weren't sending out peace & love vibes!!
                I believe this was around the time of "Darwingate", when both
                cultmasters were accusing each other of being black magicians &
                telling their particular followers to burn all the other guy's stuff,
                etc.

                Joe Sykes is, unfortunately, not the "worst case" of this kind of
                thing. You know, for a long time I didn't think it was a good idea
                to publicize his story at all, simply because of the possibility that
                it might put ideas into people's heads and they'd end up somehow
                having "psychic attack" problems that they otherwise wouldn't have
                had.

                Some people are more suggestible than others. Some people are more
                imaginative. But...there are also a lot of totally "normal" and
                logical types, a certain percentage where it certainly does seem like
                there's no other reason for "psychic attacks" than the fact that yes,
                it happens. It's real. Maybe not everyone is a good
                enough "receiver" or something, who knows? It's sort of like alien
                abduction - why do those aliens only abduct certain people, most of
                whom would prefer *not* to be abducted?

                Have to laugh, years back my brother and a group of his friends
                experienced a big UFO swooping down on them while they were playing
                basketball. These were just grubby little kids with absolutely *no*
                thoughts or interest in stuff like this, and it was back in the 60's
                or 70's anyway, but another interesting thing is, a few years later,
                two of those same kids ended up with what seems to be an "abduction"
                experience even though to this day, none of them are "believers".

                Anyway, I was sort of jealous, and actually went up on the railroad
                tracks quite a few times (the highest & clearest tree-free location)
                and yelled up towards the sky, "Hey aliens, I'd like to meet you!" or
                words to that effect. Got no response. I'm still waiting &
                hoping...sort of. They weren't interested when I still had good
                eggs, and now that the eggs are all dried up I'm sure the aliens are
                even less interested.

                Anyway, everyone's "ecksperience" is often different, whether you're
                a member or awake & out. It's good when people are able to share
                their personal experiences & viewpoints, from one extreme to the
                other.

                Oh, well...gotta get back to "enlightenment"! <gg>

                Hope everyone else is enjoying summer!!

                Hugs,

                Sharon

                PS - Alf, love the jokes, post more!! And how about that funny old
                story about Reb?? My personal "Alfie" archives are in storage. <gg>

                Oh - here's one, don't think it's yours:

                First Eckie: Darn, as hard as I try, I just can't get a clear
                picture on my inner screen!!

                Second Eckie: The screen?!? You see the screen?!?!

                (Darn, that's not exactly right - I just vaguely remember it, I think
                there was another one with it about a lost eckie wandering around
                back roads doing vahana work or something.)
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