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Re: House cleaning

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  • Sharon
    ... For me, it s being able to be *truly* connected with all of life again, to fully & deeply feel & appreciate everything for what it truly *is*, without the
    Message 1 of 5 , Sep 28, 2002
      --- In eckankartruth@y..., "broker84" <broker84@c...> wrote:
      > Jimmi,
      >
      > It really is a good feeling isn't it?...To be able to just really breath the air and to feel the power of gravity...and to touch life again....
      >

      For me, it's being able to be *truly* connected with all of life again, to fully & deeply feel & appreciate everything for what it truly *is*, without the cult-colored glasses.


      > I do know what you mean about being free....free to be ourselves and do it with STYLE.......
      >

      I'm thinking of something at a.r.e. recently, which made me just shake my head and roll my eyes. They just don't get it, and constantly need to "rationalize" the *fact* that people leave the cult, and we're all just fine. They need to constantly refer back to all the garbage the cult's told them, and they have *no* sense of humor.

      Okay, those who've known me for ages understand I sometimes have a weird sense of humor, but it never ceases to amaze me how totally *humorless* they often are!



      > You might not have heard that a few months back, probably 6 or so, on A.R.E., we had a "Share the Secret Word Contest"....
      >
      > About 20 folks who had left eckankar decided to share their secret words on the newsgroup for everyone to see......and the funny part was that many of us had been given exactly the same secret word in or 2nd initiations......It turned out that the "Personal, Private, Secret Word which had been bestowed by the Mahanta, the wehhl of life, through his appointed mahdis and specifically designed for the personal growth of the individual chela, was just another stupid word taken from a small list in the eck initiator book.....Actually, I believe that out of 20 or so of us, 7 people actually had the very same word.
      >
      > There were sefveral other words shared by others as well....
      >
      > Kinda shows eck initiations for what they are doesn't it? Mass produced illusion
      >

      I "got" a word myself "on the inner" at my third initiation, but...it was sort of a natural progression from what I'd been using for years. Nothing "spiritual" about it. You program certain things into yourself, and your brain responds.

      What sort of made me wonder about my 3rd was, I was sitting there eckbuzzed and didn't quite know what to do - so I opened one eye to "peek", and I saw that my initiator had one eye open and was "peeking" at her watch. <ggg>

      Paul, I *do* want to applaud you for having the guts to sell your eckstuff. You know, my first thought was that oh horrors, this is only going to result in more cover-up, and I couldn't afford to buy any of it myself to post publicly. But as it turns out, your auction exposed a few more people to the possibilities of getting out. And I ended up getting some "secret" materials from another source, and I am overwhelmed and eternally grateful for the incredible unexpected gift from this former HI. I sort of hate to say it because it's like an "ecky" flashback, but Spirit certainly *does* work in our lives, and it's *real* spirit, not the phony cult-spirit which is only aimed at getting new members, and their money.

      Jimmi, you're going to love it out here, and it just gets better & better every day!! I understand more & more what another former member told me a long time ago, about the wonderful clarity of mind that comes with getting out. Sometimes it feels like the cult was so long ago - for me, it's roughly four years.

      Love & Hugs to everyone!

      Sharon



      > Have a nice FREE day.
      > Sword
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: swallow472000
      > To: eckankartruth@y...
      > Sent: September 25, 2002 4:49 PM
      > Subject: [eckankartruth] House cleaning
      >
      >
      > To this group...Its fantastic here, I feel like I've been in a
      > concentration camp for eons. Your helping me be me again a human
      > being. Thank you for sharing your feelings. It was so unfeeling in
      > the eck box, so controled, only the mahawhaji was allowed to hurt, to
      > complain, to tell the jokes. You make me laugh you make me cry you
      > make me feel like a person once more instead of a service
      > clone. Wow selling discourses...what a buzz...brilliant. I
      > only dared throw mine away into the rubbish. I thought I was
      > free..,I've still got aways to go. jimmi
      >
      >
      >
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    • broker84
      Sharon, You know....the cult is not that smart. If I was the Moohanta....I would have written a warning to all my chelas about the horrors of jumping ahead in
      Message 2 of 5 , Sep 28, 2002
        Sharon,

        You know....the cult is not that smart.

