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Re: [dre-talk] Course on Church Documents

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  • susantague@cs.com
    One place to start would be the RCL website which links catechists and others to sites which specialize in the study of Vatican II. Their address is
    Message 1 of 8 , May 1, 2001
      One place to start would be the RCL website which links catechists and others
      to sites which specialize in the study of Vatican II. Their address is
      RCLweb.com. They are connected publishing wise to the Vatican II Center in
      Washington, DC and could be very helpful with just such a project. I'll look
      around for others, but this is a good solid Catholic (pro Vatican II)
      resource. The documents may be downloaded form some of the linked sights and
      some have commentaries which could help the teachers create easy to use
      syllabi for their classes. Good luck and let me know how this project goes.

      Susan
    • Steve Palmer
      Let me clarify: Church Documents can mean many things. If it means Catholic Social Teaching, then it would be included in Catholic morality, would it not?
      Message 2 of 8 , May 1, 2001
        Let me clarify:
        "Church Documents" can mean many things. If it means Catholic Social
        Teaching, then it would be included in Catholic morality, would it not?
        There are loads of other documents pertaining to catechesis, sacraments,
        etc. I assume that you are not talking about a course about all the
        documents.

        There are a number of good books for Catholic Social Teaching:
        Henriot, Peter, Edward De Berri and Michael Schultheis "Catholic Social
        Teaching: Our Best Kept Secret" from Orbis. Has good bibliography of
        collections of Catholic Social Teaching.
        Most recent:
        Pennock, Michael, Catholic Social Teaching:Learning and Living Justice. Ave
        Maria Press, 2000 -
        Claretian Press website has a wonderful history of Catholic Social Teaching
        connecting publication of the encyclicals, and council documents with other
        events at the time of publication. You can order copies of it for classroom
        use.
        Ahlers, Julia and Michael Wilt "Christian Justice: Sharing God's Goodness"
        Winona, MN: St. mary's Press, 1995 is another high school text which
        pertains to the subject.
        Bright, Thomas and John Roberto Justice:Access Guides to Youth Ministry.
        Don Bosco Multimedia 1990 is older but has a great bibliographic resource.
        If you are interested in more detail, I will be happy to oblige. Steve
        Palmer NCEA Dept. of Religious Education palmer@...
        -----Original Message-----
        From: Gilles Côté
        Sent: Monday,April 30,2001 8:38 PM
        To: dre-talk@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [dre-talk] Course on Church Documents

        I received the following email from a High School Teacher. Could
        anyone suggest
        venues she might take to tackle this?

        " Next year, with the seniors, they want me to teach Catholic
        Morality for the
        first half of the school year, and Church Documents for the second
        half. I
        have a teacher's manual for the Morality course, but I am on my own
        to come up
        with a syllabus and lesson plan for the Church documents course.
        HELP! Do you
        know of anywhere that I can call or write to that might have
        something like
        this? Have you ever done anything like this, or know of someone who
        might
        have? Maybe some publishing companies that offer something like
        this might be
        the ones to contact."

        Any advise I could pass on to her would be welcome.

        Gilles




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      • Diana Raiche
        Giles, You may want to forward this email to your friend.[Note: I am unable to underline or italicize titles of books & documents as they should be presented.]
        Message 3 of 8 , May 1, 2001
          Giles,
          You may want to forward this email to your friend.[Note: I am unable to
          underline or italicize titles of books & documents as they should be
          presented.] Although I am not aware of a particular course of study on the
          topic, there are plenty of resources on Church documents, but the teacher
          has to define area(s) of emphasis for this high school class. High school
          seniors should be able to handle primary sources if the instructor is well
          grounded in the nuances of the documents. These are available in
          commentaries on the documents in any Catholic academic library.

          Bill Heubesch (not sure of the spelling of his last name although he is a
          friend of mine (touché)) has a series called Vatican II in Plain English
          published by RCL. At one time he was head of their Vatican II Center. RCL
          also has a wonderful video series on Vatican II. Very engaging for high
          school students and beyond. Bill makes the documents of Vatican council II
          accessible for a lay audience. It wouldn't hurt to have a study edition of
          Vatican Council II: The Conciliar and Post Conciliar Documents, ed. Austin
          Flannery, O.P. on hand as well. I would recommend that an emphasis on the
          four constitutions: Constitution of the Sacred Liturgy, Dogmatic
          Constitution on the Church, Dogmatic Constitution on Divine Revelation,
          Pastoral Constitution on the Church in the Modern World be given priority
          and remember to highlight the chronology of these. That is very important.
          As mentioned, there are commentaries on these. In addition a new history of
          Vatican II in several volumes by Dr. Joseph Komonchak, et al. is on the
          market by Orbis Press. I took Dr. Komonchak's course on Vatican II at CUA.
          There is no greater authority on the subject in the country and he ranks as
          a world class theologian on the subject having been honored for his
          scholarly work on Vatican II by Pope John Paul II on the 30th anniversary of
          the Council. He is also an eye witness of the Council. Bill's book will be
          OK for high school students; the primary sources and Komonchak's work are
          background for the teacher.

