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Unknown Problem

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  • meisam olamazadeh
    Hi I built a 3d printer based on DLP tecnology and I was solve almost problem but I have a bad problem that I spent a lot of money and time for it and I
    Message 1 of 13 , Aug 4, 2012
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      Hi
      I built a 3d printer based on DLP tecnology and I was solve almost problem but I have a bad problem that I spent a lot of money and time for it and I coudn't solve it.
      My problem is:
      When I do print a object, the first layers stick very good to build base and after printing about 15mm, some part of layers start stick to vat and not stick to previuse layers and grow on vat.
      I used a vat coated with teflon and transparent silicon but still I have this problem.
      I used original envisionttec resin (WIC100).

      I want you help me tosolve this problem.

      Meysam 
    • richkang78
      Hi Meysam, Is it possible that you are not developing layers long enough so that the polymerization does not reach the previous layers? My understanding is
      Message 2 of 13 , Aug 4, 2012
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        Hi Meysam,

        Is it possible that you are not developing layers long enough so that the polymerization does not reach the previous layers? My understanding is that it happens from the bottom up. The only possibility for this is that your tolerances are off and your slice layer height is changing after 15mm.

        Also, have you tried a plain glass or silanized glass vat yet? I thought that envisiontec didn't use silicone or teflon in their vats.

        When you say that layers begin to "stick" to the vat, is it really sticking "like glue"? What type of silicone are you using as a coating?

        Rich
        --- In diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com, meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi
        > I built a 3d printer based on DLP tecnology and I was solve almost problem but I have a bad problem that I spent a lot of money and time for it and I coudn't solve it.
        > My problem is:
        > When I do print a object, the first layers stick very good to build base and after printing about 15mm, some part of layers start stick to vat and not stick to previuse layers and grow on vat.
        > I used a vat coated with teflon and transparent silicon but still I have this problem.
        > I used original envisionttec resin (WIC100).
        >
        > I want you help me tosolve this problem.
        >
        > Meysam�
        >
      • Lino
        Sounds to me that if you are having material sticking to the vat you have some light overspill or uv contamination. I mean to say that it sounds like the other
        Message 3 of 13 , Aug 4, 2012
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          Sounds to me that if you are having material sticking to the vat you have some light overspill or uv contamination. I mean to say that it sounds like the other parts of your equipment are being exposed to your light somehow

           

          From: diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com [mailto:diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of richkang78
          Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 8:41 AM
          To: diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Re: Unknown Problem

           

           

          Hi Meysam,

          Is it possible that you are not developing layers long enough so that the polymerization does not reach the previous layers? My understanding is that it happens from the bottom up. The only possibility for this is that your tolerances are off and your slice layer height is changing after 15mm.

          Also, have you tried a plain glass or silanized glass vat yet? I thought that envisiontec didn't use silicone or teflon in their vats.

          When you say that layers begin to "stick" to the vat, is it really sticking "like glue"? What type of silicone are you using as a coating?

          Rich

          --- In diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com, meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi
          > I built a 3d printer based on DLP tecnology and I was solve almost problem but I have a bad problem that I spent a lot of money and time for it and I coudn't solve it.
          > My problem is:
          > When I do print a object, the first layers stick very good to build base and after printing about 15mm, some part of layers start stick to vat and not stick to previuse layers and grow on vat.
          > I used a vat coated with teflon and transparent silicon but still I have this problem.
          > I used original envisionttec resin (WIC100).
          >
          > I want you help me tosolve this problem.
          >
          > Meysam�
          >

        • meisam olamazadeh
          My expose time per layer is 3 second and thicknes of each layer is 0.035mm.  this resin (WIC100) in 3 second can polymer 0.12mm. My machine hasn t any
          Message 4 of 13 , Aug 4, 2012
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            My expose time per layer is 3 second and thicknes of each layer is 0.035mm. 
            this resin (WIC100) in 3 second can polymer 0.12mm.
            My machine hasn't any tolerances.
            I'm using transparent silicone.
            I think maybe my vat coating is not suitable! 

            dear lino: Can you explain more?
          • Lino
            Yes, for instance are your getting ambient light into your build area. Envisiontec uses a Uv blocking dome that prevents ambient light from catalyzing the
            Message 5 of 13 , Aug 4, 2012
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              Yes, for instance are your getting ambient light into your build area. Envisiontec uses a Uv blocking dome that prevents ambient light from catalyzing the resin. SLA machines have a special UV blocking film that blocks that wavelength from catalyzing the resin too. Some people print in a darkened room. Is your projector focused well? What is the quality of your projector? Are your blacks that you are projected true black? Because if they are not or not as dark as possible you will be catalyzing resin in other places than you intend.