        If I was the Moohanta....I would have written a warning to all my chelas about the horrors of jumping ahead in my eck studies, and taking on the karma of whoever I bought discourses from ad nauseum ad nauseum.....

        You'd think that the org would eventually see that you cannot build spiritual truth or spriitual growth with written words or books.....

        The secrets of the org are doomed to exposure and the sooner the better if you ask me.

        The internet is collapseing space and distances...and opening the world to new ideas and horizons which would have been simply unbelievable only 10 years ago!.....

        I, personally only give eckankar at best another 10 years or so.....after that, people will be so web saavvy that they will know all about eckankars true history well before they are brought to the point of writing in for discourses, and by then, one will be able to purchase eck discourses off the web for a buck or two anyway, without having to join....and once they read those discourses, they will see that there really is nothing to gain in eckankar unless you like paying hundreds of dollars for harolds home spun cat and dog stories.....

        Personally I enjoy a true author and real literature.

        One of the people who bought 4 discourse series from me is a current eckist and has been a member for 14 years thus far.....she appreciated that I kept the auctions confidential so no one could see who the bidders were.....and she wants to read all the discourses now and see what lies ahead.....I told her not to get her hopes up too much.....(The living eck mister can't show her anything that she couldn't find for herself).... I didn't tell that part but she'll see it eventually.....all spiritually honest people come to the crossroads, no matter what the crutch is....eckankar, or whatever.....

        Its incredible to me how eckists can go 15 years or more waiting for the monthly discourse.....letting life go by as they strive for yet another initiation.......passing on what could have been good friendships because the prospective friends might not fit the cults mold of what a friend should be.....ad anuseum ad nauseum....(I need some spritual rolaids I guess)...

        Life is so short and so precious.....and today, having spent 28 of my years locked into eckankar....I honestly regret the time spent......

        And the devotees over at a.r.e. wonder how someone can feel this way...we must all be deluded of course......After all, we are all in the physical plane and everything here is Negative right?.....

        They still have to find out that they are in the physical as well and all the denial in the world will not cure the escapeism that brings one to the door of things like eckankar......

        The REAL cure is just LIVING and LIVING FULLY. Life drives away all illusion eventually, at least it will if we are truely spritually honest with ourselves and if we find the courage to drop our comfy little conceptions of what life is and simply LIVE....The crutches all fall away.

        I still do believe in spirit however not in any sence, in the muck that the eckists swallow......

        Our lives are really close to home and once we forget about little people like harold and his gang, the sooner we find out where we actually view life from. And that's the beginning, at least it was for me.

        Glad you finally got all that eck stuff....just don't get your hopes up too much.....Most of those writings are really simplistic and monotonous......Before I left eck, I got really bored reading harolds junk......He had a way of seldom if ever writing anything himself....he usually just quoted initiate reports and stories that were sent in to him.....

        THe moohanta transcripts were especially dull.....same old same old....after years of it, spirit just cires out for something fresh and ALIVE...

        Have a nice night
        Sword
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Sharon
        To: eckankartruth@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: September 28, 2002 8:15 PM
        Subject: [eckankartruth] Re: House cleaning


        --- In eckankartruth@y..., "broker84" <broker84@c...> wrote:
        > Jimmi,
        >
        > It really is a good feeling isn't it?...To be able to just really breath the air and to feel the power of gravity...and to touch life again....
        >

        For me, it's being able to be *truly* connected with all of life again, to fully & deeply feel & appreciate everything for what it truly *is*, without the cult-colored glasses.


        > I do know what you mean about being free....free to be ourselves and do it with STYLE.......
        >

        I'm thinking of something at a.r.e. recently, which made me just shake my head and roll my eyes. They just don't get it, and constantly need to "rationalize" the *fact* that people leave the cult, and we're all just fine. They need to constantly refer back to all the garbage the cult's told them, and they have *no* sense of humor.

        Okay, those who've known me for ages understand I sometimes have a weird sense of humor, but it never ceases to amaze me how totally *humorless* they often are!



