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  • asmotaku
    Hello everyone. As this groups doesn t take advantages of Yahoo groups polling system, I m using a simple post to make one (or two btw). Which of these OS are
    Message 1 of 8 , May 4, 2010
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      Hello everyone.

      As this groups doesn't take advantages of Yahoo groups polling system, I'm using
      a simple post to make one (or two btw).

      Which of these OS are you (planning) using to control your 3d printer:

      * Windows XP SP2.
      * Windows XP SP3 (latest release of XP).
      * Vista / Windows Seven
      * Other, not mentionned.

      Are you directly controlling the printing head of your 3dp, having it's
      proprietary controller ripped off :

      * YES, I use ATMEL, MICROCHIP, FPGA or whatever, through a custom interface.
      * NO, my printer is still partially/fully recognised by my OS, and I'm using it
      as-is to print my slices.


      Your answers will weight in the balance VS OpenGL/DirectX9/Xna for me to begin
      an .Net Open Source implementation of a software I'm planning to call InkStacks,
      which will ease the 3dp slicing/printing process for enthusiast 3dp rookies.
      It'll be taking advandage of geometry transformation plugins (shell this,
      chamfer that, erode this, dilate that, tell this to my custom interface now,
      etc), processing settings files, and dynamic rendering/progress report in order
      to process STL files and other open 3D files formats. I know our dears Afogassa
      and Sid3622 already offered something similar, but not fully versatile yet (to
      my taste anyway, no offense guys).

      So please, feel free to vote.

      By the way, If our moderator Joseph could open a poll on this, I'd be quite happy
      about it.
    • Kaan Demirtas
      Dear Asmotaku, İ would be very pleased to see some more working on .net. Please post me as you start this project. I still did not start building my 3d
      Message 2 of 8 , May 4, 2010
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        Dear Asmotaku,
        İ would be very pleased to see some more working on .net. Please post
        me as you start this project. I still did not start building my 3d
        printer and I would rather build a selective laser sintering one
        because of clarity etc. So, I will be in need of a clear program which
        I can manipulate easily.
        Hope to work with you on that.

        Kaan Demirtas

        Sent from my iphone.
      • asmotaku
        ... Dear KD Of course I ll be happy to share thoughts and source code with you about this project. It s the very purpose of it s Open-Source nature, and anyone
        Message 3 of 8 , May 5, 2010
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          --- In diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com, Kaan Demirtas <kaandemirtas2@...> wrote:
          >
          > Dear Asmotaku,
          > Ä° would be very pleased to see some more working on .net. Please post
          > me as you start this project. I still did not start building my 3d
          > printer and I would rather build a selective laser sintering one
          > because of clarity etc. So, I will be in need of a clear program which
          > I can manipulate easily.
          > Hope to work with you on that.
          >
          > Kaan Demirtas
          >
          > Sent from my iphone.
          >

          Dear KD

          Of course I'll be happy to share thoughts and source code with you about this project. It's the very purpose of it's Open-Source nature, and anyone will be able to implent their plugins from the interfaces I'll offer, in either managed C++, C# or VB.Net btw.

          About your laser-sintering 3dp, I will extrapolate from it and bluntly say that you'll have to implepent a final output plugin dll for InkStacks to drive it.
          As laser focus & positioning control can be assimilated to an ordinary 3-axis CNC, I suppose you'll need a vector output from the program's geometry pipeline (on the opposite, inkjet 3DPs requires raster outputs).
          I'll have to consider this capability while implementing the framework. Maybe you'll just have to implement a plugin which will throw G-code out to your custom 3dp controller. We'll see about that.

          I have to get some work done on it, and for the time being, I'm in coding the .STL and .PLY parser.

          I still have to make a choice between DirectX and Xna... The latest offers a quick and easy solution, but it's hard to have it accept runtime mesh creation (if not nearly impossible). So DirectX 9 will probably be a good guess. (And no, I'll not use OpenGL, no can do sir.)


          Waiting for feedbacks while coding.
          Asmo.
        • vrsculptor@hotmail.com
          Kaan, I think the biggest problem for sintering is the material. There are numerous low cost 40 watt laser engravers that have everything needed except for the
          Message 4 of 8 , May 6, 2010
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            Kaan,
            I think the biggest problem for sintering is the material. There are numerous low cost 40 watt laser engravers that have everything needed except for the elevator and spreader. The included drivers let you engrave from JPEG's. The free Netfabb can slice STL into SVG and there are batch SVG to JPEG converters. The software required to print a directory of JPEG's is pretty trivial.

            As I said the real issue is finding a low cost source for the powdered material to sinter. Some RepRap people played with powder coating material and it was a fail. Powdered nylon looks like a good solution but is not available.

