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[dsg] Ignorance (was Re: �Cetasikas' study corner 433- You ain't seen nothin'

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  • ken_aitch
    Hi Scott and Herman, ... H: Dhamma study is the mind studying itself, no props required. S: Dhamma study (pariyatti) is learning the Dhamma (read
    Message 1 of 46 , Jul 1 4:03 AM
      Hi Scott and Herman,

      ------------
      H: > > Dhamma study is the mind studying itself, no props required. > >

      S: > Dhamma study (pariyatti) is learning the Dhamma (read teachings).
      "Mind studying itself" is, loosely, practise or patipatti; and the
      penetrating of the Dhamma (pativedha) is the end.

      If by "mind" you mean "citta," I half understand your point. I don't
      follow the apparent self-reflexiveness: citta is the reality which
      experiences; objects are those which citta experiences. Does citta
      experience citta? I don't think so. Corrections welcome.
      -----------------

      That sounds right to me. The idea of a self-reflexive mind is one of
      the early hurdles a Dhamma student has to get over. When the
      Satipatthana Sutta, for example, says that a monk practising
      satipatthana knows citta with dosa as citta with dosa, a student can
      easily get the impression of an unwholesome citta reflecting
      wholesomely on itself. But citta cannot take itself as object, nor can
      it take one of its own cetasikas as object. Nor can an unwholesome
      citta ever have insight.

      However a citta or cetasika can become the object of a subsequent
      citta. When a monk knows 'citta with dosa' as 'citta with dosa' it is
      a closely following, wholesome, citta that does the knowing.

      Ken H
    • Scott Duncan
      Dear Sarah, S: Sounds right to me. Taking the elements for something, for atta is miccha ditthi. As you later put it: If in this [one understands] the object
      Message 46 of 46 , Nov 5, 2007
        Dear Sarah,

        S: "Sounds right to me. Taking the elements for something, for atta is
        miccha ditthi. As you later put it: 'If in this [one understands] the
        object to be non-void....'"

        Scott: Thank you, I appreciate the clarification. Later.

        Sincerely,

        Scott.
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