        > You might not have heard that a few months back, probably 6 or so, on A.R.E., we had a "Share the Secret Word Contest"....
        >
        > About 20 folks who had left eckankar decided to share their secret words on the newsgroup for everyone to see......and the funny part was that many of us had been given exactly the same secret word in or 2nd initiations......It turned out that the "Personal, Private, Secret Word which had been bestowed by the Mahanta, the wehhl of life, through his appointed mahdis and specifically designed for the personal growth of the individual chela, was just another stupid word taken from a small list in the eck initiator book.....Actually, I believe that out of 20 or so of us, 7 people actually had the very same word.
        >
        > There were sefveral other words shared by others as well....
        >
        > Kinda shows eck initiations for what they are doesn't it? Mass produced illusion
        >

        I "got" a word myself "on the inner" at my third initiation, but...it was sort of a natural progression from what I'd been using for years. Nothing "spiritual" about it. You program certain things into yourself, and your brain responds.

        What sort of made me wonder about my 3rd was, I was sitting there eckbuzzed and didn't quite know what to do - so I opened one eye to "peek", and I saw that my initiator had one eye open and was "peeking" at her watch. <ggg>

        Paul, I *do* want to applaud you for having the guts to sell your eckstuff. You know, my first thought was that oh horrors, this is only going to result in more cover-up, and I couldn't afford to buy any of it myself to post publicly. But as it turns out, your auction exposed a few more people to the possibilities of getting out. And I ended up getting some "secret" materials from another source, and I am overwhelmed and eternally grateful for the incredible unexpected gift from this former HI. I sort of hate to say it because it's like an "ecky" flashback, but Spirit certainly *does* work in our lives, and it's *real* spirit, not the phony cult-spirit which is only aimed at getting new members, and their money.

        Jimmi, you're going to love it out here, and it just gets better & better every day!! I understand more & more what another former member told me a long time ago, about the wonderful clarity of mind that comes with getting out. Sometimes it feels like the cult was so long ago - for me, it's roughly four years.

        Love & Hugs to everyone!

        Sharon



        > Have a nice FREE day.
        > Sword
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: swallow472000
        > To: eckankartruth@y...
        > Sent: September 25, 2002 4:49 PM
        > Subject: [eckankartruth] House cleaning
        >
        >
        > To this group...Its fantastic here, I feel like I've been in a
        > concentration camp for eons. Your helping me be me again a human
        > being. Thank you for sharing your feelings. It was so unfeeling in
        > the eck box, so controled, only the mahawhaji was allowed to hurt, to
        > complain, to tell the jokes. You make me laugh you make me cry you
        > make me feel like a person once more instead of a service
        > clone. Wow selling discourses...what a buzz...brilliant. I
        > only dared throw mine away into the rubbish. I thought I was
        > free..,I've still got aways to go. jimmi
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
        > ADVERTISEMENT
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


        Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Sharon
        ... Actually Twitch *did* tell members they could only take one discourse series at a time. He originally planned to keep them busy several hours a day,
        Message 3 of 5 , Sep 29, 2002
          --- In eckankartruth@y..., "broker84" <broker84@c...> wrote:
          > Sharon,
          >
          > You know....the cult is not that smart.
          >
          > If I was the Moohanta....I would have written a warning to all my chelas about the horrors of jumping ahead in my eck studies, and taking on the karma of whoever I bought discourses from ad nauseum ad nauseum.....
          >

          Actually <ggg> Twitch *did* tell members they could only take one discourse series at a time. He originally planned to keep them busy several hours a day, studying tapes & books, reading books several times, taking notes...this is in the beginning of "Letters to a Chela".


          > You'd think that the org would eventually see that you cannot build spiritual truth or spriitual growth with written words or books.....
          >

          And that nonsense about the "mahaunta" teaching you on the "inner" is a bunch of baloney, too.

          Anything we get "on the inner" is from *ourselves* and has *nothing* to do with the cult.

          You *can* get a lot of spiritual truth & from them, help yourself to grow spiritually - but you can't build a "religion" that contains any spiritual truth on claiming that something that exists freely everywhere is your exclusive property, just because the cult's founder plagiarized from what he got at the library!!

