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Conversation analysis

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  • Dennis Newson
    It s hard to know who to share this with, but, as I was preparing for and after I d taken a shower, I caught most of the program below on Radio 4 BBC.
    Message 1 of 5 , Jun 25, 2013
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      It's hard to know who to share this with, but, as I was preparing for and
      after I'd taken a shower, I caught most of the program below on Radio 4 BBC.




      Elizabeth Stokoe
      Duration: 28 minutesFirst broadcast: Tuesday 25 June 2013

      Jim Al-Khalili talks to the social psychologist Liz Stokoe about her
      research as a conversation analyst. Her interest is in the nuances of
      everyday chit chat but also people going on first dates, the verbal abuse
      between neighbours at war as well as interviews by the Police with
      suspected criminals.

      Liz is professor of social interaction at the University of Loughborough
      and her unusual approach involves collecting and analysing the fine details
      of hundreds of real, spontaneous conversations as a source of raw data.
      This is in contrast to more traditional means, used by other psychologists
      of finding out what people think by asking them directly using surveys and
      questionnaires.

      Her most recent research has overturned ideas about the best ways to teach
      people how to communicate, negotiate or deal with confrontation. Role play
      using actors to stage a scenario, has been seen by many as a gold standard
      training device. But, Liz says there's no evidence to show that it works.
      Her alternative technique is based on her own scientific research and is
      already being widely used by different organisations from the Police to
      Mediation services and even hospitals, to help with doctor patient
      relationships.
      For those interested in "authentic" spoken English and the analysis of
      turn-taking conversations her work seems worth knowing about.

      Greetings to a rather quiet Dogme list.

      Dennis
      --

      --
      *

      *Dennis Newson*
      Formerly : University of Osnabrueck, GERMANY
      Committee member | IATEFL: YLTSIG,GISIG

      Winner British Council ELT 05 Innovation Award

      Personal homepage <http://www.dennisnewson.de/>

      Skype: *Osnacantab*
      Second Life: *Osnacantab Nesterov*


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Carol Goodey
      Hi Dennis Many thanks for highlighting this. It sounds interesting and relevant to those interested in a Dogme approach. I hadn t heard of this series but have
      Message 2 of 5 , Jun 25, 2013
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        Hi Dennis

        Many thanks for highlighting this. It sounds interesting and relevant to those interested in a Dogme approach.

        I hadn't heard of this series but have found that it can be listened to on BBC iPlayer for those with access to it. http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b02ykg4w/The_Life_Scientific_Elizabeth_Stokoe/

        Or, it's available as a podcast, which I think might be more widely available.
        http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/tls

        Thanks,
        Carol



        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Dennis Newson
        To: l
        Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 10:16 AM
        Subject: [dogme] Conversation analysis



        It's hard to know who to share this with, but, as I was preparing for and
        after I'd taken a shower, I caught most of the program below on Radio 4 BBC.

        Elizabeth Stokoe
        Duration: 28 minutesFirst broadcast: Tuesday 25 June 2013

        Jim Al-Khalili talks to the social psychologist Liz Stokoe about her
        research as a conversation analyst. Her interest is in the nuances of
        everyday chit chat but also people going on first dates, the verbal abuse
        between neighbours at war as well as interviews by the Police with
        suspected criminals.

        Liz is professor of social interaction at the University of Loughborough
        and her unusual approach involves collecting and analysing the fine details
        of hundreds of real, spontaneous conversations as a source of raw data.
        This is in contrast to more traditional means, used by other psychologists
        of finding out what people think by asking them directly using surveys and
        questionnaires.

        Her most recent research has overturned ideas about the best ways to teach
        people how to communicate, negotiate or deal with confrontation. Role play
        using actors to stage a scenario, has been seen by many as a gold standard
        training device. But, Liz says there's no evidence to show that it works.
        Her alternative technique is based on her own scientific research and is
        already being widely used by different organisations from the Police to
        Mediation services and even hospitals, to help with doctor patient
        relationships.
        For those interested in "authentic" spoken English and the analysis of
        turn-taking conversations her work seems worth knowing about.

        Greetings to a rather quiet Dogme list.