          Then there is the compendium of liturgy documents put out by LTP. It has
          good introductory material but there is no substitute for highlighting the
          more significant passages & concepts for the students. These are critical
          for helping students understand what liturgy is and how important the role
          of the assembly is for meaningful liturgical celebration. Next to the
          Constitution of the Sacred Liturgy, The Rite of Christian Initiation of
          Adults is enormously important but the date given in the compendium is
          incorrect. It was first published in 1972 in Latin and its earliest drafts
          actually predate the revised rite of infant baptism and rite of confirmation
          although it came out after these. Source on this is Aidan Kavanaugh. The
          1988 date is the revised edition of the ritual text (RCIA) that was
          promulgated by the US Bishops as the norm for bringing adults/children of
          catechetical age into the Church in US dioceses. The new General Directory
          for Catechesis hails the baptismal catechumenate (RCIA) as the inspiration
          for all catechesis. If the teacher does not know that ritual text
          intimately, I recommend that she/he find someone in the area who is a team
          member with the North American Forum on the Catechumenate and invite them to
          be a guest speaker. The guest speaker idea could work to everyone's
          advantage in the semester that focuses on the documents of the Church. The
          teacher is not expected to be the expert but the facilitator for the course.
          Invite the bishop to speak to the class. The diocesan chancery office is
          also a good resource for guest speakers: head of the liturgy office, head of
          catechetics office, a canon lawyer, etc. Don't forget the diocesan director
          or parish director of music. Well trained ones should know the liturgy
          documents and be able to make the documents on music and environment really
          fun. Even an architect for Catholic Churches would be a good resource.
          Find a Pastor in the locale that has just built or renovated a church
          according to the principles given in the documents.

          In addition to these there are the Catechetical documents, also now
          published in a compendium, by LTP with good introductory material. A well
          trained parish DRE (MA in religious studies or theology) should be a great
          resource on the catechetical documents. Integral to the catechetical
          documents are the ones specific to evangelization. Perhaps there is a
          retired missionary priest or religious living in the area who could be
          helpful. Beyond those are the documents on Catholic Social Teaching (Rerum
          Novarum, a primary source, is of singular importance but the US bishops also
          have a recent document entitled Sharing Catholic Social Teaching: Challenges
          and Directions that would be most helpful -800-235-8722). And the list goes
          on.

          To say you want to study the documents of the Church could take a lifetime.
          Which documents in which century or epoch? Which prior documents are
          connected in what ways to current documents? Narrow the focus and consider
          just how many weeks are available.

          The Daughters of St. Paul Press print Church documents as individual
          booklets for a reasonable fee. If the instructor does not have a good
          background in the documentary tradition of the Church, find someone with
          whom to have a face to face conversation after having defined the goals and
          objectives for the class. For example, documents have a hierarchy of
          importance. Just because a document is promulgated by the Church does not
          mean that all documents are created equal. Those from Rome supercede those
          from Bishops' conferences; Constitutions superseded Decrees etc., etc.,
          Pastorals, although important , are meant to explicate the foundational
          documents and do not contradict or supercede them. The verb structure in
          documents also has a hierarchy - they tell you what you absolutely have to
          do and what is a good idea, etc. You can get this information from the
          commentaries or from a knowledgeable person.

          As far as how to evaluate such a semester: perhaps a research or reflection
          paper on one of the documents; a written journal of all the guest lectures;
          or something more creative, etc., might work. Teaching such a course is a
          great idea and I wish the teacher well. The more well educated Catholics
          are on the sources for what we do as Catholics, the better off the entire
          Church is in the long run. There are people within every community who
          would probably love to assist in this worthwhile undertaking. The question
          makes me want to write a course of study for high school students myself!
          It certainly is needed. Good luck. Three of us in the department of
          religious education at NCEA could be email resources for particular
          questions. Just ask. I hope this response is of some help.

          Best of luck on this wonderful adventure,
          Diana Dudoit Raiche
          NCEA


          -----Original Message-----
          From: Gilles Côté [mailto:d.cote2@...]
          Sent: Monday, April 30, 2001 8:38 PM
          To: dre-talk@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [dre-talk] Course on Church Documents


          I received the following email from a High School Teacher. Could anyone
          suggest
          venues she might take to tackle this?

          " Next year, with the seniors, they want me to teach Catholic Morality for
          the
          first half of the school year, and Church Documents for the second half. I
          have a teacher's manual for the Morality course, but I am on my own to come
          up
          with a syllabus and lesson plan for the Church documents course. HELP! Do
          you
          know of anywhere that I can call or write to that might have something like
          this? Have you ever done anything like this, or know of someone who might
          have? Maybe some publishing companies that offer something like this might
          be
          the ones to contact."

          Any advise I could pass on to her would be welcome.

          Gilles




          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        • bjndre323@aol.com
          Sadlier has a curriculum on Morality for middle school that you may want to look into. I have used the ones they have on Church History and the Creed and they
          Message 4 of 8 , May 1, 2001
            Sadlier has a curriculum on Morality for middle school that you may want to
            look into. I have used the ones they have on Church History and the Creed
            and they are very well done. Barbara
          • Frank Koob
            Comments and resources for working with seniors in HS on Church Docs. 1. Comment. The Council s work at Vatican II shook my soul, me in my early 20 s and
            Message 5 of 8 , May 3, 2001
              Comments and resources for working with seniors in HS on Church Docs.