          It's sort of like - elementary school. You go to your classes, the teacher teaches, you study the books, do your homework, etc. Wouldn't it be silly if the teacher (or the principal) said that although you were studying the books, the *real* learning was being psychically transmitted by *them* who were always with you, and gee - they also controlled your dreams, and if the teacher decided you deserved it, you could take a big exam in the dream state and not have to do it "for real"!!

          > The secrets of the org are doomed to exposure and the sooner the better if you ask me.
          >

          Yep!

          > The internet is collapseing space and distances...and opening the world to new ideas and horizons which would have been simply unbelievable only 10 years ago!.....
          >

          I'm laughing, because just yesterday I was thinking back to being a little kid in the 50's - and the year 2000 (and age 50) seemed like some far-away galaxy, a myth, something that would *never* happen!!
          <ggg>



          > I, personally only give eckankar at best another 10 years or so.....after that, people will be so web saavvy that they will know all about eckankars true history well before they are brought to the point of writing in for discourses, and by then, one will be able to purchase eck discourses off the web for a buck or two anyway, without having to join....and once they read those discourses, they will see that there really is nothing to gain in eckankar unless you like paying hundreds of dollars for harolds home spun cat and dog stories.....
          >

          No, I think the cult is likely to *always* be around, sadly. People will come and go just as they always have. The sad thing I noticed when I was a member even, is how they're indoctrinating the children so heavily, the Org "strokes" them a lot, and is actually quite open about pinning its hopes for the future on youth.

          I posted a Harold "toilet" story from "Riding for the ECK BRAND" at a.r.e. - honestly, it's understandable why HIs might not notice after years of heavy indoctrination, but a "newbie" I think would recognize there's something a bit wrong with this guy!


          > Personally I enjoy a true author and real literature.
          >

          And...we learn and grow from these true authors and real literature, don't we? We can *experience* things we read in a way, and use them to grow and learn.


          > One of the people who bought 4 discourse series from me is a current eckist and has been a member for 14 years thus far.....she appreciated that I kept the auctions confidential so no one could see who the bidders were.....

          And isn't a bit "odd" that this "religion" produces that feeling in members?

          When she reads these discourses, should she have any questions and ask "clergy" or someone, they'll tell her that she did a *bad* thing and now her spiritual growth will be stopped, etc. <gg>

          >and she wants to read all the discourses now and see what lies ahead.....I told her not to get her hopes up too much.....

          Having seen them all, I am just *very* glad that I got out before I might possibly have been in the position of having to delude myself into *accepting* that garbage!!


          >(The living eck mister can't show her anything that she couldn't find for herself).... I didn't tell that part but she'll see it eventually.....all spiritually honest people come to the crossroads, no matter what the crutch is....eckankar, or whatever.....

          Some have pulled out an old twitchquote about how at a certain point, the chela is supposed to go on their own or something. Well...in one of Klemp's "Wisdom Notes" I saw him address this by saying, well...sure once they hit the "Soul Plane" they can go on their own, but why would they want to leave him, or something -- I'll have to find it again and post it. And the higher ones, talking about going to the 8th or whatever - well, it's all just plain silly.

          >
          > Its incredible to me how eckists can go 15 years or more waiting for the monthly discourse.....letting life go by as they strive for yet another initiation.......passing on what could have been good friendships because the prospective friends might not fit the cults mold of what a friend should be.....ad anuseum ad nauseum....(I need some spritual rolaids I guess)...
          >

          I remember when I was a newbie, thinking of all the great "spiritual wisdom" I'd get in the years to come - like when I became a 2nd so I was able to read "Be The Hu" - what a hoot!! At the time I thought it was wonderful. Duh.

          LTG 3 was interesting - got the book and read it since I left, and I'd forgotten that that was a "HI" discourse series when I joined, but Klemp "pulled" it along the way. Well...I laughed at the discourses, where Twitch is telling Gail about good books & authors - like Julian Johnson & Path of the Masters!! And Neville Goddard & Curtiss - who are listed at the Center for Twitchellian Plagiarism. <ggg> Klemp's squirming "intros" to the discourses are very revealing.