            Roger

            > > printer and I would rather build a selective laser sintering one
            > > because of clarity etc. So, I will be in need of a clear program which
            > > I can manipulate easily.
          • Kaan Demirtas
            Hi Roger, I am thinking about the material from the beginning as well. As this is the key element the correct material and supply must be secured. I will try
            Message 5 of 8 , May 7, 2010
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              Hi Roger,

              I am thinking about the material from the beginning as well. As this is the key element the correct material and supply must be secured. I will try some plaster dust which is used in dentistry and is bonded with an alcohol solution which will be easy to use with an inkjet. Another one is cement for different projects. Neither is tested yet as we have other projects currently at hand. But we will be building 3-4 types of 3d printers at the same time. Will keep you posted about the details. 
              Best regards 

              Kaan Demirtas
              Project Manager
              Karat Technology Solutions

              Sent from my iphone.

              On 07.May.2010, at 06:39, vrsculptor@... wrote:

               

              Kaan,
              I think the biggest problem for sintering is the material. There are numerous low cost 40 watt laser engravers that have everything needed except for the elevator and spreader. The included drivers let you engrave from JPEG's. The free Netfabb can slice STL into SVG and there are batch SVG to JPEG converters. The software required to print a directory of JPEG's is pretty trivial.

              As I said the real issue is finding a low cost source for the powdered material to sinter. Some RepRap people played with powder coating material and it was a fail. Powdered nylon looks like a good solution but is not available.

              Roger

              > > printer and I would rather build a selective laser sintering one
              > > because of clarity etc. So, I will be in need of a clear program which
              > > I can manipulate easily.

            • raiorz
              This sound very cool, do you thing about diverent solutions for automatic creations of inside structure matrixes? Differnt, because differnt 3d printing
              Message 6 of 8 , May 7, 2010
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                This sound very cool,

                do you thing about diverent solutions for automatic creations of inside
                structure matrixes? Differnt, because differnt 3d printing solutions
                need differnt matrixes (stl, 3dp, 3dp color), etc...).

                btw: here is my backgroud:

                In the meantime i build 3 3dprinter versions, the latest based on the
                same ink heads zcopr use. I also use original zcorp powder and binder,
                so the quality is like the original.

                I use Xp SP3 and write my pc software with the latest vb.net version.
                For 3D realtime graphic operations i use open GL.
                Till now i build my electronic hardware around ATMEGA + USB high speed
                interface (virtual com port, much more than only 115.000baud). For
                driving step motors i use the cheap and powerfull all in one chips
                SLA7062M or TB6560 (can drive up to 3,5Amp stepers without cooling and
                can direct connected to the ATMEGA ports) This hardwaredesign need only
                a few parts and can build on single side pcbs. i write my ATMEGA
                Software most with BASCOM software (but with some ASM code, for example
                in ISR). This hardware/software combination, i use for differnt
                solutions (3DP, mil, router, usw.)

                For 3dp i use till now hp inkjet hardware incl. printer-driver. But
                there are a big problem, because in this way it is impossible to print
                color 3dp objects, and it is not possible to increase ink volume in that
                way i need for 3dp so i must print more than one time each layer. To
                solve this problem i work on a fpga solution for direct controlling this
                ink heads. But my problem ist not fpga know how, but hp. I will only use
                this same ink heads like z corp use. For me, there is no other choice.
                But this ink heads (like all other new ink heads) have a build in chip
                and a unknow interface to drive the nozzles. So i need first a
                datalogger and much trial and error work to find out how to drive those
                heads.