        Dennis
        --

        --
        *

        *Dennis Newson*
        Formerly : University of Osnabrueck, GERMANY
        Committee member | IATEFL: YLTSIG,GISIG

        Winner British Council ELT 05 Innovation Award

        Personal homepage <http://www.dennisnewson.de/>

        Skype: *Osnacantab*
        Second Life: *Osnacantab Nesterov*

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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        Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
        Version: 2013.0.2904 / Virus Database: 3199/6407 - Release Date: 06/13/13
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        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • M C Johnstone
        Hi Dennis, Thanks for this. Here is a live link to the interview for anyone interested in listening. [1]http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b02ykg4w Conversation
        Message 3 of 5 , Jun 25, 2013
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          Hi Dennis,



          Thanks for this. Here is a live link to the interview for anyone
          interested in listening.



          [1]http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b02ykg4w



          Conversation analysis is a variety of discourse analysis, and seems to
          resemble critical discourse analysis. While critical discourse analysis
          aims to uncover truth or meaning via close analysis of discourse,
          conversation analysis seems to focus on a lower level analysis. Hutchby
          and Woofit (1998) say that the aim of conversation analysis is



          "to discover how [conversation] participants understand and respond to
          one another in their turns at talk, with a central focus being on how
          sequences of interaction are generated... to uncover the tacit
          reasoning procedures and sociolinguistic competencies undelying the
          production and interpretation of talk in organized sequences of action.
          (Cited from Jaworski and Coupland, 1999).



          It's interesting that the focus here is on the generative rules by
          which conversation sequences are said to develop. These rules might be
          said to be a type of "grammar" of conversation.



          These sequences are, most likely, culturally bound so examining them in
          the light of an EFL class could be very productive. With respect to
          "authentic" conversation, Stoake does discuss this toward the end of
          the interview where she says that a lot of discourse training - in the
          context of acting and law enforcement particularly - misses the mark
          precisely because it rests on contrived interaction, which is also
          typical of EFL "conversation training."



          She also points out that these training practices are almost never
          based on any kind of empirical research. This is another point of
          corresponcence with EFL conversation training - and EFL generally.



          How do you think this might be adapted to a Dogme teaching sequence?



          Mark

          __



          Jaworsky, A. and Coupland N. (1999). The Discourse Reader. Routledge:
          New York. p. 16-17.





          On Tue, Jun 25, 2013, at 12:16 PM, Dennis Newson wrote:



          It's hard to know who to share this with, but, as I was preparing for
          and
          after I'd taken a shower, I caught most of the program below on Radio 4
          BBC.

          Elizabeth Stokoe
          Duration: 28 minutesFirst broadcast: Tuesday 25 June 2013

          Jim Al-Khalili talks to the social psychologist Liz Stokoe about her
          research as a conversation analyst. Her interest is in the nuances of
          everyday chit chat but also people going on first dates, the verbal
          abuse
          between neighbours at war as well as interviews by the Police with
          suspected criminals.

          Liz is professor of social interaction at the University of
          Loughborough
          and her unusual approach involves collecting and analysing the fine
          details
          of hundreds of real, spontaneous conversations as a source of raw data.
          This is in contrast to more traditional means, used by other
          psychologists
          of finding out what people think by asking them directly using surveys
          and
          questionnaires.

          Her most recent research has overturned ideas about the best ways to
          teach
          people how to communicate, negotiate or deal with confrontation. Role
          play
          using actors to stage a scenario, has been seen by many as a gold
          standard
          training device. But, Liz says there's no evidence to show that it
          works.
          Her alternative technique is based on her own scientific research and
          is
          already being widely used by different organisations from the Police to
          Mediation services and even hospitals, to help with doctor patient
          relationships.
          For those interested in "authentic" spoken English and the analysis of
          turn-taking conversations her work seems worth knowing about.

          Greetings to a rather quiet Dogme list.

          Dennis
          --

          --
          *

          *Dennis Newson*
          Formerly : University of Osnabrueck, GERMANY
          Committee member | IATEFL: YLTSIG,GISIG

          Winner British Council ELT 05 Innovation Award

          Personal homepage <[2]http://www.dennisnewson.de/>

          Skype: *Osnacantab*
          Second Life: *Osnacantab Nesterov*

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





          --
          mcjsa@...