               

              In my experience if materials are not compatible they would just not catalyze at all. So if you are having issues with the resin sticking to the vat itself that should not be the compatibility of the Teflon and silicone.

               

              From: diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com [mailto:diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of meisam olamazadeh
              Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 11:31 AM
              To: diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Re: Unknown Problem

               

               

              My expose time per layer is 3 second and thicknes of each layer is 0.035mm. 

              this resin (WIC100) in 3 second can polymer 0.12mm.

              My machine hasn't any tolerances.

              I'm using transparent silicone.

              I think maybe my vat coating is not suitable! 

               

              dear lino: Can you explain more?

            • Sinan Demir
              hi meisam your problem will be simple and continuous.. solution of the problem, the following substances; 1)tray resin, Teflon film will be 2)between the
              Message 6 of 13 , Aug 4, 2012
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                hi meisam
                your problem will be simple and continuous..
                solution of the problem, the following substances;
                1)tray resin, Teflon film will be
                2)between the z-axis with the resin tray,,, should not be any spaces ( Not even the 0.02 mm)
                3) resin plate, tilt motion must
                4) support parts of the light period (other than slices) 4 times longer be...( sample normla slices 8 sec. but sapport slices 32 sec)
                5) The light color (model light color),,should be blue
                6) light power be 1200 or 1400 lumens..
                7) implements all of them,,, you will not be the problem
                Kimden: meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...>
                Kime: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                Gönderildiği Tarih: 4 Ağustos 2012 12:01 Cumartesi
                Konu: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem



                Hi
                I built a 3d printer based on DLP tecnology and I was solve almost problem but I have a bad problem that I spent a lot of money and time for it and I coudn't solve it.
                My problem is:
                When I do print a object, the first layers stick very good to build base and after printing about 15mm, some part of layers start stick to vat and not stick to previuse layers and grow on vat.
                I used a vat coated with teflon and transparent silicon but still I have this problem.
                I used original envisionttec resin (WIC100).

                I want you help me tosolve this problem.

                Meysam 




              • meisam olamazadeh
                Hi dear Sinan Thank you for your advise. I used Teflon film and tilt motion. Is it important the thickness of Teflon film? Light power of my projector is 3600
                Message 7 of 13 , Aug 4, 2012
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                  Hi dear Sinan
                  Thank you for your advise.
                  I used Teflon film and tilt motion.
                  Is it important the thickness of Teflon film?
                  Light power of my projector is 3600 lumens.
                  My light color is white, is this important?
                  Spaces between z-axis and resin tray is 0.035mm(thickness of each layer).


                  From: Sinan Demir <troy_3ddesign@...>
                  To: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Saturday, August 4, 2012 10:58 PM
                  Subject: Yan: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem

                   
                  hi meisam
                  your problem will be simple and continuous..
                  solution of the problem, the following substances;
                  1)tray resin, Teflon film will be
                  2)between the z-axis with the resin tray,,, should not be any spaces ( Not even the 0.02 mm)
                  3) resin plate, tilt motion must
                  4) support parts of the light period (other than slices) 4 times longer be...( sample normla slices 8 sec. but sapport slices 32 sec)
                  5) The light color (model light color),,should be blue
                  6) light power be 1200 or 1400 lumens..
                  7) implements all of them,,, you will not be the problem
                  Kimden: meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...>
                  Kime: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                  Gönderildiği Tarih: 4 Ağustos 2012 12:01 Cumartesi
                  Konu: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem



                  Hi
                  I built a 3d printer based on DLP tecnology and I was solve almost problem but I have a bad problem that I spent a lot of money and time for it and I coudn't solve it.
                  My problem is:
                  When I do print a object, the first layers stick very good to build base and after printing about 15mm, some part of layers start stick to vat and not stick to previuse layers and grow on vat.
                  I used a vat coated with teflon and transparent silicon but still I have this problem.
                  I used original envisionttec resin (WIC100).