          It's too bad Twitch hadn't just started out honest, and that Klemp didn't correct it. Klemp's "toilet" story, well...it makes me think of how he covers up the plagiarism. The sensible way to handle things is to ... be sensible. Call for a plunger, unclog it...don't spend hours worrying about what others will think, and rigging up some contraption with a plastic bag, fer crissakes!!


          > Life is so short and so precious.....and today, having spent 28 of my years locked into eckankar....I honestly regret the time spent......
          >

          I'm glad that my life just didn't permit me to get too deeply involved with the org & the eckmissionary stuff, seminars, etc. I had plenty of friends, and a full life. But...I'm a bit sad that the cult colored all of this, it would have been better & more "real" without it.


          > And the devotees over at a.r.e. wonder how someone can feel this way...we must all be deluded of course......After all, we are all in the physical plane and everything here is Negative right?.....
          >

          A.R.E isn't as strange as all the eckies on the internet who don't go there, but hang out on the public & private ecklists, preferring eckanlalaland to facing anything & thinking about it sensibly. Well... <shrug>

          > They still have to find out that they are in the physical as well and all the denial in the world will not cure the escapeism that brings one to the door of things like eckankar......
          >

          I never realized I was escaping!


          > The REAL cure is just LIVING and LIVING FULLY. Life drives away all illusion eventually, at least it will if we are truely spritually honest with ourselves and if we find the courage to drop our comfy little conceptions of what life is and simply LIVE....The crutches all fall away.
          >

          In real life, I never liked crutches. I'd tell the people in the ER not to bother giving them to me, because I had more at home and did *not* use them. Well...sometimes they'd come in handy for *other* things, like staking tomatoes.


          > I still do believe in spirit however not in any sence, in the muck that the eckists swallow......
          >
          > Our lives are really close to home and once we forget about little people like harold and his gang, the sooner we find out where we actually view life from. And that's the beginning, at least it was for me.
          >

          I still believe in...who knows? My viewpoint of life changes, and it's nice! Another former member also pointed out awhile back, how great it is to be freed from the burden of "knowing"!



          > Glad you finally got all that eck stuff....just don't get your hopes up too much.....

          All I was hoping for was more serious stuff showing how it's all a bunch of crap - and I got more than I expected in that respect!!


          >Most of those writings are really simplistic and monotonous......Before I left eck, I got really bored reading harolds junk......

          Me too, but I didn't realize it! Would you believe, at times I'd feel guilty because instead of buying all the eckbooks hot off the presses, I'd buy other spiritual works from other paths and religions. I remember wallowing in Thomas Merton - and thinking that surely, in his next life he'd become the LEM! <ggg>

          Then, when I'd go back to one of Harold's books, well...I told myself it was *so* much better, just pure simple truth - but the fact is, reading Klemp is more like "recess" and goofing off, maybe hanging out in the greeting card store and reading the cards.

          >He had a way of seldom if ever writing anything himself....he usually just quoted initiate reports and stories that were sent in to him.....
          >

          I wondered, because I noticed that although we were forbidden to reveal the contents of the Mystic Worlds & stuff, (the vibes were too high for "esques"), they'd be printed in books. And his books were simply reprints of his seminar talks mostly.

          The stories can't be trusted, either, I think. We've seen just one example (Dennis Webber) who was *not* happy to see a personal story he'd sent in his "confidential" IRO printed in an eckbook, and *changed*!! He corrected this at a.r.e. awhile back - he's a member, BTW, not a "detractor". Most eckies would probably just be *thrilled* to see Klemp use their stories, and not even think about accuracy.

          > THe moohanta transcripts were especially dull.....same old same old....after years of it, spirit just cires out for something fresh and ALIVE...
          >

          I think the need for ALIVE was why I explored so much *genuine* spirituality when I was a member.

          Well...I think we're going to keep seeing wonderful things in the future. After all, "keeping secrets" is a tactic used by molesters and abusers. There's no need for it unless there's something nasty that needs to be hidden.

          I'll post Klemp's "toilet" story here. There are a couple other good ones over at a.r.e., too...

          Have a great day & week!

          Hugs,

          Sharon
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