          References

          1. http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b02ykg4w
          2. http://www.dennisnewson.de/
          3. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dogme/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJxNHU0Z3JsBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2NTM2NzIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDQzMzM2BG1zZ0lkAzE3NDU3BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3JwbHkEc3RpbWUDMTM3MjE1MTgxMA--?act=reply&messageNum=17457
          4. mailto:djn@...?subject=Re%3A%20Conversation%20analysis
          5. mailto:dogme@yahoogroups.com?subject=Re%3A%20Conversation%20analysis
          6. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dogme/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJlbnQ4bDJlBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2NTM2NzIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDQzMzM2BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA250cGMEc3RpbWUDMTM3MjE1MTgxMA--
          7. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dogme/message/17457;_ylc=X3oDMTM2MDY3ZTF0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2NTM2NzIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDQzMzM2BG1zZ0lkAzE3NDU3BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3Z0cGMEc3RpbWUDMTM3MjE1MTgxMAR0cGNJZAMxNzQ1Nw--
          8. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dogme/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJmMzQ0NGFhBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2NTM2NzIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDQzMzM2BHNlYwN2dGwEc2xrA3ZtYnJzBHN0aW1lAzEzNzIxNTE4MTA-?o=6
          9. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dogme;_ylc=X3oDMTJlajk5cDRuBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2NTM2NzIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDQzMzM2BHNlYwN2dGwEc2xrA3ZnaHAEc3RpbWUDMTM3MjE1MTgxMA--
          10. http://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTJkODdpZjdvBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2NTM2NzIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDQzMzM2BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxMzcyMTUxODEw
          11. mailto:dogme-traditional@yahoogroups.com?subject=Change%20Delivery%20Format:%20Traditional
          12. mailto:dogme-digest@yahoogroups.com?subject=Email%20Delivery:%20Digest
          13. mailto:dogme-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe
          14. http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          15. mailto:ygroupsnotifications@yahoogroups.com?subject=Feedback%20on%20the%20redesigned%20individual%20mail%20v1


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Rob
          The interview was interesting, Dennis, although I wish it had gone into greater depth about Liz Stokoe s work rather than her biography. Such detail would of
          Message 4 of 5 , Jun 25, 2013
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            The interview was interesting, Dennis, although I wish it had gone into greater depth about Liz Stokoe's work rather than her biography. Such detail would of course not be interesting or entertaining to a general audience though.

            There are teachers among us who encourage students to study live conversation, or talk as data, then attempt to facilitate the teasing out of useful turns, starters, and bits of language that will help learners navigate interaction in the target language. Again, I appreciate the difference between ESL and EFL settings when I consider how rich the L1 environment can be for a learner looking to 'mine' data, eg, eavesdrop on the bus.

            In many instances, I think the dogme teacher uses the language of the classroom as materia prima for the alchemical process that occurs when students, striving to make meaning and establish an identity, start throwing in odds and ends from their personal bag of words and/or phrases, or, if more fluent, begin to rattle of sentences that might need fine tuning. This personalizes the experience, as we all know, which might not always be appropriate to the learning context or culture. In that regard, it might make students more comfortable to just look at or listen to a bit of conversation between speakers they view as 'expert' users.

            Still, we know the importance and significance of actually producing the target language. Conversation analysis can pick apart this learner-generated language, as inauthentic as it may be, to help students construct more genuine features in future conversations. Certainly, holding up a student-generated chat about the weekend, next to a conversation about the weekend between two 'more expert' users might prove valuable, especially if students feel such conversation is within their ability with help from the teacher, classmates, and other resources. D

            A role play underwritten by authentic data sounds intriguing. I'm sure it won't be long - like yesterday - before we see textbooks that incorporate CARM (Conversation Analytic Role-Play Method) into activities and tasks.

            As someone who focused on critical discourse analysis for his Master's thesis, I find it quite suits people like Ms. Stokoe, who enjoys analysis and thinks critically. Such work is highly interesting once the results are in - though those results are never conclusive - but the process of discourse analysis can leave the soul yearning for poetry, music, and watching daisies gently sway in the wind. That was my experience anyway. And, in the end, I'd learned that the corruption of institutions and education employs language to execute its agenda and maintain power. Big surprise? Not really, and knowing how it was done didn't seem to interest anyone beyond the academic community, who are less analytical and just want to get on with life.

            So a richer pursuit might be how to educate, rather than train, police, lawyers, etc. Rather than making them more clever analysts, we might help those who deal with conflict and human suffering to understand themselves and the people they work with as human beings rather than subjects. Maybe a closer examination of Ms. Stokoe's work would have revealed how that is possible. And, maybe I've not given the subject enough thought.