                  I want you help me tosolve this problem.

                  Meysam 






                • Sinan Demir
                  The thickness of Teflon does not matter Adjust the brightness value 40%  and Adjust the contrast of the same rate.. White light is not good (for envisionttec
                  Message 8 of 13 , Aug 4, 2012
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                    The thickness of Teflon does not matter

                    Adjust the brightness value 40%  and Adjust the contrast of the same rate..
                    White light is not good (for envisionttec resin WIC100.)...original  machine (perfactory envısıontec) uses the blue color..
                    The first layer, no spaces ,,0 = 0 spaces
                    Do not make a very large area and production,,
                    calculation of the ;
                    sample: for 1920 x 1080 porjector    ( lens setting)
                             x and y table size :      1920 / 23.33 =82.29mm
                                                              1080 / 23.33  =46.29mm
                    If larger, the models would tear...and tilt motion work very slowly
                     
                    these settings if you do you,,machine will run smoothly
                     

                    Kimden: meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...>
                    Kime: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                    Gönderildiği Tarih: 5 Ağustos 2012 3:50 Pazar
                    Konu: Re: Yan: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem



                    Hi dear Sinan
                    Thank you for your advise.
                    I used Teflon film and tilt motion.
                    Is it important the thickness of Teflon film?
                    Light power of my projector is 3600 lumens.
                    My light color is white, is this important?
                    Spaces between z-axis and resin tray is 0.035mm(thickness of each layer).

                    From: Sinan Demir <troy_3ddesign@...>
                    To: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Saturday, August 4, 2012 10:58 PM
                    Subject: Yan: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem

                     
                    hi meisam
                    your problem will be simple and continuous..
                    solution of the problem, the following substances;
                    1)tray resin, Teflon film will be
                    2)between the z-axis with the resin tray,,, should not be any spaces ( Not even the 0.02 mm)
                    3) resin plate, tilt motion must
                    4) support parts of the light period (other than slices) 4 times longer be...( sample normla slices 8 sec. but sapport slices 32 sec)
                    5) The light color (model light color),,should be blue
                    6) light power be 1200 or 1400 lumens..
                    7) implements all of them,,, you will not be the problem
                    Kimden: meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...>
                    Kime: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                    Gönderildiği Tarih: 4 Ağustos 2012 12:01 Cumartesi
                    Konu: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem



                    Hi
                    I built a 3d printer based on DLP tecnology and I was solve almost problem but I have a bad problem that I spent a lot of money and time for it and I coudn't solve it.
                    My problem is:
                    When I do print a object, the first layers stick very good to build base and after printing about 15mm, some part of layers start stick to vat and not stick to previuse layers and grow on vat.
                    I used a vat coated with teflon and transparent silicon but still I have this problem.
                    I used original envisionttec resin (WIC100).

                    I want you help me tosolve this problem.

                    Meysam 










                  • meisam olamazadeh
                    Sinan I did print based your method but I have that problem. I don t know what should I do! where do you live? Can I see your machine?
                    Message 9 of 13 , Aug 5, 2012
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                      Sinan
                      I did print based your method but I have that problem.
                      I don't know what should I do!
                      where do you live? Can I see your machine?


                      From: Sinan Demir <troy_3ddesign@...>
                      To: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                      Sent: Sunday, August 5, 2012 4:43 AM
                      Subject: Yan: Yan: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem

                       
                      The thickness of Teflon does not matter

                      Adjust the brightness value 40%  and Adjust the contrast of the same rate..
                      White light is not good (for envisionttec resin WIC100.)...original  machine (perfactory envısıontec) uses the blue color..
                      The first layer, no spaces ,,0 = 0 spaces
                      Do not make a very large area and production,,
                      calculation of the ;
                      sample: for 1920 x 1080 porjector    ( lens setting)
                               x and y table size :      1920 / 23.33 =82.29mm
                                                                1080 / 23.33  =46.29mm
                      If larger, the models would tear...and tilt motion work very slowly
                       
                      these settings if you do you,,machine will run smoothly
                       

                      Kimden: meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...>
                      Kime: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                      Gönderildiği Tarih: 5 Ağustos 2012 3:50 Pazar
                      Konu: Re: Yan: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem



                      Hi dear Sinan
                      Thank you for your advise.
                      I used Teflon film and tilt motion.
                      Is it important the thickness of Teflon film?
                      Light power of my projector is 3600 lumens.
                      My light color is white, is this important?
                      Spaces between z-axis and resin tray is 0.035mm(thickness of each layer).