              1. Comment. The Council's work at Vatican II shook my soul, me in my
              early 20's and beginning ministry in teaching religion in high
              school.
              It has formed my life. For today's generation, the VII docs may seem
              more like Council of Trent stuff than something contemporary. It's
              ancient literature, and in a churchy language that may be hard to
              translate. 2nd Semester, senior year can be deadly

              2. Howerver, I would collect excerpts from these docs, especially the
              documents on the laity, church in the modern world, and approach to
              the other religions. Or, for a computer literate generation of
              learners (which they all are) I would send them with a set of
              questions or worksheet to these documents available on the vatican
              web
              site to hunt for ideas and have them put them in today's language.

              3. Many of the amazing recent US bishops' pastorals are summarized in
              short, well produced videos sold by the USCC. Get there catalog if
              you
              don't have it already: 1-800-235-8722.

              3. A starting point could be the talk the pope gave to youth when he
              visited St. Louis in Jan. 1999, available from USCC, 2 parts at this
              URL: http://www.nccbuscc.org/pope/papalspeeches.htm

              4. The entire USCC web site is filled with resources:
              http://www.nccbuscc.org/

              5. An interactive "Test Your Knowledge of Church Teaching as found in
              the Catechism of the Catholic Church" is also on that site:
              http://www.nccbuscc.org/catechism/quizzes/index.htm

              6. Be part of the writing of future documents. Students can
              participate in surveys like this one on line, also from the bishops:

              7: The "Catechism" is online:
              http://www.nccbuscc.org/catechism/text/index.htm

              8. Some local bishops have written pastorals that are worth studying:

              Cardinal Mahony (Los Angeles) on the dynamic of liturgy in parish
              life. It was on the LA web site, but that is "down" as of this
              writing. http://la-archdiocese.org

              Cardinal George (Chicago)Dwell in My Love: A Pastoral Letter on
              Racism
              (April, 2001)
              http://www.archdiocese-chgo.org/cardinal/dwellinmylove/dwellinmylove.h
              tm

              Archbishop Weakland (Milwaukee) "Eucharist without Walls)
              http://www.archmil.org/resources/userfiles/year2000.html

              Frank Koob
              DRE in Archdiocwe of Chicago
            • Robert Piercy
              Bill is a friend of mine - i remember when he wrote those books. Check with RCL - i think he also has worksheets etc. on the documents. He also had a big
              Message 6 of 8 , May 9, 2001
                Bill is a friend of mine - i remember when he wrote those books. Check
                with RCL - i think he also has worksheets etc. on the documents. He also
                had a big hand in the Echoes of Faith videos.

                He always speaks at the LA Congress - -if you contact Adrian Whittaker at
                the LA-ORE she may be able to give you a way to contact him to see if he
                is speaking in your area.

                Bob Piercy

                Robert W. Piercy, Jr.
                G.I.A. Publications
                Catechetical Coordinator
                Phone 1.800.GIA.1358.ext 40 (outside IL)
                1.708.496.3800 ext.40 (within IL)
                e-mail: robertp@...
                FAX 708.496.3828
              • heidi5272@hotmail.com
                I don t know of any courses, but Bill Huebsch has written a series of books entitled Vatican II in Plain English. Book one is all about the Counci, book two
                Message 7 of 8 , May 10, 2001
                  I don't know of any courses, but Bill Huebsch has written a series of
                  books entitled "Vatican II in Plain English. Book one is all about
                  the Counci, book two about the Constitutions and book three about the
                  Decrees and Declarations. They are wonderfully written and I learned
                  a lot ore by reading this series than I did "TRYING" to read the
                  Documents of Vatican II. The publisher is Thomas More but I think
                  RCL carries them. (if not let me know and i'll find them) There is
                  also a very cool CD called Destination Vatican II, it's an
                  interactive exploration of the Second Vatican Council. I know RCL
                  did this one.


                  Heidi Bichler
                  DRE St. Joseph Parish
                  Sault Ste. Marie, MI

                  --- In dre-talk@y..., Gilles Côté <d.cote2@s...> wrote:
                  > I received the following email from a High School Teacher. Could
                  anyone suggest
                  > venues she might take to tackle this?
                  >
                  > " Next year, with the seniors, they want me to teach Catholic
                  Morality for the
                  > first half of the school year, and Church Documents for the second
                  half. I
                  > have a teacher's manual for the Morality course, but I am on my own
                  to come up
                  > with a syllabus and lesson plan for the Church documents course.
                  HELP! Do you
                  > know of anywhere that I can call or write to that might have
                  something like
                  > this? Have you ever done anything like this, or know of someone
                  who might
                  > have? Maybe some publishing companies that offer something like
                  this might be
                  > the ones to contact."
                  >
                  > Any advise I could pass on to her would be welcome.
                  >
                  > Gilles
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