            Thanks for breaking the silence, Dennis.

            Rob

            Sent from my iPad

            On Jun 25, 2013, at 2:16 AM, Dennis Newson <djn@...> wrote:

            > It's hard to know who to share this with, but, as I was preparing for and
            > after I'd taken a shower, I caught most of the program below on Radio 4 BBC.
            >
            > Elizabeth Stokoe
            > Duration: 28 minutesFirst broadcast: Tuesday 25 June 2013
            >
            > Jim Al-Khalili talks to the social psychologist Liz Stokoe about her
            > research as a conversation analyst. Her interest is in the nuances of
            > everyday chit chat but also people going on first dates, the verbal abuse
            > between neighbours at war as well as interviews by the Police with
            > suspected criminals.
            >
            > Liz is professor of social interaction at the University of Loughborough
            > and her unusual approach involves collecting and analysing the fine details
            > of hundreds of real, spontaneous conversations as a source of raw data.
            > This is in contrast to more traditional means, used by other psychologists
            > of finding out what people think by asking them directly using surveys and
            > questionnaires.
            >
            > Her most recent research has overturned ideas about the best ways to teach
            > people how to communicate, negotiate or deal with confrontation. Role play
            > using actors to stage a scenario, has been seen by many as a gold standard
            > training device. But, Liz says there's no evidence to show that it works.
            > Her alternative technique is based on her own scientific research and is
            > already being widely used by different organisations from the Police to
            > Mediation services and even hospitals, to help with doctor patient
            > relationships.
            > For those interested in "authentic" spoken English and the analysis of
            > turn-taking conversations her work seems worth knowing about.
            >
            > Greetings to a rather quiet Dogme list.
            >
            > Dennis
            > --
            >
            > --
            > *
            >
            > *Dennis Newson*
            > Formerly : University of Osnabrueck, GERMANY
            > Committee member | IATEFL: YLTSIG,GISIG
            >
            > Winner British Council ELT 05 Innovation Award
            >
            > Personal homepage <http://www.dennisnewson.de/>
            >
            > Skype: *Osnacantab*
            > Second Life: *Osnacantab Nesterov*
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Dennis Newson
            Just a footnote to Rob s thought-provoking piece on Professor Stoke s CARM and her kind of conversation analysis. There is always the fact, that we do not need
            Message 5 of 5 , Jun 25, 2013
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              Just a footnote to Rob's thought-provoking piece on Professor Stoke's CARM
              and her kind of conversation analysis. There is always the fact, that we do
              not need to assume that any new insights into aspects of language and
              language use that are of some benefit to us as teachers/facilitators,
              educators, individuals can or need to be directly and immediately applied
              in classsroom practices.

              Dennis


              On 25 June 2013 20:09, Rob <hainesrm@...> wrote:

              > The interview was interesting, Dennis, although I wish it had gone into
              > greater depth about Liz Stokoe's work rather than her biography. Such
              > detail would of course not be interesting or entertaining to a general
              > audience though.
              >
              > There are teachers among us who encourage students to study live
              > conversation, or talk as data, then attempt to facilitate the teasing out
              > of useful turns, starters, and bits of language that will help learners
              > navigate interaction in the target language. Again, I appreciate the
              > difference between ESL and EFL settings when I consider how rich the L1
              > environment can be for a learner looking to 'mine' data, eg, eavesdrop on
              > the bus.
              >
              > In many instances, I think the dogme teacher uses the language of the
              > classroom as materia prima for the alchemical process that occurs when
              > students, striving to make meaning and establish an identity, start
              > throwing in odds and ends from their personal bag of words and/or phrases,
              > or, if more fluent, begin to rattle of sentences that might need fine
              > tuning. This personalizes the experience, as we all know, which might not
              > always be appropriate to the learning context or culture. In that regard,
              > it might make students more comfortable to just look at or listen to a bit
              > of conversation between speakers they view as 'expert' users.
              >
              > Still, we know the importance and significance of actually producing the
              > target language. Conversation analysis can pick apart this
              > learner-generated language, as inauthentic as it may be, to help students
              > construct more genuine features in future conversations. Certainly, holding
              > up a student-generated chat about the weekend, next to a conversation about
              > the weekend between two 'more expert' users might prove valuable,
              > especially if students feel such conversation is within their ability with
              > help from the teacher, classmates, and other resources. D
              >
              > A role play underwritten by authentic data sounds intriguing. I'm sure it
              > won't be long - like yesterday - before we see textbooks that incorporate
              > CARM (Conversation Analytic Role-Play Method) into activities and tasks.
              >
              > As someone who focused on critical discourse analysis for his Master's
              > thesis, I find it quite suits people like Ms. Stokoe, who enjoys analysis
              > and thinks critically. Such work is highly interesting once the results are
              > in - though those results are never conclusive - but the process of
              > discourse analysis can leave the soul yearning for poetry, music, and
              > watching daisies gently sway in the wind. That was my experience anyway.
              > And, in the end, I'd learned that the corruption of institutions and
              > education employs language to execute its agenda and maintain power. Big
              > surprise? Not really, and knowing how it was done didn't seem to interest
              > anyone beyond the academic community, who are less analytical and just want
              > to get on with life.
              >
              > So a richer pursuit might be how to educate, rather than train, police,
              > lawyers, etc. Rather than making them more clever analysts, we might help
              > those who deal with conflict and human suffering to understand themselves
              > and the people they work with as human beings rather than subjects. Maybe a
              > closer examination of Ms. Stokoe's work would have revealed how that is
              > possible. And, maybe I've not given the subject enough thought.
              >
              > Thanks for breaking the silence, Dennis.
              >
              > Rob
              >
              > Sent from my iPad
              >
              > On Jun 25, 2013, at 2:16 AM, Dennis Newson <djn@...> wrote:
              >
              > > It's hard to know who to share this with, but, as I was preparing for and
              > > after I'd taken a shower, I caught most of the program below on Radio 4
              > BBC.
              > >
              > > Elizabeth Stokoe
              > > Duration: 28 minutesFirst broadcast: Tuesday 25 June 2013
              > >
              > > Jim Al-Khalili talks to the social psychologist Liz Stokoe about her
              > > research as a conversation analyst. Her interest is in the nuances of
              > > everyday chit chat but also people going on first dates, the verbal abuse
              > > between neighbours at war as well as interviews by the Police with
              > > suspected criminals.
              > >
              > > Liz is professor of social interaction at the University of Loughborough
              > > and her unusual approach involves collecting and analysing the fine
              > details
              > > of hundreds of real, spontaneous conversations as a source of raw data.
              > > This is in contrast to more traditional means, used by other
              > psychologists
              > > of finding out what people think by asking them directly using surveys
              > and
              > > questionnaires.
              > >
              > > Her most recent research has overturned ideas about the best ways to
              > teach
              > > people how to communicate, negotiate or deal with confrontation. Role
              > play
              > > using actors to stage a scenario, has been seen by many as a gold
              > standard
              > > training device. But, Liz says there's no evidence to show that it works.
              > > Her alternative technique is based on her own scientific research and is
              > > already being widely used by different organisations from the Police to
              > > Mediation services and even hospitals, to help with doctor patient
              > > relationships.
              > > For those interested in "authentic" spoken English and the analysis of
              > > turn-taking conversations her work seems worth knowing about.
              > >
              > > Greetings to a rather quiet Dogme list.
              > >
              > > Dennis
              > > --
              > >
              > > --
              > > *
              > >
              > > *Dennis Newson*
              > > Formerly : University of Osnabrueck, GERMANY
              > > Committee member | IATEFL: YLTSIG,GISIG
              > >
              > > Winner British Council ELT 05 Innovation Award
              > >
              > > Personal homepage <http://www.dennisnewson.de/>
              > >
              > > Skype: *Osnacantab*
              > > Second Life: *Osnacantab Nesterov*
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >
              > ------------------------------------
              >
              > To Post a message, send it to: dogme@...
              > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: dogme-unsubscribe@...!
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              >
              >
              >
              >


              --

              --
              *

              *Dennis Newson*
              Formerly : University of Osnabrueck, GERMANY
              Committee member | IATEFL: YLTSIG,GISIG

              Winner British Council ELT 05 Innovation Award

              Personal homepage <http://www.dennisnewson.de/>

              Skype: *Osnacantab*
              Second Life: *Osnacantab Nesterov*


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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