                      From: Sinan Demir <troy_3ddesign@...>
                      To: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                      Sent: Saturday, August 4, 2012 10:58 PM
                      Subject: Yan: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem

                       
                      hi meisam
                      your problem will be simple and continuous..
                      solution of the problem, the following substances;
                      1)tray resin, Teflon film will be
                      2)between the z-axis with the resin tray,,, should not be any spaces ( Not even the 0.02 mm)
                      3) resin plate, tilt motion must
                      4) support parts of the light period (other than slices) 4 times longer be...( sample normla slices 8 sec. but sapport slices 32 sec)
                      5) The light color (model light color),,should be blue
                      6) light power be 1200 or 1400 lumens..
                      7) implements all of them,,, you will not be the problem
                      Kimden: meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...>
                      Kime: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                      Gönderildiği Tarih: 4 Ağustos 2012 12:01 Cumartesi
                      Konu: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem



                      Hi
                      I built a 3d printer based on DLP tecnology and I was solve almost problem but I have a bad problem that I spent a lot of money and time for it and I coudn't solve it.
                      My problem is:
                      When I do print a object, the first layers stick very good to build base and after printing about 15mm, some part of layers start stick to vat and not stick to previuse layers and grow on vat.
                      I used a vat coated with teflon and transparent silicon but still I have this problem.
                      I used original envisionttec resin (WIC100).

                      I want you help me tosolve this problem.

                      Meysam 












                    • Sinan Demir
                      I m having Turkey part of the problem you are sending pictures to me,,I can help but I need to see details.. I am 15 years of professional user of the machine
                      Message 10 of 13 , Aug 5, 2012
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                        I'm having Turkey
                        part of the problem you are sending pictures to me,,I can help but I need to see details..
                        I am 15 years of professional user of the machine (3D Systems envision hr...perfactory envisintec aureus and solidsape t66 bt2--they have sufficient knowledge and experience about--)
                        I'll share some pictures soon..(I did four different machines---detailed pictures of all---recently )
                         
                        Kimden: meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...>
                        Kime: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                        Gönderildiği Tarih: 5 Ağustos 2012 21:37 Pazar
                        Konu: Re: Yan: Yan: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem



                        Sinan
                        I did print based your method but I have that problem.
                        I don't know what should I do!
                        where do you live? Can I see your machine?

                        From: Sinan Demir <troy_3ddesign@...>
                        To: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                        Sent: Sunday, August 5, 2012 4:43 AM
                        Subject: Yan: Yan: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem

                         
                        The thickness of Teflon does not matter

                        Adjust the brightness value 40%  and Adjust the contrast of the same rate..
                        White light is not good (for envisionttec resin WIC100.)...original  machine (perfactory envısıontec) uses the blue color..
                        The first layer, no spaces ,,0 = 0 spaces
                        Do not make a very large area and production,,
                        calculation of the ;
                        sample: for 1920 x 1080 porjector    ( lens setting)
                                 x and y table size :      1920 / 23.33 =82.29mm
                                                                  1080 / 23.33  =46.29mm
                        If larger, the models would tear...and tilt motion work very slowly
                         
                        these settings if you do you,,machine will run smoothly
                         

                        Kimden: meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...>
                        Kime: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                        Gönderildiği Tarih: 5 Ağustos 2012 3:50 Pazar
                        Konu: Re: Yan: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem



                        Hi dear Sinan
                        Thank you for your advise.
                        I used Teflon film and tilt motion.
                        Is it important the thickness of Teflon film?
                        Light power of my projector is 3600 lumens.
                        My light color is white, is this important?
                        Spaces between z-axis and resin tray is 0.035mm(thickness of each layer).