                Rai

                --- In diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com, "asmotaku"
                <arnaljl@...> wrote:
                >
                > Hello everyone.
                >
                > As this groups doesn't take advantages of Yahoo groups polling system,
                I'm using
                > a simple post to make one (or two btw).
                >
                > Which of these OS are you (planning) using to control your 3d printer:
                >
                > * Windows XP SP2.
                > * Windows XP SP3 (latest release of XP).
                > * Vista / Windows Seven
                > * Other, not mentionned.
                >
                > Are you directly controlling the printing head of your 3dp, having
                it's
                > proprietary controller ripped off :
                >
                > * YES, I use ATMEL, MICROCHIP, FPGA or whatever, through a custom
                interface.
                > * NO, my printer is still partially/fully recognised by my OS, and I'm
                using it
                > as-is to print my slices.
                >
                >
                > Your answers will weight in the balance VS OpenGL/DirectX9/Xna for me
                to begin
                > an .Net Open Source implementation of a software I'm planning to call
                InkStacks,
                > which will ease the 3dp slicing/printing process for enthusiast 3dp
                rookies.
                > It'll be taking advandage of geometry transformation plugins (shell
                this,
                > chamfer that, erode this, dilate that, tell this to my custom
                interface now,
                > etc), processing settings files, and dynamic rendering/progress report
                in order
                > to process STL files and other open 3D files formats. I know our dears
                Afogassa
                > and Sid3622 already offered something similar, but not fully versatile
                yet (to
                > my taste anyway, no offense guys).
                >
                > So please, feel free to vote.
                >
                > By the way, If our moderator Joseph could open a poll on this, I'd be
                quite happy
                > about it.
                >
              • asmotaku
                ... Hi Rai ... You re the typical diy-er that the InkStacks project was first focused on. Importing vertex-colored models is no big deal, and with a bit of
                Message 7 of 8 , May 7, 2010
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                  --- In diy_3d_printing_and_fabrication@yahoogroups.com, "raiorz" <raiorz@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > This sound very cool,
                  >
                  > do you thing about diverent solutions for automatic creations of inside
                  > structure matrixes? Differnt, because differnt 3d printing solutions
                  > need differnt matrixes (stl, 3dp, 3dp color), etc...).
                  >
                  > btw: here is my backgroud:
                  >
                  > In the meantime i build 3 3dprinter versions, the latest based on the
                  > same ink heads zcopr use. I also use original zcorp powder and binder,
                  > so the quality is like the original.
                  >
                  > I use Xp SP3 and write my pc software with the latest vb.net version.
                  > For 3D realtime graphic operations i use open GL.
                  > Till now i build my electronic hardware around ATMEGA + USB high speed
                  > interface (virtual com port, much more than only 115.000baud). For
                  > driving step motors i use the cheap and powerfull all in one chips
                  > SLA7062M or TB6560 (can drive up to 3,5Amp stepers without cooling and
                  > can direct connected to the ATMEGA ports) This hardwaredesign need only
                  > a few parts and can build on single side pcbs. i write my ATMEGA
                  > Software most with BASCOM software (but with some ASM code, for example
                  > in ISR). This hardware/software combination, i use for differnt
                  > solutions (3DP, mil, router, usw.)
                  >
                  > For 3dp i use till now hp inkjet hardware incl. printer-driver. But
                  > there are a big problem, because in this way it is impossible to print
                  > color 3dp objects, and it is not possible to increase ink volume in that
                  > way i need for 3dp so i must print more than one time each layer. To
                  > solve this problem i work on a fpga solution for direct controlling this
                  > ink heads. But my problem ist not fpga know how, but hp. I will only use
                  > this same ink heads like z corp use. For me, there is no other choice.
                  > But this ink heads (like all other new ink heads) have a build in chip
                  > and a unknow interface to drive the nozzles. So i need first a
                  > datalogger and much trial and error work to find out how to drive those
                  > heads.
                  >
                  >
                  > Rai


                  Hi Rai ...

                  You're the typical diy-er that the InkStacks project was first focused on. Importing vertex-colored models is no big deal, and with a bit of shelling, the slices may be sent to a pristine HP inkjet device through Windows's printer manager. This was the very first emptiness I noticed in this worldwide d.i.y 3d printing community : one have to store slices as image files and batch them out to a printing commercial/custom device ... what a hassle !!!
                  So InkStacks came out of my tiny shrivelled brain... An automatic 3dp control software, capable of handling our hybrids 3d printers, which relies on custom carriage controls and commercial inkjet controls, with resume/pause/cleaning functionalities. Anything one may need could be implemented with a reliable plugin architecture.

                  You've got to admit that as long as I need a reliable software to control my hobbyist 3dp with, why wouldn't I distribute it freely, and invite others d.i.y-er to add their ingredients to the pot ?

                  There is more tricks usable to fool a HP printer than meets the eye -I said to myself-, so why reinventing the wheel by controlling the heads through an FPGA, loosing gamut, error dithering and color printing in the process ? And look : I just received my 5th CISS (continuous ink supply system) yesterday, for less than $20 ! (sometimes I just love China).

                  PS : You're right, all things considered, I should try to focus on OpenGL. I've finished implementing then STLImporter plugin, and I'm working on the plugin system implementation for the time being.
                  I'll let everyone know once the first release will be posted in the File section of this group.
                • kaan demirtas
                  Dear Roger, I will talk to my university for supplying powder metal as well as how we can produce powder plastic. I will let you know if I get a positive
                  Message 8 of 8 , May 11, 2010
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                    Dear Roger,

                    I will talk to my university for supplying powder metal as well as how we can produce powder plastic. I will let you know if I get a positive answer.

                    best regards
                    Kaan

                    On Fri, May 7, 2010 at 6:39 AM, <vrsculptor@...> wrote:
                     

                    Kaan,
                    I think the biggest problem for sintering is the material. There are numerous low cost 40 watt laser engravers that have everything needed except for the elevator and spreader. The included drivers let you engrave from JPEG's. The free Netfabb can slice STL into SVG and there are batch SVG to JPEG converters. The software required to print a directory of JPEG's is pretty trivial.

                    As I said the real issue is finding a low cost source for the powdered material to sinter. Some RepRap people played with powder coating material and it was a fail. Powdered nylon looks like a good solution but is not available.

                    Roger



                    > > printer and I would rather build a selective laser sintering one
                    > > because of clarity etc. So, I will be in need of a clear program which
                    > > I can manipulate easily.


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