[dsg] Ignorance (was Re: ï¿½Cetasikas' study corner 433- You ain't seen nothin' ye
- Dear Scott (Nina & Herman),
I think you were struggling over these lines before (#60934):
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "Scott Duncan"
> I took a look at the Cula Sunnata Sutta, and pulled a similarpassage
> from further on in the scripture:condition."
> "And there is just this non-emptiness, that connected with the six
> sensory spheres, dependent on this very body with life as
> A second translation of the same passage:
> "There is non-voidity on account of life and the body of six mental
> The Paali:
> "Atthi cevida.m asu~n~nata.m yadida.m imameva kaaya.m paticca
> salaayatanika.m jiivitapaccayeti"
S: and Boddhi's:
"There is present only this non-voidness, namely, that connected with
the six bases that are dependent on this body and conditioned by
S: Here, A.Sujin stressed that this apparent "asu~n~nata" refers to
wrong view, to NOT understanding dhammas as su~n~nata.
Does this clarify at last?
p.s I'm adding your notes here for easy reference:
>The Paali:"Atthi cevida.m asu~n~nata.m yadida.m imameva kaaya.m paticca
atthi: object; essence or value or profitablenss; to recognise the
nature of; to realise; to know; to understand.
vidanati=to make appear; to show
vi=two; duality or separation; prefix of separation and
expansion; asunder; "dis"
ida=in this here.
asu~n~nata.m: absence of voidness or emptiness.
yadida="as that;" which is this; viz; just this; in other
words; so to speak; just this; I mean.
imameva: so, even, just ("eva")
kaaya.m: to heap up; accumulate; an aggregate of a multiplicity of
elements(physical sense); seat of sensation, fundamental
organ of touch (psychological).
paticca: "paccaya" support; resting on; falling back on; requisite;
salayatanika.m: the six organs of sense and the six objects.
jiivitapaccayeti: jivita=that which is lived; individual life.
paccayeti=by means of; cause by; resting on.
Obviously I had difficulty with some of these (again, Paali experts,
Here's what I get:
"Recognising and knowing the essence in the absence of voidness or
emptiness, even this aggregate of a multiplicity of elements, this
seat of sensation, resting upon the six organs of sense and the six
objects, being conditioned by means of this life which is lived."
Given this utter butchery, the six organs of sense and the six objects
are meant, and, as you say, no real implication of a brain in any of
this.. The "kaaya" is "body" all right but a body described as an
"aggregate," an aggregate made up of "a multiplicity of elements."<
- Dear Sarah,
S: "Sounds right to me. Taking the elements for something, for atta is
miccha ditthi. As you later put it: 'If in this [one understands] the
object to be non-void....'"
Scott: Thank you, I appreciate the clarification. Later.