                        From: Sinan Demir <troy_3ddesign@...>
                        To: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                        Sent: Saturday, August 4, 2012 10:58 PM
                        Subject: Yan: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem

                         
                        hi meisam
                        your problem will be simple and continuous..
                        solution of the problem, the following substances;
                        1)tray resin, Teflon film will be
                        2)between the z-axis with the resin tray,,, should not be any spaces ( Not even the 0.02 mm)
                        3) resin plate, tilt motion must
                        4) support parts of the light period (other than slices) 4 times longer be...( sample normla slices 8 sec. but sapport slices 32 sec)
                        5) The light color (model light color),,should be blue
                        6) light power be 1200 or 1400 lumens..
                        7) implements all of them,,, you will not be the problem
                        Kimden: meisam olamazadeh <molamazadeh@...>
                        Kime: "diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com" <diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com>
                        Gönderildiği Tarih: 4 Ağustos 2012 12:01 Cumartesi
                        Konu: [diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication] Unknown Problem



                        Hi
                        I built a 3d printer based on DLP tecnology and I was solve almost problem but I have a bad problem that I spent a lot of money and time for it and I coudn't solve it.
                        My problem is:
                        When I do print a object, the first layers stick very good to build base and after printing about 15mm, some part of layers start stick to vat and not stick to previuse layers and grow on vat.
                        I used a vat coated with teflon and transparent silicon but still I have this problem.
                        I used original envisionttec resin (WIC100).

                        I want you help me tosolve this problem.

                        Meysam 
















                      • sametyesilyurt
                        Dear Sinan Merhabalar! I think that you live in Turkey? Me and my friend are trying to build a 3D printer and we have also same problem that resin stick to
                        Message 11 of 13 , Dec 8, 2013
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                          Dear Sinan

                          Merhabalar! I think that you live in Turkey? Me and my friend are trying to build a 3D printer and we have also same problem that resin stick to vat.One of the solution is to use Teflon film but we dont know  where we can find Teflon Film in İstanbul. If you know some places can you help us? 

                        • Sinan Demir
                          abı turkce bılıyorum ya :) turkce yazabılırsın :) 8 Aralık 2013 23:19 Pazar tarihinde sametyesilyurt@yahoo.com.tr
                          Message 12 of 13 , Dec 9, 2013
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                            abı turkce bılıyorum ya :) turkce yazabılırsın :)


                            8 Aralık 2013 23:19 Pazar tarihinde "sametyesilyurt@..." <sametyesilyurt@...> şöyle yazdı:


                            Dear Sinan
                            Merhabalar! I think that you live in Turkey? Me and my friend are trying to build a 3D printer and we have also same problem that resin stick to vat.One of the solution is to use Teflon film but we dont know  where we can find Teflon Film in İstanbul. If you know some places can you help us? 




                          • Samet Yeşilyurt
                            Haklısın ama grupta millet ingilizce konuşunca bende devam ettireyim dedim sonuçta ne konuştuğumuzu merak edebilirler :)  Bazen böyle gruplarda kendi
                            Message 13 of 13 , Dec 9, 2013
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                              Haklısın ama grupta millet ingilizce konuşunca bende devam ettireyim dedim sonuçta ne konuştuğumuzu merak edebilirler :)  Bazen böyle gruplarda kendi dillerinde konuşulmak hoş karşılanmayabiliyor. Bu işlerle ilgilenen birini görmek beni gerçekten memnun etti bitirme projemizi 3boyutlu yazıcılar üzerine aldık ancak kullandığımız madde cama yapışıyor bunun için film önermişsiniz, sizde var mı ya da temin edebileceğimiz biryer biliyor musunuz? Teşekkürler :D 


                              9 Aralık 2013 14:15 Pazartesi tarihinde Sinan Demir <troy_3ddesign@...> şöyle yazdı:
                               
                              abı turkce bılıyorum ya :) turkce yazabılırsın :)


                              8 Aralık 2013 23:19 Pazar tarihinde "sametyesilyurt@..." <sametyesilyurt@...> şöyle yazdı:


                              Dear Sinan
                              Merhabalar! I think that you live in Turkey? Me and my friend are trying to build a 3D printer and we have also same problem that resin stick to vat.One of the solution is to use Teflon film but we dont know  where we can find Teflon Film in İstanbul. If you know some places can you help us? 






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